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Rule for when this happens?

sal14m

sal14m

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Hit my ball into a bunker, playing partner hits his ball into the same bunker and ball comes to rest touching my ball.
What is the best way to proceed here?
For the record I lifted his ball played mine, raked bunker, and had him drop into bunker in same spot.... Not sure if that was right but it felt like the fairest way to go
 
sal14m said:
Hit my ball into a bunker, playing partner hits his ball into the same bunker and ball comes to rest touching my ball.
What is the best way to proceed here?
For the record I lifted his ball played mine, raked bunker, and had him drop into bunker in same spot.... Not sure if that was right but it felt like the fairest way to go
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this is interesting.. Not sure on this one myself..
 
I'm not a rules expert but here is my guess. The player hitting second should mark their ball, lift, adjust mark out of first players way by lining up on memorable target, first player hits shot, rake bunker, second player adjusts mark back to original spot, second player places ball recreating original lie as closely as possible.
 
cpljohnst said:
I'm not a rules expert but here is my guess. The player hitting second should mark their ball, lift, adjust mark out of first players way by lining up on memorable target, first player hits shot, rake bunker, second player adjusts mark back to original spot, second player places ball recreating original lie as closely as possible.
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I agree with this. You don't have/get to drop the ball but rather attempt to replace the ball in exact same spot without cleaning the ball, etc.
 
cpljohnst said:
I'm not a rules expert but here is my guess. The player hitting second should mark their ball, lift, adjust mark out of first players way by lining up on memorable target, first player hits shot, rake bunker, second player adjusts mark back to original spot, second player places ball recreating original lie as closely as possible.
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I am like cookie and cpljohnst, I would think you must recreate the original lie as closely as possible.
 
I had this happen in a college tourney. I did not know what to do and my playing partner acted like he knew the rules pretty good and he did the same thing you did. I marked my ball because it was bit further by like an 1/8th of an inch and he played his shot. We then raked the bunker and I put my ball back down and played. We did take my driver out and after I marked my ball I then put the driver down and moved the mark to the other side of the grip so when he hit the ball he would not hit and move my marker. Not sure if it was done right but we both agreed to it and that was good enough for me.
 
sal14m said:
Hit my ball into a bunker, playing partner hits his ball into the same bunker and ball comes to rest touching my ball.
What is the best way to proceed here?
For the record I lifted his ball played mine, raked bunker, and had him drop into bunker in same spot.... Not sure if that was right but it felt like the fairest way to go
Click to expand...

Should have placed the ball, not dropped, and the position must be marked before lifting. If the mark is still interfering, then it may be moved one or more clubheads just like on the green.

22-2. Ball Interfering With Play

Except when a ball is in motion, if a player considers that another ball might interfere with his play, he may have it lifted.
A ball lifted under this Rule must be replaced (see Rule 20-3). The ball must not be cleaned, unless it lies on the putting green (see Rule 21).
In stroke play, a player required to lift his ball may play first rather than lift the ball.
Note 1: Except on the putting green, a player may not lift his ball solely because he considers that it might interfere with the play of another player. If a player lifts his ball without being asked to do so, he incurs a penalty of one stroke for a breach of Rule 18-2a, but there is no additional penalty under Rule 22.
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And from Rule 20-3b:

(iii) in a bunker, the original lie must be re-created as nearly as possible and the ball must be placed in that lie.
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And:

[h=3]20-1. Lifting And Marking[/h]A ball to be lifted under the Rules may be lifted by the player, his partner or another person authorized by the player. In any such case, the player is responsible for any breach of the Rules.
The position of the ball must be marked before it is lifted under a Rule that requires it to be replaced. If it is not marked, the player incurs a penalty of one stroke and the ball must be replaced. If it is not replaced, the player incurs the general penalty for breach of this Rule but there is no additional penalty under Rule 20-1.
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Note also:

Note: The position of a ball to be lifted should be marked by placing a ball-marker, a small coin or other similar object immediately behind the ball. If the ball-marker interferes with the play, stance or stroke of another player, it should be placed one or more clubhead-lengths to one side.
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Very interesting. I like reading about these types of rulings.
 
Interesting that you have to be asked to mark. So what happens if the other player doesn't ask you to mark then strikes your ball? Is it different if the other player doesn't strike your ball but causes it to move? Does he incur a penalty in either of those situations? Do you get to rake before placing it back to its original spot (assuming you have to do that)?
 
DawgDaddy said:
I am like cookie and cpljohnst, I would think you must recreate the original lie as closely as possible.
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I think the guys are right. Must be a really well placed bunker!


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Ball should be lifted marked and replaced - re-creating your original lie as per Rule 20-3/b/iii. (sitting on top, buried, fried egg) Decision 13 - 4/19 allows you, in equity, to return the bunker to the condition it was in before your competitor played his stroke.

Also see Rule 1 - 4 "if any point in dispute is not covered by the Rules, the decision should be made in equity".
 
This happened to a group of mine a few weeks a go and it's good to see we did the right thing.
 
tequila4kapp said:
Interesting that you have to be asked to mark. So what happens if the other player doesn't ask you to mark then strikes your ball? Is it different if the other player doesn't strike your ball but causes it to move? Does he incur a penalty in either of those situations? Do you get to rake before placing it back to its original spot (assuming you have to do that)?
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Rule 18-3/b If other than during a search for a players ball an opponent, his caddie or equipment move the ball, touches it purposely or causes it to move except as otherwise provided in the rules, the opponent incurs a penalty of one stroke. If the ball is moved it must be replaced.

I would think that in equity you would be allowed to recreate the original lie if the original lie was altered.
 
Tedfroop said:
Rule 18-3/b If other than during a search for a players ball an opponent, his caddie or equipment move the ball, touches it purposely or causes it to move except as otherwise provided in the rules, the opponent incurs a penalty of one stroke. If the ball is moved it must be replaced.

I would think that in equity you would be allowed to recreate the original lie if the original lie was altered.
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The rule you quoted only applies to match play (opponent). In stroke play (fellow competitor) it reads:

[h=3]18-4. By Fellow-Competitor, Caddie Or Equipment In Stroke Play[/h]
If a fellow-competitor, his caddie or his equipmentmoves the player’s ball, touches it or causes it to move, there is no penalty. If the ball is moved, it must be replaced.
Click to expand...
 
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