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There are obviously exceptions, such as the Z-Stars and.... perhaps the Diablo Forged? I was simply generalizing.
Mizuno JPX-800 Pros vs MP-53s
There are obviously exceptions, such as the Z-Stars and.... perhaps the Diablo Forged? I was simply generalizing.
Forged is a process but it is also a better process when struck correctly. You don't see many touring pro's play game improvement irons. Reason is when struck well they perform great spin trajectory angle into green but most of all the forge is a feel. You can feel the mishits and the good strikes giving one more feedback and confidence. Granted this isn't for everyone but they sure are nice when played well.
JB is right another big advantage is workability draw fade and flighting. Many of us can't do this well with our cavity backs and offset heads as we're essentially working against what the club is to do. Get ball up and draw. I'm play RAC lt's so trying to play a fade is very hard. I'm looking at getting clubs now and hopefully arrive this week. The r9 tp b's but looking at the razr x forge and jpx 800 pro's if r9's don't work out. Loved the razr's on range but already had r9's coming
opcorn:
Chunkylover77
Proud JakeNation Member
DF's are not a true forging I don't think.
Well, Ive demoed both sets and there is a pretty big difference. I can hit 800 Pros pretty well even when my swing isnt at its best. With the 53s you have to hit it pretty flush or else you wont play your best.
Theres a reason why the 800 Pros are, "game improvement" and the 53s are, "game enhancement".
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Ah. I knew they had a slightly different process. I am sure JB can clear it up. HEY JB, WAKE UP!!! YOUR KNOWLEDGE IS NEEDED!
It would be freaking hilarious if he had a text to word software on his computer that went rogue...
Chunkylover77
Proud JakeNation Member
I think the body is cast and the face is forged and then they are put together. I'm probably dead wrong though. However they are put together, they feel real nice. I love the DF's.
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I almost demoed some of the non-forged ones at GolfTec, but they were just too damned ugly, man. I couldn't look at them. They look like something a teenager would use.... wait a second....
Chunkylover77
Proud JakeNation Member
Lol they are not the prettiest I will say that.
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It looks a lot like someone vomited spaghetti into the cavity, in my humble, infallible opinion.
JNRadio
Banned
and a reason why the 800's are Super GI, or would the 800's be way, way, waaaaaaaaay, waaaaaaaaaaay easier to hit than the 53's?:alien2:
wburdett
Member
Lets take that a step further then why does 80% of the tour play forged irons? I'm not saying one is better than the other but you've been quick to dismiss forge as just a process and no difference in clubs and I just don't think that's the case. I play a cast club but feedback is harsh and feels is non existent after comparing to forge clubs. Forging process with technology has changed the game as many pro's were playing cast 6-10yrs ago but now with forge process improving to allow weight transfer in club for forgiveness this is now the best of both worlds.
So why does 80% of the pga tour play forge vs cast now? Surely isn't marketing as forge is the overwhelming club underdog when it comes to sales.
I'm probably not good enough to consistently take advantage of a forged club even the forging cavities like MC, razr x etc. I will say this when I strike my cavity perfect and then razr x perfect world of difference in distance trajectory spin and feedback.
wburdett
Member
I'd like to try those jpx 800 pro's outside they seem very nice least hitting into a net. A little less feedback as toe balls feel harsh but still seem to come off club well. Curious to see how they'll compare to razr x forge
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- #38
I dont know where you got your numbers from, but they are not even close to correct, I would love to see the stats though.
You keep looking at this as Forged is a type of iron. Its NOT! Forged is simply a process to create the iron. You can make cast irons in any possible shape one would want. Forging a club is the way the iron is created....NOT a type of iron. I strongly urge you to do some research on the subject on casting and forging. I will never say one is better than the other, because that is an opinion and I dont have one, but to say that a forged iron is a type of club and NOT how a club is made is absolutely ridiculous.
Until someone truly understands what it is they are debating, it is not worth really having the debate. I truly hope that research is done, because in the end, knowledge is power and a more informed consumer can understand their purchases better.
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GrantD
Formerly Known as DMB012
I hit these at the Outing and they are serious. I loved the way they felt. Clean and smooth. Great shots with those irons.
wburdett
Member
I think my first comment was forge is a process its not a type of club so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Cast is made from a mold and forge is a solid piece of metal so where is the confusion? Well JB I'm just going off what I read from Golf digest where I will stake as more of expert than any of us as they have done the research.
This is a good quote from probably the best forge artist in the world:
And what about the science? Katsuhiro Miura gave Golf Digest a telling analogy in 2007 when he described the difference between casting and forging. "It's like if you have two glass jars," he said. "One is filled with marbles and the other is filled with sand. There are a lot of voids in the jar filled with marbles, but not with the jar of sand. The jar of sand is a forged iron.
Also here is the facts that 80% of the tour is using forged clubs yes some are blades and some cavity back as those are types of clubs but still using a forged process.
Here is the article from Golf digest so do read as this was just two weeks ago so I'd call it current. You're clearly passionate about this but this clearly tells the story I'm referring too so hopefully you will agree.
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-tours-news/2011-05/golf-johnson-equipment-0502
This is a good quote from probably the best forge artist in the world:
And what about the science? Katsuhiro Miura gave Golf Digest a telling analogy in 2007 when he described the difference between casting and forging. "It's like if you have two glass jars," he said. "One is filled with marbles and the other is filled with sand. There are a lot of voids in the jar filled with marbles, but not with the jar of sand. The jar of sand is a forged iron.
Also here is the facts that 80% of the tour is using forged clubs yes some are blades and some cavity back as those are types of clubs but still using a forged process.
Here is the article from Golf digest so do read as this was just two weeks ago so I'd call it current. You're clearly passionate about this but this clearly tells the story I'm referring too so hopefully you will agree.
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-tours-news/2011-05/golf-johnson-equipment-0502
Howzat
I'd Rather Be At The Hideaway
I own both the MP 53's and the 800 pros. In the end I do not see the value of the 800 pros. I think the 53's are fairly forgiving and I don't see a lot of difference in my game between the 53’s and the 800 pros other than the 800 pros don’t lose as much distance on the occasional toe hit. I think the 53’s cut through the turf nicer and are a lot better to look at. My sets are matched as far as loft and distance has been similar. The “hot metal” technology on the non forged 800’s make that a superior option to the 800 pros in my opinion and that would be the option of you are looking for distance and forgiveness.
wburdett
Member
How'd you compare to your r9's I've heard these are pretty long too but curious if you felt like you could work ball too. They have some offset I read but not nearly what others have.
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Couple of things.
1. Please dont discount others knowledge like that.
2. All the metal starts off the same. If you believe there are giant chunks of steel found and forged than this really is different.
3. Where in that article does Mr. Miura talk about a forged club being workable or more performance based? Im trying to find it.
Your quote. And I will say it again. forging an iron is NOTHING more than how the iron is made!
Design not method of manufacture determines how easy/hard an iron is to hit. A forged cavity back might be a lot offer far less feedback, workability, and performance as a cast blade!
GrantD
Formerly Known as DMB012
The contact feeling was similar, but I did feel like I could work the ball more. I love my R9's, but have to work hard to move the ball. I have been looking to find a club that is easier to work the ball. I think these compare to the TM MC irons a lot.
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wburdett
Member
oh very interesting on MC comparison. I did like the look of those a lot more than these as top line thick imo. Have you tried razr x forge?
I was thinking pro's longer than mc's from discussions. love to get my hands on them outside. What an amazing year for clubs with so many great forge options and driver technology!
I was thinking pro's longer than mc's from discussions. love to get my hands on them outside. What an amazing year for clubs with so many great forge options and driver technology!
GrantD
Formerly Known as DMB012
I did hit the razr x tours and they compared very similar too. I didn't notice much of a distance loss, but I was on a range. It is hard to tell a little bit of distance loss out there.
GrantD
Formerly Known as DMB012
Butters
New member
I have the 800 Pros and love them. I went from the x-22, to burner 2.0, to these. My have actually gotten more consistent with these