The Official 2014 NFL Thread

[ddec]

Michael Sam taking a physical with the Cowboys. Good fit or Jerry publicity?

I mean our defense is so bad we should be looking at everyone who got cut this past weekend.

 

[INgolfer]

My guess is the Cowboys pick him up for publicity. Jerry like publicity.

 

[PhillyV]

With the cowboys defense in the shape it's in, this move actually makes football sense. The kid can get to the qb and losing Ware creates that much more of a need for a player like Sam

 

[JB]

With the cowboys defense in the shape it's in, this move actually makes football sense. The kid can get to the qb and losing Ware creates that much more of a need for a player like Sam

Can he? He did so against non 1st string talent in exhibition games. If he could regularly, he would have found a place with the Rams, especially knowing the coach there.

 

[PhillyV]

He did it in college in the all mighty SEC. Almost half of his tackles his senior season were for a loss. He's a one trick pony. That pony just happens to be rushing the qb. That d line is very deep and Sam adds no value to special teams. The rams were the wrong fit from the beginning

 

[ddec]

Can he? He did so against non 1st string talent in exhibition games. If he could regularly, he would have found a place with the Rams, especially knowing the coach there.

I know you like to watch film. How much did you watch on him pre-draft and compare to what you have seen in the pre-season?

 

[JB]

He did it in college in the all mighty SEC. Almost half of his tackles his senior season were for a loss. He's a one trick pony. That pony just happens to be rushing the qb. That d line is very deep and Sam adds no value to special teams. The rams were the wrong fit from the beginning

Tim Tebow dominated the SEC too. Chris Leak won a National Championship. Remember Mark Ingram? How about Trent Richardson? There is a different level of game...

I know you like to watch film. How much did you watch on him pre-draft and compare to what you have seen in the pre-season?

None... I honestly thought he wouldnt get drafted...And this was before he came out. That changed nothing for me based purely on talent.

 

[ATLGolfer]

Could be both. I dont think he has the skill set right now to be a full time player at this level. But then again, the Cowboys defense is putrid.

I'd take him in ATL right now.

Send Bierman and his "celebrity" wife packing. That dude is old and recovering from injury. Sam would be an immediate upgrade on pass rush.

 

[INgolfer]

Tim Tebow dominated the SEC too. Chris Leak won a National Championship. Remember Mark Ingram? How about Trent Richardson? There is a different level of game...



None..

Whats wrong with T-Rich? Oh wait I forgot this is the NFL thread we aren't talking about him in college any more.

 

[PhillyV]

There's two sides to every players potential. You could have made the argument against any pro bowler. Calvin Johnson had inflated numbers because of his offense and the passing game being a surprise. Look at Steven Hill in the same offense with damn near the same numbers. It's just such a crap shoot with how players translate. And in the pre season the argument is always "he's not playing against anyone". Maybe. But you gotta start somewhere. Especially if your undrafted. Arian Foster tore it up against second and third team players in preseason and turned into one of the games best for a 3 year span.

 

[PhillyV]

I said undrafted and should have said 7th round pick in Sam's case. My bad

 

[JB]

There's two sides to every players potential. You could have made the argument against any pro bowler. Calvin Johnson had inflated numbers because of his offense and the passing game being a surprise. Look at Steven Hill in the same offense with damn near the same numbers. It's just such a crap shoot with how players translate. And in the pre season the argument is always "he's not playing against anyone". Maybe. But you gotta start somewhere. Especially if your undrafted. Arian Foster tore it up against second and third team players in preseason and turned into one of the games best for a 3 year span.

Its not a crapshoot. Its not even close to one. There is not a scout in the world that did not know Megatron was going to be the way he is. Just as there was not a scout out there that didnt know Andrew Luck would be. Its not about spinning numbers. Thats for the fans.

Arian Foster is a good example. He showed through games and training camp that he could make it despite being late/undrafted. Sam was the other way. And frankly outside of his coming out...Nobody would say a word. Here is a guy that came to camp, played good in 2-3 spots, missed about half a dozen others and in practice didnt wow. So he was let go.

He will get a shot again...And I hope he makes good on it, but right now, he misses far too many plays on the inside and becomes a liability at times. He can fix that...He is also getting pulled in 5 different directions.

 

[Nighthawk117a]

Just got an email saying that because I am a season ticket holder I get nfl rewind and nfl redzone (on the mobile app) for free. The NFL started a rewards program this year for season ticket holders which is nice. There are a few extra rewards but those were the two big ones. While I can DVR the games, its nice to have to option to watch all of the games.

As for the season itself, the vikes looked much better over last year. Granted it was the pre season but there is a level of excitement that hasn't been there the last few years and a lot of it has to do with the coaching staff.

 

[PhillyV]

Its not a crapshoot. Its not even close to one. There is not a scout in the world that did not know Megatron was going to be the way he is. Just as there was not a scout out there that didnt know Andrew Luck would be. Its not about spinning numbers. Thats for the fans.

Arian Foster is a good example. He showed through games and training camp that he could make it despite being late/undrafted. Sam was the other way. And frankly outside of his coming out...Nobody would say a word. Here is a guy that came to camp, played good in 2-3 spots, missed about half a dozen others and in practice didnt wow. So he was let go.

He will get a shot again...And I hope he makes good on it, but right now, he misses far too many plays on the inside and becomes a liability at times. He can fix that...He is also getting pulled in 5 different directions.

If it's not a crap shoot then how are there busts? Or do you feel those are the cases of owners falling in love with a guy and being wrong. Which I could see happening

 

[ATLGolfer]

Its not a crapshoot. Its not even close to one. There is not a scout in the world that did not know Megatron was going to be the way he is. Just as there was not a scout out there that didnt know Andrew Luck would be. Its not about spinning numbers. Thats for the fans.

Arian Foster is a good example. He showed through games and training camp that he could make it despite being late/undrafted. Sam was the other way. And frankly outside of his coming out...Nobody would say a word. Here is a guy that came to camp, played good in 2-3 spots, missed about half a dozen others and in practice didnt wow. So he was let go.

He will get a shot again...And I hope he makes good on it, but right now, he misses far too many plays on the inside and becomes a liability at times. He can fix that...He is also getting pulled in 5 different directions.

Absolutely. Spotting solid NFL talent is a science. Just yesterday I was thinking of Ryan Leaf and...





Seriously, though. I still remember pundits being split over whether the Colts should draft Manning or Leaf No.1.

I also recall people cheering Atlanta for trading to get Vick (when they ultimately traded the picks that nabbed Brees and LT -- UGH LOUD NOISES!!!)


Finally, I remember pundits questioning whether Atlanta should have taken Matt Ryan instead of Glen Dorsey (and taking a crappy QB from Michigan in round 2).


I think there definitely is an ability to attempt to project college talent to the NFL. There's a reason why so many CFB stars are not drafted.

But, there is an amount of sheer crapshoot to projecting NFL talent.

 

[blugold]

Its not a crapshoot. Its not even close to one. There is not a scout in the world that did not know Megatron was going to be the way he is. Just as there was not a scout out there that didnt know Andrew Luck would be. Its not about spinning numbers. Thats for the fans.

Arian Foster is a good example. He showed through games and training camp that he could make it despite being late/undrafted. Sam was the other way. And frankly outside of his coming out...Nobody would say a word. Here is a guy that came to camp, played good in 2-3 spots, missed about half a dozen others and in practice didnt wow. So he was let go.

He will get a shot again...And I hope he makes good on it, but right now, he misses far too many plays on the inside and becomes a liability at times. He can fix that...He is also getting pulled in 5 different directions.

NFL scouting always intrigues me. For some reason I can think of a bunch of guys that were supposed to be locks but fizzled.

 

[JB]

If it's not a crap shoot then how are there busts? Or do you feel those are the cases of owners falling in love with a guy and being wrong. Which I could see happening

I think its both. There will always be busts. Its hard to measure character. Its hard to measure work ethic. With the exception of the elite few, all players will have to change through work to play at this level. Then add in ego. Guys dominated something their entire lives and then realizing that they have to get better just to play.

That does not take away from what happens with scouting and the amount that is known about each player. To give you an idea, look through draft threads on THP. Then ask yourself how many posting actually saw any game film or games of any of the players they are discussing. Nobody is watching New Mexico vs Fresno. They are seeing the names that are researched by experts and scouts and then finding more info.

 

[JB]

Absolutely. Spotting solid NFL talent is a science. Just yesterday I was thinking of Ryan Leaf and...





Seriously, though. I still remember pundits being split over whether the Colts should draft Manning or Leaf No.1.

I also recall people cheering Atlanta for trading to get Vick (when they ultimately traded the picks that nabbed Brees and LT -- UGH LOUD NOISES!!!)


Finally, I remember pundits questioning whether Atlanta should have taken Matt Ryan instead of Glen Dorsey (and taking a crappy QB from Michigan in round 2).


I think there definitely is an ability to attempt to project college talent to the NFL. There's a reason why so many CFB stars are not drafted.

But, there is an amount of sheer crapshoot to projecting NFL talent.

And with those 6 examples, I can give you 500 that worked out exactly as planned. Media and fans point out the misses, but quickly forget every player that pans out. Its not a crapshoot. Thats a fans response to seeing a move that doesnt pan out instead of realizing the 50 that did.

 

[JB]

And Pundits are not scouts...

 

[PhillyV]

I guess my crapshoot comment was more directed towards how late he was taken

 

[Rhyno]

It's not like the Vikings had a terrible offense.

Their defense let them down, their offense is returning most of their starters.

Vikings could be good, depending on how good the secondary is, smith is back, so CB and SS is where I'm worried, along with MLB, but we haven't had a good MLB in ages.

 

[ATLGolfer]

And Pundits are not scouts...

Yeah, but the scouts are the ones who are constantly selecting guys like EJ Manuel in the first round of the draft.

Or maybe it's the GMs ignoring the scouts and selecting these guys anyway.


Heck, look at the Falcons' drafts since TD has been the GM. Several solid picks, lots more questionable ones. And he's been widely regarded as doing a good (dare I say great) job.


There are just too many cringe-worthy moments in draft hindsight analysis to support the notion that scouting is a science. More like educated guessing.

 

[JB]

Yeah, but the scouts are the ones who are constantly selecting guys like EJ Manuel in the first round of the draft.

Or maybe it's the GMs ignoring the scouts and selecting these guys anyway.


Heck, look at the Falcons' drafts since TD has been the GM. Several solid picks, lots more questionable ones. And he's been widely regarded as doing a good (dare I say great) job.


There are just too many cringe-worthy moments in draft hindsight analysis to support the notion that scouting is a science. More like educated guessing.

But didnt the fans say Tajh Boyd was going to be solid on Sundays?

 

[ATLGolfer]

But didnt the fans say Tajh Boyd was going to be solid on Sundays?

There's still time, Josh.

It's not like he just got cut from a team with no QBs. The Jets are deep at that position. Heh.

 

[PiratePenguin]

Seen on ESPN: Tim Tebow is owned in 1.3% of fantasy leagues right now. (Those owners did their research!)