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View Full Version : ATM Mugging - Little Known Fact



JB
05-14-2012, 11:25 AM
http://thehackersparadise.smugmug.com/Other/Misc/i-8dXJBsF/0/L/atmmachine-L.jpg

ddec
05-14-2012, 11:26 AM
never heard of that before. Good to know, just hope you never have to use it.

CharlieMoy
05-14-2012, 11:27 AM
This is so fake...



http://www.hoax-slayer.com/reverse-pin-ATM.shtml (http://www.hoax-slayer.com/reverse-pin-ATM.shtml)


Back in 1994, Joseph Zingher from Chicago began developing ATM software that would
silently call police (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4086277/)
if a PIN was entered in reverse. Since then, Zingher has spent years trying to sell the idea to banks in the United States without success. Several US states have explored the idea, but it is yet to be implemented. In 2004, the US state of Illinois passed legislation requesting that banks install reverse-pin safety technology in their ATMs. However, banks were not legally required to do so, and displayed little interest in using the system. In 2009, another bill was put forward in Illinois that would make implementation of the safety PIN mandatory for banks in that state. According to
information published (http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/BillStatus.asp?DocNum=1355&GAID=10&DocTypeID=SB&LegID=42570&SessionID=76&SpecSess=&Session=&GA=96)
on the Illinois General Assembly website the bill was "Re-referred to Assignments" in March 2009.

Zingher and others continue to push for the implementation of reverse pin or similar consumer safety systems at ATMs. The concept is sound, and such technology may well increase ATM security, discourage forced withdrawal crime and possibly even save lives,
if it was widely used.

That said, many people have raised doubts about the effectiveness of such a system. Commentators have suggested that the system would fail if a customer's PIN was the same backwards as it was forwards, such as the number "4334" or if the PIN was four identical digits such as "8888". However, Zingher maintains that (http://www.zicubedatm.com/) customers with such PIN's would be protected using alternative methods such as the "Inside-OutPIN and the Plus-1PIN". Others have noted, that even if an ATM sent a silent alarm indicating that a robbery was in progress, the criminals would likely have well and truly fled the scene by the time police arrived. Some banking spokespeople have criticized the proposed system (http://www.pjstar.com/news/x1745367387/ATM-software-aimed-at-reversing-crime), suggesting that if it was made mandatory, criminals as well as customers would know about it and it would therefore do little to deter criminals. They have also suggested that a panicked victim of a violent ATM robbery might have trouble correctly entering a PIN in reverse and thereby risk further antagonizing the criminals when the ATM displayed an error message and no money was dispensed. Furthermore, they point out that people regularly make mistakes when entering their PIN's and this could lead to false alarms that would waste the time of police. However, Zingher scoffs at such concerns and maintains that his system would significantly increase customer safety and reduce ATM crime.

In an increasingly security conscious consumer market, it may not be too long before banks decide that such technology is financially viable or legislation forces them to act.

Until then however, forwarding this message is ill advised. Since it is extremely unlikely to work, the "advice" in this message could actually be dangerous. Forcing a victim to withdraw money from an ATM is a high-risk, violent crime. If a victim enters a reverse pin at an ATM that does not have the safety PIN system installed, he or she will receive an error message and no money will be dispensed. This delay could antagonize the criminal and increase the risk of violent retaliation.

Moreover, if banks were to install a safety PIN system, they would provide information to their customers explaining the new system and how to use it. The message claims that the system is seldom used because "people don't know it exists". However, it is absurd to suggest that a bank would go to the considerable expense of implementing a safety PIN system and then not bother to tell their customers about it.

The original version of the message (Example 1 above) mentioned a "broadcast" as the source of the information. This may refer to a September 2006 WOAI San Antonio News story on the subject. The video cited the case of a San Antonio man who was forced to withdraw money from several ATMs and explained the concept of reverse-pin technology as a means of countering such crimes. However, the story very clearly stated that such technology is not yet being used.

An updated version of the message (Example 2 above) strays even further from the truth. Like the earlier version, this later variant also falsely claims that all ATM's already have the reverse PIN technology implemented. However, it also makes the claim that, if a victim of ATM bandits did enter his or her PIN in reverse, the money would get stuck coming out while the machine secretly alerted police. To my knowledge, this stuck money "feature" has never been part of the Safety PIN proposal and it is very unlikely that it would be included in any working version of the system. In fact, such a feature could considerably heighten the danger to the victim. If the money did become stuck during the transaction, the robber would then suspect that the victim had entered the PIN in reverse thereby alerting police and may then take violent retaliatory action against the victim.

To reiterate, although such technology exists, and legislation in some jurisdictions may eventually force their banks to begin using it, the system is NOT currently in use. Entering your PIN in reverse at an ATM will NOT call police and will only result in an "incorrect PIN" error message. Thus, this email contains dangerous misinformation and it should not be forwarded. If and when banks begin to install reverse PIN technology at ATMs it is sure to be well publicized. If your own bank begins using such a system, it will almost certainly let you know about it directly.

TripleBogieTim
05-14-2012, 11:27 AM
WOW, that's cool if it really works....you would thing banks would promote this and as somebody that has been in law enforcement I cant believe I had never heard of it.

#Cookie
05-14-2012, 11:27 AM
My pin backwards is 621495.

It took me 30 seconds to figure it out backwards, not sure I could do that under pressure.

Kmac
05-14-2012, 11:28 AM
Who knew. I sure didnt but I do now and I'll be passing this info along.

JR
05-14-2012, 11:28 AM
6 digit pin? Wow, ours are only 4.

Hanks
05-14-2012, 11:29 AM
good to know....hope I could remember that under duress though

TripleBogieTim
05-14-2012, 11:31 AM
My pin backwards is 621495.

It took me 30 seconds to figure it out backwards, not sure I could do that under pressure.

Thanks for that....now when you get hammered this weekend at the outing the guys can lift your wallet and now have your pin number to use :alien:

XirAurelius
05-14-2012, 11:32 AM
This is false, I looked it up on Snopes: http://www.snopes.com/business/bank/pinalert.asp

wessmiller13
05-14-2012, 11:35 AM
What if your pin is the same both ways

Puttin4Bird
05-14-2012, 11:35 AM
That would be cool if this was real, I'd go try it just to see the cops come rushing up.

blugold
05-14-2012, 11:39 AM
I really want to see somebody randomly try this and have the cops show up.

TC
05-14-2012, 11:40 AM
I pull up to ATM's in my car. I feel bad for who tries to rob me.

mikedean441
05-14-2012, 11:42 AM
I pull up to ATM's in my car. I feel bad for who tries to rob me.


I drive my 01 Grandam to get cash out, that way potential robbers are pretty certain I dont have any cash in the bank (which I normally dont anyhow)

dtak84
05-14-2012, 11:44 AM
So this is fake? Might want to change the thread title to another name? :)

ddec
05-14-2012, 11:46 AM
What if your pin is the same both ways

just give up at that point

lefty
05-14-2012, 11:55 AM
So this is fake? Might want to change the thread title to another name? :)


apparently the little known fact is that this is fake, so the title is still good

yorkem
05-14-2012, 11:58 AM
Crap, mine is BOSCO...now I have to try and spell backwards.

couldbeu
05-14-2012, 02:08 PM
crap, mine is bosco...now i have to try and spell backwards.

haha!!! Best comment of the day!!!

JR
05-14-2012, 02:10 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATM_SafetyPIN_software

dhjkelly
05-14-2012, 02:18 PM
What happens if I put my THP password in backwards. Will the cops show up at my house........?

SharkHat
05-14-2012, 02:24 PM
I think that the main reason that this hasn't been picked up by the banks (or actually the ATM manufacturers) is because while it sounds like a great idea, it doesn't really offer any added protection. The cash is dispensed and the perpetrator is gone long before a Police response would likely arrive. Responding in minutes when seconds count.

This is in no way a criticism of Law Enforcement.

jmatt
05-14-2012, 02:26 PM
I wish this was true. I'd LOVE to ask people to enter 4321 and let the police weed out the defectives.

pjcedog
05-14-2012, 02:37 PM
I am one of a very small minority that never uses an ATM.

lefty
05-14-2012, 02:51 PM
I am one of a very small minority that never uses an ATM.

the other day, I actually used a teller because the ATM's had a line and the tellers were just standing there doing nothing

Damaikis
05-14-2012, 03:06 PM
So I'm guessing that this is not actually true? Too bad, it seems kind of awesome.

c_ault
05-14-2012, 03:11 PM
ATM? I can't remember the last time I used one. Most places look at you funny if you want to use cash.

HoosierGolfer
05-14-2012, 03:20 PM
Very nice JB! Thanks for sharing!

Spank818
05-14-2012, 07:49 PM
Haha urban legend! This is as funny as people saying personal identification number number.

RedlyneTheory
05-14-2012, 08:14 PM
Haha urban legend! This is as funny as people saying personal identification number number.

Haha, or United Missouri Bank Bank

http://wordsmith.org/awad/images/pleonasm-umb-bank_large.jpg

maddog
05-14-2012, 08:18 PM
Its fake. Confirmed.

Esox
05-14-2012, 09:54 PM
I live off the grid. Use a barter system for all my family's needs.

Kevin

Bullfrog
05-14-2012, 09:59 PM
http://thehackersparadise.smugmug.com/Other/Misc/i-8dXJBsF/0/L/atmmachine-L.jpg

I did not know this. Good to know. Nice it still gives cash not to alarm assailant.

CharlieMoy
05-15-2012, 01:11 AM
I cannot believe people are still responding as if this were fantastic without even looking at the 3rd post in this thread. LOL.

This takes skimming to a whole new level!

dtak84
05-15-2012, 01:34 AM
I cannot believe people are still responding as if this were fantastic without even looking at the 3rd post in this thread. LOL.

This takes skimming to a whole new level!

Seriously.

And does JB still think this is real? I saw that tweet referencing this thread haha...

sangoram
05-15-2012, 04:05 AM
What if your pin is the same both ways
My pin is palindromic. No wonder every time I hit the ATM, the cops show up... :-$