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Johny Miller's Thoughts on the Young Guns

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This morning on The Golf Channel, Johny Miller said he thought the Young Guns had underperformed their potential because there is so much money on tour they can live their dreams without winning. He also said that since Jack and Tiger, players are overly focused on the Majors.

I don't think you get to that level without wanting to win and that the field is just way more competitive today than when Tiger came to age. What do you think?
 
I agree to a point with Johnny. Arnie once said he had to win just to eat and pay the light bill. Not true any longer. Some of these young guys are making millions up front. That kind of money buys them what they want and the need for winning has diminished for them.
 
I agree with Johnny to a point also. I think many of the young guns have underachieved to some degree. Look at Sergio, although no longer a young gun, his career on the PGA tour has been riddled with dissappointment. To the point where he took almost all of last year off! AK, DJ, Hunter Mahan have had some of the success that we all thought they would nut I don't think it's to the point we expected, same with Luke Donald IMO. Although he won this year I think a lot of people thought he would dominate here in the states. People are also still waiting on Rickie Fowler to win as well. I think he should have won last year and that laying up on a par five that was well within reach proved to be a bad move!

Just my thoughts on the young guns!
 
When I think of the younger generation, I think of Dustin Johnson and for god's sake, if you can almost miss your own tee time because you don't know it, it makes feel like he doesn't give a rip. So yeah...have to agree with Johnny there.
 
Miller is right i wouldn't mind coming in the top 25 each week thats some good cash . When Tiger was on his game i also think the players were ok with taking 2nd
 
I think the money is a very good reason. Of course they want to win, but at the same time they know they aren't going to go hungry as long as they make it to the weekend. That takes some of the killer instinct out of these players I think, the drive to have to win, not mearly want to.

For the most part, as long as you finish in the Top 30 each week your weekly take home will be greater than a lot of people make in a year.
 
I totally agree with Johnny on this one. Its only natural for the young guns to 'loosen' up the practice schedule a bit when you're financially secure. I do think it is still too early to write them off though. I hope one of them has a big year and wins 2-3x and forces the others to step their games up. These guys are all ultra competitive (they have to be to make it to this level), i hope seeing some other young gun start to run away with it will relight that competitive fire.

I also think Johnny takes way too much flack for this 'style' of analysis. Many critics bang on him for being too critical or being too straight forward; i welcome it. I think we have enough 'watered down' answers / insight as it is, we need more styles like he brings. Is he the best overall color guy? No, but at least he's different.
 
I guess I disagree. They couldn't have gotten to this level if it wasn't about winning. Sure money up front actually eliminates the NEED to win, but the DESIRE to win I can't imagine has gone anywhere. DJ missing his tee time is inexcusable but I don't see that not being a part of him thinking winning isn't a big deal to him. If he had blown up over the penalty at the PGA last year would that make him seem more passionate about winning? Of course, to some people thats an easy yes. But to me, I'm indifferent. I don't think he's built that way. Not to mention he is consistently in contention, he just hasn't put it all together yet all the time. Why would he be in contention if he didn't have the desire? How about Ricky and that Million Dollar challenge or whatever that he was in contention for in the last round of the season? He skipped another tournament to play for that alone. To some people they'd say thats proving Johny Millers point, but to me that proves mine. He wanted to WIN that money. It wasn't a sponsorship or endorsement deal.
 
I dont take into consideration whether or not they want to win because the point is they are not winning. So the bottom line would seem to be that they are underachieving. Whether or not its because of the amount of money on tour, Im not sure. I dont really think the field is more competative than when it was in Tiger's early years. The simple truth is none of these guys have the talent Tiger had/has and Im not sure we will see another Tiger Woods anytime soon.
 
Tiger certianly has tremendous talent, but he also changed golf from a game to an athletic sport. Because of the money, the PGA Tour now attracts a level of athletic talent that may have opted for another sport 20 years ago. When Tiger was 5 he was the only kid who could play like that. Today there are dozens of kids at that level. Tiger inspired a whole generation of kids that are now reaching the tour and the fields are deeper than ever. This is just a tougher group to dominate.
 
I agree with Miller. Once these guys make it past q school, they have it made. Many don't even know the rules well enough on their own without asking a rules official when they have an oddball shot. Once they get to the level that they are making the cuts they can earn millions as a tour player. Completely different story than the early days of the tour. I wonder how many guys would continue if they only paid the top ten? I'm guessing about 20.
 
Even looking at Harrington, who is currently #100 on the money earners list for '11 has won over 200K and he's played like pure crap. 200K for a fiscal quarter for poor performance? I could live with that.

That kind of payday definatley takes away the hunger
 
Part of me agrees with Miller's thoughts but then again, part of me doesn't. Sure they are making a ton of money right away on the PGA Tour but man most of these guys grew up going through the amateur ranks and they wouldn't have made it this far if they didn't have a competitive fire and a great desire to WIN. Now they come out here and the money they make allows them to focus on practice and working on becoming a better player, not if they are going to earn enough to pay the bills for next week's travel. I think it can go both ways myself.
 
I would be curious to see the stats for the top 25 players in 1995 vs. todays top 25.
 
RonInThornton said:
Even looking at Harrington, who is currently #100 on the money earners list for '11 has won over 200K and he's played like pure crap. 200K for a fiscal quarter for poor performance? I could live with that.

That kind of payday definatley takes away the hunger
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Totally agree with ya Ron. Many of these younger guys also need to remember where the game was 15-20 years ago. Before Tiger, pay days were nothing like what they are now. If you are a Tour Pro and win one tourney you're set for the year. So to say some don't have the hunger because of the money might be true. But there are guys out there who thrive on the competition alone and don't care about the $$$. I think the more established in the game you get you can go either two ways; you can either not worry about the money and strive to win because money isn't a major factor because you have enough or you have enough money and are fine with being mediocre and just getting your normal barley-above-the-cut paycheck.
 
I agree with Johnny.

I don't think anyone is saying that these guys don't want to win, or don't have the desire or competitive fire to win, it's just not as big of a letdown when they don't win.
 
I agree with Miller also.
And would somebody PLEASE find a new term for the young guys. Young guns = :bad:
 
Mardin said:
Totally agree with ya Ron. Many of these younger guys also need to remember where the game was 15-20 years ago. Before Tiger, pay days were nothing like what they are now. If you are a Tour Pro and win one tourney you're set for the year. So to say some don't have the hunger because of the money might be true. But there are guys out there who thrive on the competition alone and don't care about the $$$. I think the more established in the game you get you can go either two ways; you can either not worry about the money and strive to win because money isn't a major factor because you have enough or you have enough money and are fine with being mediocre and just getting your normal barley-above-the-cut paycheck.
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Granted, for a lot if not all it's about the competition, but it's a whole lot easier to compete when your belly is full and the mortage is paid and they're not turning off your water and power cause you can't pay the bills.
 
MarcW said:
I agree with Miller also.
And would somebody PLEASE find a new term for the young guys. Young guns = :bad:
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How does "SLACKERS" strike you? :confused2:
 
MarcW said:
I agree with Miller also.
And would somebody PLEASE find a new term for the young guys. Young guns = :bad:
Click to expand...

young turks?
 
MarcW said:
I agree with Miller also.
And would somebody PLEASE find a new term for the young guys. Young guns = :bad:
Click to expand...

Maybe young and overhyped?
 
Hole~Out~1983 said:
I dont take into consideration whether or not they want to win because the point is they are not winning. So the bottom line would seem to be that they are underachieving. Whether or not its because of the amount of money on tour, Im not sure. I dont really think the field is more competative than when it was in Tiger's early years. The simple truth is none of these guys have the talent Tiger had/has and Im not sure we will see another Tiger Woods anytime soon.
Click to expand...

I agree that these young guys if anything, are underachiever's. I have to wonder though if it is the money that leads to this complacency. There is no doubt that Tiger brought a huge increase to the paydays week in week out. I also think many of the young guys don't play enough, again because of the huge amounts of money they get for doing nothing more than looking good and endorsing equipment.

Same can be said of some of the vets. Look at Phil. He is making between $40m & $60m year after year and only playing a select number of events. I would be hard pressed today to travel back and forth and be gone from the wife & kids knowing $60m is still going to land in my bank account.
 
HoosierGolfer said:
I agree to a point with Johnny. Arnie once said he had to win just to eat and pay the light bill. Not true any longer. Some of these young guys are making millions up front. That kind of money buys them what they want and the need for winning has diminished for them.
Click to expand...

These young guns want to be the best. They want to win tournaments, win majors, and go down in the Hall of Fame. Even if they don't have to win to sustain a living, they aren't going to just settle with imperfection.
 
First I agree...I hate the term "young guns". Give me a break. That said, don't forget how much these guys are pulling down in endorsements. I disagree they don't want to win. You don't get to that level without having the competitive fires burning.
 
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