- Admin
- #51
Im with you. That is why that testing that was posted seems off. If the handicaps were not checked, how do we know that these were low to mid players?
long baller observations
Im with you. That is why that testing that was posted seems off. If the handicaps were not checked, how do we know that these were low to mid players?
Schweitzer_07
Active member
I don't see how mid to low cappers can score that low (from scratch to +15 as you said) hitting 200 yard drives. A course around here that I play pretty regularly is about 7200 from the back tees, about 6900 from the tees I play. The first hole is a 440 yard par 4. You can't tell me someone can be a scratch golfer or anywhere close when it would take 2 and 1/2 tee shots to even reach the green in 3. I was Driver followed by 8 iron last time I played, and it was almost perfect distance wise for that. I am a lot like JB, I play the game to score, and having to hit 3, 4, or 5 irons onto nearly every green isn't exactly my idea of a good time.
bogey_russ
outside operations
- Thread starter
- #53
i say they need a university study(preferably with a good golf program) with all kinds of control groups and done over an acceptable period of time on several different types of courses... and it should be a blind (trick the golfer so they cant sandbag) study... and just take every stat imaginable... post it on the internet so that alot of these issues can be put to rest
TwoSolitudes
Swingin' for the fences
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It was an average- and I am not saying it, the writers who conducted the test are. So maybe some blasted it 250+, some sliced it, some hooked it, some had very short drives... who knows. It's not saying everyone hit it 212, just that after all 86 people had played both the holes that were used in the test, it averaged out to 212. It mentions there is a breakdown of all 86 shots in that article I think-might be interesting to look at that.
A 440 par 4 would definately be 3 shots for me! Driver, 7 iron maybe, then a niblck.
TwoSolitudes
Swingin' for the fences
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Agreed!
China Cat>Rider
Dazed & Cornfused
I am a short hitter. I am almost always the shortest off the tee. Which drives me crazy so I tend to obsess with gaining distance. which just makes me try to kill the ball and that never ends well. My friends 13 year old son was out driving me a few times this weekend which really gets me tweaked. I'm 5'9" 150 lbs. I have started coming to the conclusion that I will never be a big hitter because of my size. But then I am reading about Ricky Fowler in golf digest and he is hitting it 290 and is my size. So obviously it comes down to technique. Flexibility has a lot to do with it and I'm not getting any younger so that is something I am trying to work on. I feel that gaining distance would really lower my scores.
On a side note I am always amused how everyone seems to exaggerate their distances. The 2 guys I have played with lately constantly throw out numbers after hitting off the tee and are usually saying they hit it 260-280. I would subtract 50 yds from their total most times and thats being generous.
On a side note I am always amused how everyone seems to exaggerate their distances. The 2 guys I have played with lately constantly throw out numbers after hitting off the tee and are usually saying they hit it 260-280. I would subtract 50 yds from their total most times and thats being generous.
- Admin
- #57
That goes back to my question. I dont see it anywhere in the study that said the handicaps were verified. So they want to verify the distances of golfers taht they feel are exaggerating, yet dont want to verify the handicaps of the same golfers?
Observations from the demo day:
* There were a few that crushed the ball and hit it consistently on target
* Other than those above I did not see anyone flying the 250 marker
* There were more than a few that had swings far worse than mine
* There were short drivers that hit consistently to the same spot
* My drivers were slightly above the "mean" length wise but mine were left/right 25 yards from the target
What I've learned is that for the most part we are all a little insecure about our "game" and takes time to become secure in our "game". I may not be able to break 100, but I can join a foursome and play well enough to hold my own.
* There were a few that crushed the ball and hit it consistently on target
* Other than those above I did not see anyone flying the 250 marker
* There were more than a few that had swings far worse than mine
* There were short drivers that hit consistently to the same spot
* My drivers were slightly above the "mean" length wise but mine were left/right 25 yards from the target
What I've learned is that for the most part we are all a little insecure about our "game" and takes time to become secure in our "game". I may not be able to break 100, but I can join a foursome and play well enough to hold my own.
CharlieMoy
Well-known member
Not to be rude, or derogatory in any way, but I really think it depends on what youre saying when it comes to "holding your own". If you are a single, and you join up with three sub-eighty shooters, 9 times out of 10, people will grow frustrated with people making double after double after double. Its even worse when you make pars on some holes, because that means theres more than doubles coming your way.
If I am out with people, say at a THP outing, and I am prepared to play with all skill levels, that is a certain mindset that I have when I come to the course, and I will enjoy myself entirely. But when I come to the course to play competitively with my buddies, and a +100 shooter gets lumped in, it has tendency to ruin the flow of a round. Again, like I said, there is the 'just for fun' mindset, and the 'competitive' mindset, and some people cant switch between them, and some people can. Nothing is worse than people who can make consistent, solid contact with golf balls, being almost forced to play with people who cant. Theres two types of golfers in my opinion, 1-golfers with control, and 2-golfers without[we all have errant shots]. And if you arent prepared for the mindset of playing with the latter, than it can become a little frustrating.
China Cat>Rider
Dazed & Cornfused
good point about being able to play in a foursome and feel comfortable. I used to get really nervous about playing with other people I didn't know but most of the time they hit as many bad shots, sometimes more, than I do. I rather be short and straight then long and crooked.
bogey_russ
outside operations
- Thread starter
- #61
wow... ive played with guys that cant break a hundred and enjoyed playing with them... and ive played with guys that were much better than me and id never play with them again cuz they took an hour for every shot(plus they were rude)... that can be vice versa also...
if the hundred guy keeps pace of play... ill play with him 9 times outta 10 and is usually a pleasant experience
Smallville
#ICanHitADraw
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- Handicap
- In Flux
As long as you keep up it doesn't matter what you shoot. Tom Watson has said that a lot of his friends didn't break 100 but he liked playing with them because they didn't play slow.
People who shoot over 100 can play fast, ready golf just as your "better" players can take forever to play.
You ever notice how someone who starts a sentence with "Not to be ..." is usually excusing themselves ahead of time? Most of the time the point can be made without the disclaimer.
Completely understand, I wouldn't be too excited about being in the group either, but what would you rather have, <90 shooter giving you advice and talking up his game, making excuses, etc, or someone going about their game quietly, I know when I need to pick up on hole.
What would be your solution to the problem, I play mostly muni courses so there are few options when it comes to groupings.
CharlieMoy
Well-known member
Like I said, it depends on the mindset you go to the course with. Ive played with tons of people who shoot scores all over the map. Theres alot more to golf than just scoring, and I realize that.
CharlieMoy
Well-known member
I wouldnt advise you to do anything as long as you keep up and keep proper etiquette. Which it sounds like you do. It wasnt in any way a comment specifically towards you, but rather a post to hear others thoughts, aswell as to advise the 110+ shooters who may not know what they are doing.
CharlieMoy
Well-known member
Would love to hear some other thoughts on this...
- Staff
- #67
I played with a guy on Saturday that was probably about 5'8 and maybe 140lbs - 150lbs. He had a really quick driver swing and drove a few 275. He played the course completely different than I would even consider. It was pretty cool to see.
bogey_russ
outside operations
- Thread starter
- #68
id love to see that... hell id love to be that... lol
chilly
New member
I've been playing for a year now so I don't have a ton of experience, but I'm a member at a CC and play in another golf league so I've seen quite a few folks hit the ball.
1) I have yet to see a legit 300yd drive, playing with folks down to a 2hcp. I've seen some bombs, but never a level ground/no wind 300yd drive.
2) I've played with five guys who were legit 275yd drivers, and I can count myself in that category on good days. Not saying anyone AVERAGED that distance, but that more then half of the drives would get out to that distance. Myself and another guy were 6'0-6'1" and around 250lbs, torque in the torso created the swing speed, not a good golf swing. Other guys were all tall as well but lanky, up to 6'2" but around 170-190. Smooth swingers that created more lag and hit nice draws. They're much more consistent with the distance, created less spin as well. Longest guy was a legit 290 off the tee and was 6'1" maybe 170, and had the smoothest swing I've seen...sneaky long every time. It didn't look like he created that much clubhead speed though obviously he was, but biggest difference was he hit it flush every time and got a TON of rollout with a stock driver, good swings create less spin it seems.
3) I'd say average of everyone I've played with is around 220yds off the tee, but consider that I play with more "avid" golfers then the general public. Played with a 67yr old guy a few weeks ago that got it out there 255yds regularly, that was impressive.
4) I understand when folks say "distance doesn't matter"...but it definitely does. I understand it doesn't matter if a guy can't do anything else on the course, but a 270yd drive is an obvious advantage over a 220yd drive and I don't know anyone under a 10hcp that doesn't hit it at least 250 regularly off the tee. The best players I've seen were both part of the 275yd drive group.
1) I have yet to see a legit 300yd drive, playing with folks down to a 2hcp. I've seen some bombs, but never a level ground/no wind 300yd drive.
2) I've played with five guys who were legit 275yd drivers, and I can count myself in that category on good days. Not saying anyone AVERAGED that distance, but that more then half of the drives would get out to that distance. Myself and another guy were 6'0-6'1" and around 250lbs, torque in the torso created the swing speed, not a good golf swing. Other guys were all tall as well but lanky, up to 6'2" but around 170-190. Smooth swingers that created more lag and hit nice draws. They're much more consistent with the distance, created less spin as well. Longest guy was a legit 290 off the tee and was 6'1" maybe 170, and had the smoothest swing I've seen...sneaky long every time. It didn't look like he created that much clubhead speed though obviously he was, but biggest difference was he hit it flush every time and got a TON of rollout with a stock driver, good swings create less spin it seems.
3) I'd say average of everyone I've played with is around 220yds off the tee, but consider that I play with more "avid" golfers then the general public. Played with a 67yr old guy a few weeks ago that got it out there 255yds regularly, that was impressive.
4) I understand when folks say "distance doesn't matter"...but it definitely does. I understand it doesn't matter if a guy can't do anything else on the course, but a 270yd drive is an obvious advantage over a 220yd drive and I don't know anyone under a 10hcp that doesn't hit it at least 250 regularly off the tee. The best players I've seen were both part of the 275yd drive group.
China Cat>Rider
Dazed & Cornfused
it's seeing things like this that gives me hope...
Adam0304
Formerly War_Mongering
This conversation has always intrigued me because I am shorter 5'8 and 160 pounds of average athletic ability. When I got fitted for my irons, my driver ss was anywhere from 86-93. However, when I play my home course (assuming yard markers are accurate) I drive the ball 240-265. Also, on the high capper group debate..I would almost rather play with an average or below average golfer who enjoys the game, than a competitive type who has a temper for every errant shot. Lastly, I agree rate of play is important...but I have seen many terrible golfers keep pace, and many good golfers take entirely to much time.
China Cat>Rider
Dazed & Cornfused
since I am in the high-handicapper category I have never had anyone complain about my slow playing. If anything I tend to be much quicker than the "better" players. I do not spend 20 mins every hole searching for my lost $4 Pro V's after my 300 yd drive hooked into the woods...or eyeing up my 3 foot birdie putt for 5 mins...I just tend to grip it and rip it. Last week I played 18 in 2 1/2 hours...I don't have temper tantrums, slam or throw my clubs or yell profanities after every poor shot. If I can't find my ball after 30 secs of looking I move ahead. I'm just happy to be out on the course.
- Admin
- #75
Slow or fast play has little to do with skill level. I am a low handicap player and as many will attest to play absurdly fast. While other players I play with like a slower round.