Old Clubs

[Ole Gray]

with the fct though, say im on the range before my round and im just hooking the ball and having big draws (right handed) i switch it over to the R position and BAM instant fix for the day. Say im a straight ball hitter and cant draw the ball set it between L an N and look there is a draw i know you still have to hit it obviously but with new technology it makes life so much easier on the course with just simple 10 second adjustment than having to fight a hook all day because im playing and old driver. Now i know other people play other drivers than r9 but its just an example.

Heck with my old hook swing, I could put my R9 on right as far you could change it, add a 10 lb. mwt screw in the thing and still hook the hell out it.... It took some serious lessons to modify my swing. Equipment could not do it for me. In the older drivers I used to add weight (lead tape) to the toe, hoping it would change my hook into a smaller draw and nope.. Still hooking the freaking thing. So that's my 10 cents worth on tech stuff...

 

[TOAOST21]

hmmm just to point out everyone who has taken the poll has picked new technology, therefore i cant see how there was any fact behind most of the fact stated by the person who inspired this thread and just to point out i asked golf galaxy in Charlotte NC and they said they sell more R9 Supertri than almost any other companies driver. He also said they sell more r9's than both set of ping irons combined

 

[Ole Gray]

Technology has made clubs way easier to hit and obtain longer distances with more consistency than ever before. I have observed this personally in my own game after coming back from a 10 year hiatus and in my Dads game as he stopped playing when I did. This is very apparent with the newer drivers, irons too, but to me most noticeable in drivers. I have NEVER seen my Pops hit the ball as far as he does now off the tee with his newly acquired big stick. Technology has done WONDERS for his long game.

With that said, I going to take what most will think is a ridiculous stance when it comes to both FCT and TM. IMO it makes it way to easy for avg. Joe golfer to dick with his equipment thinking he is doing wonders for his game when actually, in the long run he is causing more damage to his game. Sure you can mess with things and you might get a positive short term result but for an average golfer it will lead to the creation and nurturing of bad swing habits.

coincidentally it also makes it much easier for TM to sell you one of the 11tybillion (yes its an exaggeration) new drivers they will come out with next year. (most of which are aimed at the same audience) You can now simply put your old shaft in a new head if you stick with the TM brand, it does not get any easier than that! I mean really how many drivers do you need to come out with in one year of play? Some how they get a rather large majority of people to buy one of each though...:confused2:

Personally (and this is just my own opinion, we all have one, and like ass holes most of them stink) I think the adjustment portion of FCT is a crock of **** when it comes to the avg golfer. Pros on the other hand, well they are pro's! They clearly have excellent consistency and great ball striking ability. For them I can see this as benefit when it comes to setting up to play a specific course.

Now I think FCT does have one large advantage, it makes it much easier for the avg golfer to find a shaft that fits his game and swing. That one feature can really change a golfers game for the long haul as shaft selection IMO is almost more important than the head.

As a person who is rather observant, I find it very interesting that a large margin of people against weezy in this thread are people who have bags containing a decent quantity of TM equipment. The same company who comes out with X amount of drivers per year (again most of which are focused on the same target audience).... Just an observation. :eyepoke::wink:



I will be traveling for work tomorrow so by the time I get to read this thread again I am sure it will be over 10 pages long, so go easy on me guys! lol

Now that's what I'm talking about. I tried turning that freaking head on the driver all kinds of ways. Moved weights, added weights, yada yada yada and it does not work for me. I am not a good enough golfer to be able to add weights, turn heads , and boom all of a sudden hit the ball a certain way. I just don't possess the talent to do that. Now you give me a really good knowledgeable swing coach, let him work with me. Then I take this to the range and work my arse off at what he instructed, and only then will I see a change. That's my take on the tech side of things.

P.S. BPipe --Man are you coming to the outing. You are funny as hell and smart too!

 

[bogey_russ]

the poll wasnt even a question...
i think it should have asked would you play the most modern brand new equipment over a brand new set of clubs they made 30 yrs ago...
everyone in their right mind would obviously pick a new club over a used club...
i can actually carry the ball 10-15yds farther with my old set of irons... but since they were/are pretty dinged/scuffed/beat up i went for a new set because...
wait for it...
they are shiny and new...
now i can whip out my old set(still have them for sentimental reasons) and still hit them farther... but my new(er) set are much more accurate(when im playing well) and they are prettier looking

all this has to add in the comfort factor also... some guys dont like hybrids and cant hit them... some guys wont give up their 2irons
i absolutely love the look of taylormade clubs but for some reason i cannot hit them to save my life... i wont force myself to buy them just for the looks...

anyways... thats my 2 cents... the question needs to be changed
brand new modern clubs
or brand new 30yr old clubs

 

[TOAOST21]

i understand where your coming from but it wasnt about the eye appeal of the club the whole argument started when Weezy made the comment that club tech hasn't progressed recently more importantly that iron tech hit a wall 30 years ago. and that there hasnt been any good new driver tech since the superquad. we brought up FCT like tech call it Str8 fit or what ever titleist and cobra choose to call it and im almost sure we will see callaway join the party by adding to the imix set up. then the comment was made that FCT tech clubs dont sell well and that they will probably be dumped by the next few years. i wasnt going shiny versus old and dinged up i was saying the new tech and materials and manufacturing techniques make modern clubs easier, see why most pros dont even play true blades anymore

 

[IcemanYVR]

my clubs aren't that new, but there's been enough advancement in the last 10 years, let alone the last 30 years.

Graphite shafts, metal (now Titanium) woods, the ball... I think most equipment manufactured in the last 5 years is pretty much the same, with some manufactures resorting to changing their graphics more than their clubs.

 

[weezy109]

my clubs aren't that new, but there's been enough advancement in the last 10 years, let alone the last 30 years.

Graphite shafts, metal (now Titanium) woods, the ball... I think most equipment manufactured in the last 5 years is pretty much the same, with some manufactures resorting to changing their graphics more than their clubs.

See this is EXACTLY what i said and got drilled for. Its an iron fellas there just isn't much you can do to it. The foam filled thing may be new tech but i doubt it will be some big revolution, however if it is then there will bee your big step since the 80's. But right now a blade is still a blade, that cut muscle deal was suppose to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and now its gone, And although companies now all have forgiving irons, they still aren't any better than eye 2's. Sure you can get different looks, grinds, etc, but the tech is the same. Move the weight low and to the perimeter.

 

[weezy109]

i understand where your coming from but it wasnt about the eye appeal of the club the whole argument started when Weezy made the comment that club tech hasn't progressed recently more importantly that iron tech hit a wall 30 years ago. and that there hasnt been any good new driver tech since the superquad. we brought up FCT like tech call it Str8 fit or what ever titleist and cobra choose to call it and im almost sure we will see callaway join the party by adding to the imix set up. then the comment was made that FCT tech clubs dont sell well and that they will probably be dumped by the next few years. i wasnt going shiny versus old and dinged up i was saying the new tech and materials and manufacturing techniques make modern clubs easier, see why most pros dont even play true blades anymore

Oh and for the record i really didn't ake the comment that they don't sell well overall, i said they aren't selling well at local shops according to the local guys. You keep putting words in my mouth. While fct may be new tech imo it isn't necessary at all, i.e. superfast. I do think the lightweight thing may take off and that would be the main reason tm will drop fct, if they do, because it will be tough to keep the weight down. Remember it isn't just the weight of the fct itself, the have to offset that weight, because its in the heel, with even more weight closer to the toe.

I'm very interested to see the adjustable shaft thing that adams is coming out with.

 

[Bridges]

my clubs aren't that new, but there's been enough advancement in the last 10 years, let alone the last 30 years.

Graphite shafts, metal (now Titanium) woods, the ball... I think most equipment manufactured in the last 5 years is pretty much the same, with some manufactures resorting to changing their graphics more than their clubs.

See this is EXACTLY what i said and got drilled for. Its an iron fellas there just isn't much you can do to it. The foam filled thing may be new tech but i doubt it will be some big revolution, however if it is then there will bee your big step since the 80's. But right now a blade is still a blade, that cut muscle deal was suppose to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and now its gone, And although companies now all have forgiving irons, they still aren't any better than eye 2's. Sure you can get different looks, grinds, etc, but the tech is the same. Move the weight low and to the perimeter.

that is NOT what you said! Iceman said there has been enough advancement in the last 10 years let alone 30 years. He also says i think in the last 5 years there isnt much of an advancement. Which YOU said was the last 30 years and 5-6 years for drivers! not 5 years for everything, 30 years!

Hey iceman has there been any technology difference from 1980 till now in irons?

 

[weezy109]

Yeh he said balls, graphite shafts and woods with the stipulation that drivers havent changed in 5 years, thats when the superquad came out. How is that not what I said?

 

[Bridges]

Oh and for the record i really didn't ake the comment that they don't sell well overall, i said they aren't selling well at local shops according to the local guys. You keep putting words in my mouth. While fct may be new tech imo it isn't necessary at all, i.e. superfast. I do think the lightweight thing may take off and that would be the main reason tm will drop fct, if they do, because it will be tough to keep the weight down. Remember it isn't just the weight of the fct itself, the have to offset that weight, because its in the heel, with even more weight closer to the toe.

I'm very interested to see the adjustable shaft thing that adams is coming out with.

Yet again you still do not have FACTS your just going off what people "say" or what you think they say.

Im sorry but for someone to say that there is not and technology gains in 30 years for irons is completely RIDICULOUS!
Check the poll buddy 46 people say new tech 0 for 30 year old tech. Numbers dont lie.

 

[Bridges]

Yeh he said balls, graphite shafts and woods with the stipulation that drivers havent changed in 5 years, thats when the superquad came out. How is that not what I said?

Do you chose only to reads part of his post or what? HE SAID AND I QUOTE AGAIN

my clubs aren't that new, but there's been enough advancement in the last 10 years, let alone the last 30 years.

Graphite shafts, metal (now Titanium) woods, the ball... I think most equipment manufactured in the last 5 years is pretty much the same, with some manufactures resorting to changing their graphics more than their clubs.

how in the world is what he said in that sentence exactly what you said? because you said there is no difference in irons from 30 years ago to now and he says there has been advancement in even the past 10 so nothing what you said at all!

 

[weezy109]

Yet again you still do not have FACTS your just going off what people "say" or what you think they say.

Im sorry but for someone to say that there is not and technology gains in 30 years for irons is completely RIDICULOUS!
Check the poll buddy 46 people say new tech 0 for 30 year old tech. Numbers dont lie.

You seem to be missing the point. Of course they want to play new irons, but the tech is the same, hasn't changed at all. I never said that 30 year old irons were better, just that they are just as good. The only significant change has been the lofts and shaft length. Shaft tech has come a long way, even in steel, but not irons.

 

[IcemanYVR]

that is NOT what you said! Iceman said there has been enough advancement in the last 10 years let alone 30 years. He also says i think in the last 5 years there isnt much of an advancement. Which YOU said was the last 30 years and 5-6 years for drivers! not 5 years for everything, 30 years!

Hey iceman has there been any technology difference from 1980 till now in irons?

blades, of which I play... not much... they've moved the weight lower a bit and used better grade steel? so the feel has improved and the ball flight is more consistant.

as for game improvement clubs... sure, like I said great improvements, especially in the last 10 years, but I don't think anything today is truly better than something made 5 years ago. I would love to see them compared on Iron Byron for offcenter and highface hits.

I go back to the average handicap... if the clubs of today are so great, how come the handicap of the average golfer hasn't fallen.

 

[weezy109]

Do you chose only to reads part of his post or what? HE SAID AND I QUOTE AGAIN

Man you are just taking the first part of what he said without reading the rest. He never mentioned irons at all. Their irons all you can really do to em is move weight around, what "tech" has come along? Badges lol?

 

[weezy109]

blades, of which I play... not much... they've moved the weight lower a bit and used better grade steel? so the feel has improved and the ball flight is more consistant.

as for game improvement clubs... sure, like I said great improvements, especially in the last 10 years, but I don't think anything today is truly better than something made 5 years ago. I would love to see them compared on Iron Byron for offcenter and highface hits.

I go back to the average handicap... if the clubs of today are so great, how come the handicap of the average golfer hasn't fallen.

Well basically this thing started because i said ping eye 2s used the same exact tech as they do now. The only reason they move weight lower imo is because the flight of the ball has changed, and no they still use carbon steel just like they used to. People tend to forget that eye 2s were around 30 years ago, they think of lil butterknife blades but they were there. My irons are basically the same as eye 2s they just have a better look to them.

 

[IcemanYVR]

Man you are just taking the first part of what he said without reading the rest. He never mentioned irons at all. Their irons all you can really do to em is move weight around, what "tech" has come along? Badges lol?

here is an example of the tech changing... I will use Callaway, becuase I feel not only were they one of the biggest innovators, but also one of the biggest offenders...

take the Big Bertha and X-14 irons with the undercut channel, that was huge, and really allowed them to move the weight lower and out to the perimeter. IMO, the biggest improvement since the Ping Eye 2 irons... now looking at their irons, they're all pretty much the same, just different packaging.

Take a Callaway 5 iron, it's almost the same loft as my 7 iron... that's not innovation, that's marketing.

 

[Bridges]

You seem to be missing the point. Of course they want to play new irons, but the tech is the same, hasn't changed at all. I never said that 30 year old irons were better, just that they are just as good. The only significant change has been the lofts and shaft length. Shaft tech has come a long way, even in steel, but not irons.

Man you are just taking the first part of what he said without reading the rest. He never mentioned irons at all. Their irons all you can really do to em is move weight around, what "tech" has come along? Badges lol?

You're a very confused and lost person. I think you just like arguing for the sake of it. How someone can say irons from 1980 are just as good as todays irons is beyond me and obviously dont know what they're talking about.

 

[weezy109]

IMO that still the same tech. A cavity is a cavity, it accomplished the same thing without infringing on Ping.

 

[Bridges]

weezy, so why dont you play 1980s or 1970s irons then?

 

[weezy109]

weezy, so why dont you play 1980s or 1970s irons then?

I do pretty much, like i said they feel and play similar, i like the looks of mine better, however i would jump at the chance to play copper eye 2's but they are damn expensive.

 

[Bridges]

I'm sorry but your just wrong, Tiger could take a set of mp 14s and destroy just the same as he does with his nikes, in fact that is what he used when he decimated the field i his first masters win. I could give you a set of ping eye 2s from 30 years ago and once fit to you then you would be just as good, sorry but its true. The only thing you could say is "better" about your irons is that you like the look better, which is cosmetic. Youd just have to play 4-pw instead of 5-gw cus the lofts were weak back then.

im sorry but its not true!

You seem to be set on only 1 set of irons to that you say are just as good as this years stuff? so is it just one set or all sets that are as good as this years irons?
If your theory were correct then everyone on tour would be playing ping eye 2s or other 1980s irons.

 

[Bridges]

I do pretty much, like i said they feel and play similar, i like the looks of mine better, however i would jump at the chance to play copper eye 2's but they are damn expensive.

so the I5's in your sig are pretty much 1980 irons?

 

[TOAOST21]

I'm sorry but your just wrong, Tiger could take a set of mp 14s and destroy just the same as he does with his nikes

Can i ask then why his old irons are in the garage and not the bag then? also you made the comment about not selling well. and i quote

I do actually like the fct but i don't think most people do so i really don't see them putting it out much longer.

i dont think that blade or forged blade irons can move THAT much BUT they can still move forward, also the foam thing as you so put it has caught on but the thing that makes new irons better is the weight placement and all of the MOI and COG research that goes into them


and finally

I could give you a set of ping eye 2s from 30 years ago and once fit to you then you would be just as good, sorry but its true.

NO YOU ARE WRONG I OWN A SET OF FITTED PING EYE 2'S I STILL DONT HAVE THEM IN THE BAG

 

[weezy109]

so the I5's in your sig are pretty much 1980 irons?

Yeah i mean look at em ping hasn't really changed the look of their irons ever with the exception of the s series. You could make the argument that wider soles is a newer tech i suppose and that would be true. The grinding they do now is pretty good but did you know the i5s have the same scooped out grind that the eye 2s had. The i wedge is basically an updated ping eye 2 with an identical grind etc.