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This shaft choice thing is driving me mad...

Nippon Shafts
chicogolf

chicogolf

This game's fun GDit
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(sorry, this may be longish)..

Ok, I'm trying to get a shaft chosen to use with one of 2 heads: Mizuno EZ Forged or Titleist AP1. I haven't fully committed on the head yet, so, I suppose that's a different discussion. Clubs will be standard length, 0.5* upright.

But this shaft choosing is crazy-making. First, since I haven't purchased clubs in like 12 + years, I really don't know how the shaft is supposed to "feel". I also couldn't figure out a search term to find similar threads.

My swing coach did my fitting with a Mizuno cart. Shaft optimizer said DG s300, project x 6.0, or a KBS that i can't remember. Swing speed 90-92mph. 4's and 5's with the other numbers.

I first hit the project X 6.0 and it felt like a 2x4. Couldn't get it to kick at all.

S300 was much better, but, since I play old Tour Edge irons with a TT R flex, they are much stiffer than I'm used to. Swing coach wants to lower my ball flight and liked the trajectory the s300 gave. I hit a KBS shaft that I didn't like and then we ran out of time.

He's gone for the weekend and told me to just go by and hit some on my own, if wanted. I ended up hitting the px 5.5 and the s300 xp (dynalite? basically, a lighter version of the s300) as well as the r300. I ended up liking each, but, in the end, how the hell is it supposed to "feel"? How much "whip" or "kick" am I supposed to be getting? Basically, the max I can control?

Right now, leaning s300 XP, but, man..I really have no idea. I'll hit with him next week.

Thoughts? Ramblings of an ignoramus?
 
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You'll drive yourself nuts thinking about it. Wait until you go back and see him and try as many options as possible and check the numbers on a launch monitor. It doesn't matter how a shaft "should" feel to you, it matters if it feels good and whether or not you could live with it on days you aren't swinging great .
 
PX 6.0 Flighted.

Trust the optimizer.
 
SaffaClint said:
You'll drive yourself nuts thinking about it. Wait until you go back and see him and try as many options as possible and check the numbers on a launch monitor. It doesn't matter how a shaft "should" feel to you, it matters if it feels good and whether or not you could live with it on days you aren't swinging great .
Click to expand...

I don't think this little muni pro shop has a launch monitor. I'll ask, though.

"feels good"...my old swing felt fine until somebody told me it was all screwed up...and the new one 'feels' better. So, it seems the amount of "kick" is just user preference?

the px 6.0 felt like swinging a board. I couldn't make it kick hardly at all. I'll swing it again next week, though..

there are 2 pros at this shop: the GM who is about 50 and my current coach who is about 32. The guy has an amazing swing and, basically, if he had any short game, he probably would have ended up on tour (likes lots of guys, I suppose). Anyway, GM likes to put people like me (40's, not getting any stronger) in R shafts. Coach maybe likes the stiff shafts for reasons other than practical (e.g. 'ego'?). He, of course, swings an extra stiff, etc.

Again, the hell if I know...
 
Just went through something similar at a recent fitting.

For me it came down to picking something that wasn't "loose"/"flippy" just after impact and gave me the right #'s. dispersion was a big big factor I wanted as tight as possible with out loosing distance. On miss hits(toe) I wanted something that didn't feel like the head wasn't twisting open.

If you can get outside on the range and see the ball flight and dispersion. Hit one ball at a target you know you can't reach then aim the rest of your shots at that first ball and see how tight the distance and side to side dispersion are.

Watch the ball flight for height, decent angle is it what you want to see, how does the ball react when it hits the turf is it what you want.
 
played about 11 holes in the cold; guy in the shop did up a EZ forged with a project x 5.5 and let me take it out. Hit in on several holes. I didn't have the best swing going today, but I think I liked that 5.5 a bit. That would be stronger than a r300, right? Little more flex than the s300, but less than, say the s300 XP 105?

edit: some searching is saying that the s300 is about a 5.8 in px. That may explain why I liked the 5.5 more than the s300...

so, I will probably do 1 more session hitting these shafts

px 5.5 and 6.0
s300
s300 xp 105

Funny: the guy in the shop and I were chatting and he ran to his car where we hit is px 7.0's off the first tee (nobody there today). Holy crap, that thing was a board. Amazing that anybody other than burly folk can hit that...
 
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vw_tdi said:
(sorry, this may be longish)..
Mizuno EZ Forged or Titleist AP1. I haven't fully committed on the head yet, so, I suppose that's a different discussion. Clubs will be standard length, 0.5* upright.
Click to expand...

I am kind of in the same position as you. Looking for new irons and trying to figure out what I like. Have hit a bunch of clubs indoors and none of them feel "bad". One thing I have noticed while looking is that not all clubs are the same spec. You mention that you are looking at "standard length" and .5* upright. The EX are .25" short in length and about 1-1.5* flatter for each iron.

Good luck in your search hope you find what you are looking for.
 
cnosil said:
I am kind of in the same position as you. Looking for new irons and trying to figure out what I like. Have hit a bunch of clubs indoors and none of them feel "bad". One thing I have noticed while looking is that not all clubs are the same spec. You mention that you are looking at "standard length" and .5* upright. The EX are .25" short in length and about 1-1.5* flatter for each iron.

Good luck in your search hope you find what you are looking for.
Click to expand...

oh, boy. Well, the mizuno cart had that one head that we used to figure out the 0.5* upright...since the irons themselves might be more flat, is it best to concentrate on the shaft then, order up, and then have them bent as needed?

Is the AP1 more flat/upright off the shelf?

re: length...by EX you mean EZ, right? Is that referring to the 'stock' shaft or that any shaft will be .25 shorter on each iron? Jeebus..the cart just had std, .25 over, etc.

I really like my swing coach, but I'm wondering if I'm just dealing with a pro shop that doesn't have all the high-tech fitting stuff needed?

blugold / oregon jack: can you explain why you think I should be totally trusting the optimizer? is that personal experience or collective?
 
vw_tdi said:
blugold / oregon jack: can you explain why you think I should be totally trusting the optimizer? is that personal experience or collective?
Click to expand...

The optimizer tends to be pretty accurate. No reason not to be critical of the results, however.
 
vw_tdi said:
played about 11 holes in the cold; guy in the shop did up a EZ forged with a project x 5.5 and let me take it out. Hit in on several holes. I didn't have the best swing going today, but I think I liked that 5.5 a bit. That would be stronger than a r300, right? Little more flex than the s300, but less than, say the s300 XP 105?

edit: some searching is saying that the s300 is about a 5.8 in px. That may explain why I liked the 5.5 more than the s300...

so, I will probably do 1 more session hitting these shafts

px 5.5 and 6.0
s300
s300 xp 105

Funny: the guy in the shop and I were chatting and he ran to his car where we hit is px 7.0's off the first tee (nobody there today). Holy crap, that thing was a board. Amazing that anybody other than burly folk can hit that...
Click to expand...

Use the Optimizer as your guide and then pick that shaft that feels the best to you
 
thanks. My reading is beginning to confirm that, perhaps, I should be fitted with not just the cart but with the use of a launch monitor as well. I may have to pay for a fitting at another location then purchase from my local club.

I assume one shouldn't rely on the good pro's opinion on the trajectory, etc. alone? :)
 
My experience is that good pros usually can assess trajectory, etc. without a launch monitor (just much easier if you have one and lots of clubs to demo). I agree with those suggesting to err on the side of feel as an iron that "feels" either too loose or too stiff can lead to swing problems.


vw_tdi said:
thanks. My reading is beginning to confirm that, perhaps, I should be fitted with not just the cart but with the use of a launch monitor as well. I may have to pay for a fitting at another location then purchase from my local club.

I assume one shouldn't rely on the good pro's opinion on the trajectory, etc. alone? :)
Click to expand...
 
blugold said:
The optimizer tends to be pretty accurate. No reason not to be critical of the results, however.
Click to expand...
This is very true. However, as Brian stated, you can use this as a starting point and work from there. Every time I've used the optimizer it tells me I need a 120g soft stepped x-stiff. The first time I went with the recommended option my hands about fell off from the shaft being too stiff and heavy. Now I will see what is recommended and either go down one flex or find something comparable to the recommended.

Shaft selection can be nerve racking if it's your first go around. But once you find a shaft that works, you've always got a starting point for your next set. Also, it never hurts to ask people here what they think about the shaft their using. This is what I did and blugold helped me out quite a bit.

You might want to try the PXi 5.5, the C-Taper Lite, or the new KBS Tour V shafts. They are all considered "light weight" (about 110g) and promote a mid trajectory. The C-Tapers get a bit higher, but it's still a nice penetrating flight. If you're willing to shell out the big bucks, you can't go wrong with Nippons.
 
I really appreciate the information and feedback. Your experience with the 120g shaft is similar to mine. Felt like a log.

I will use the optimizer as the starting point and re-hit in a fashion similar to getting one's eyes checked. Hit shaft 1, then shaft 2. Decide. Then, take that one vs. another shaft, etc. Otherwise, I'll just go ever crazier.

My current crappy clubs/shafts are light so it might just be 'too much' to go so heavy at this time.

From what i'm reading the s300 is kind of like a px 5.75...that may be the sweet spot..

Nippon would be fun...be no moolah for such a venture :)
 
vw_tdi said:
I really appreciate the information and feedback. Your experience with the 120g shaft is similar to mine. Felt like a log.

I will use the optimizer as the starting point and re-hit in a fashion similar to getting one's eyes checked. Hit shaft 1, then shaft 2. Decide. Then, take that one vs. another shaft, etc. Otherwise, I'll just go ever crazier.

My current crappy clubs/shafts are light so it might just be 'too much' to go so heavy at this time.

From what i'm reading the s300 is kind of like a px 5.75...that may be the sweet spot..

Nippon would be fun...be no moolah for such a venture :)
Click to expand...
I definitely delivered a lot of newspapers for the Nippons. Also had to make a few deals with my wife.....which I'm starting to regret already. I still go crazy over shafts, though. Especially with my driver and wood shafts because it's so easy to change them now that they all have an adapter that screws in.

When I was deciding on the Nippons, I talked to blugold first and then I went through every stiff shaft in the fitting cabinet and used your "eye test" model. If I liked something I set it off to the side and moved on. Then hit all of them again and picked out the top 4 or 5. My instructor was there the entire time looking at my launch numbers and asking me, "How did that feel?" after every shot. Eventually it came down to the shaft I was already using (PXi) and the Nippons. The Nippons were just so much smoother. "Buttery" doesn't even explain it. Maybe teflony?

Have fun with this. I love buying new golf stuff (just check the What Golf Stuff Did You Buy Today thread).
 
vw_tdi said:
I really appreciate the information and feedback. Your experience with the 120g shaft is similar to mine. Felt like a log.

I will use the optimizer as the starting point and re-hit in a fashion similar to getting one's eyes checked. Hit shaft 1, then shaft 2. Decide. Then, take that one vs. another shaft, etc. Otherwise, I'll just go ever crazier.

My current crappy clubs/shafts are light so it might just be 'too much' to go so heavy at this time.

From what i'm reading the s300 is kind of like a px 5.75...that may be the sweet spot..

Nippon would be fun...be no moolah for such a venture :)
Click to expand...

If you're going through this much effort to get the shafts right & the Nippons are on the fitting cart give them a try. I doubt the upcharge would be much more than the PX, probably in line with the KBS.

Like Goldilocks in the story, you may find they are "just right".

Or an epic fail.

Full disclosure: I have Nippon 1050's in Srixon Z Stars and luv 'em. YMMV.
 
p3ga said:
If you're going through this much effort to get the shafts right & the Nippons are on the fitting cart give them a try. I doubt the upcharge would be much more than the PX, probably in line with the KBS.

Like Goldilocks in the story, you may find they are "just right".

Or an epic fail.
Click to expand...

My Nippons were $18 per club.
 
Checked. No nippons on the cart. May check in Sacramento.
 
Don't give up on KBS yet try the tour 90 reg. very nice shaft if you can go to each shafts web site and check their recommendations.
 
golf red said:
Don't give up on KBS yet try the tour 90 reg. very nice shaft if you can go to each shafts web site and check their recommendations.
Click to expand...
This is also true. Actually, you really can't go wrong with any of the selections the guys here have recommended. They're all quality shafts. It all just depends on what suits your game. Like I said before, you've got the right idea. Hit'em all and then sort them out.
 
It sounds like you have had some positive feedback from a number of different shafts. Not that my opinion counts, but I went from the s300's to the PX Flighted 6.0's. MY PX 6.0's are a more solid, firm feel shaft and don't have that same "whip" feeling that my s300's had. I had no problem with the s300's, but I don't think I have as much torque in the shaft at the club head with my 6.0's. There is something to be said about that for sure. I think you'll probably be better suited with the 5.5's personally. I have not had a chance to hit the KBS shafts but only once, but they felt too soft for my taste and feel.
Good luck, trust your numbers, trust your feel.
 
blugold said:
My Nippons were $18 per club.
Click to expand...
Those are Wisconsin prices though. We all know that things are cheaper in Canada South :silly:. I kid, I kid. It's in my blood to bash every state that borders Illinois.

Now that I think of it, my Nippons were only $23 a club. If you look in the right places, you can find what you're looking for at a price that is palatable.
 
Hey Guys..

Went back and hit more shafts under instructor supervision. Complicating this is that my shoulder is really bugging me and takes forever to get warmed up. It's impacting my consistency...

However, I hit the Dynalite XP, Project X 5.5 and 6.0, and the s300. The PX 5.5 was the winner. The 6.0 actually wasn't that bad either, but he liked the ball flight of the 5.5 the best. It also gave me good feel: I'm coming from a POS light R shaft that is whippy, so the s300 just felt a bit too heavy. The XP too light and high ball flight. The 6.0 and s300 were slightly too low in flight. The 5.5 was a good compromise of all factors.

Now, on to committing to a head and picking a grip. I hit the ez forged today and nobody around here has the 714 ap1's. I've only hit them 1x and it was cold and miserable outside. It may just come down to looks and more reading. I'll probably do a +1/64 over standard for grip. any opinions on those 2 heads are welcome.

Thanks again for the help. Maybe for the next set I'll look into the Nippons..

matt
 
I would wait until you have the chance to hit other heads, but it is definitely a good thing that you found at least one combo that you like.
 
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