Not a week goes by that we do not get the question about what clubs are made in the US. The answer is not many. With that said, a lot happens here from a number of putters being done, some shafts being done, assembly taking place and nearly all of the design work.
With the latest delays hitting golf for a myriad of reasons from components being available to cargo disasters combined with higher costs to bring things back to America, the question is being asked quite a bit more. Could a major golf equipment company bring their manufacturing back to the US?
Is it merely a cost strategy or are there a few regulations that would need to change as well? Finally, viewing other items made elsewhere vs what is made domestically, is there a quality conversation?
Sound Off Below.
It’s kind of funny though, when I was consulting for China in the metals platform they always thought that products Made in U.S.A. were high quality and great products, often we see things that are Made in China and we assume they are knock offs or low quality.
There was a reason that America was moving away from doing things like large amount of hot rolled or cold rolled steel in our country and outsourcing. Not only did more raw materials come from there, it was also cheaper to do the work start to finish then ship them all over.
I kind of assume it’s the same way with regards to other items, when you combine in possible cheaper material costs with our employment regulation standards it may be cost prohibitive for some companies to really mass produce in America.
In so far as making clubs in the US, I tend to think the cost would apply to 2 things, start up manufacturing and regulations, more than anything else. If my irons can be made in some foreign country at a price that is 25% less (or possibly even less), that’s a lot of money left over for balls, shirts, tee times, food, drink, etc. Conversely, lower that difference to say 10% – a provable 10% or less and I’m going to be one of the first in line to demo those American made products because, like I presume anyone (who is American) would prefer American made goods.
Frankly though, I would see it as niche or boutique product and likely to not be a good fit for me (not the target performance – but, that’s a guess). I think there are many other products that could be manufactured in the US that have a larger buying audience and a larger benefit well before golf clubs, where the competition to make them at a similar price point could become too difficult.
As a general consumer that is true. Diving in deeper should have correlations though. More workers created, should less tax increases and fees in other items. With that said, taxes very rarely go down, so you have to assume it would be
wastedspent elsewhere.If there wasn’t, I don’t think you’d see "assembled in America" on anything. That seems more marketing than anything.
100% agree.
I think regulations are the biggest obstacle, followed by raw materials, then start up costs, i think training and personnel are lower in the list.
2) most corporations have no purpose other than to enrich shareholders. We need more employee-owned companies whose goal is to build better lives for their employees while producing high quality products. The beer industry has had great success with this model.
One problem in the US is that our population is shrinking. It’s going to be real difficult to bring more work to our country from overseas with a shrinking and aging population. We were near full employment before the pandemic and we will be close to that again in short order. Amazon in our area has already churned through so many of these same types of workers they are allowing people they fired to come back and work for them and giving them more money the second go around.
I liken it to DIY in some ways – why do something yourself if you can pay someone skilled in the task to carry out the same work for the same cost as it would cost you to purchase all of the equipment and materials needed to do the job. Yes, you may be able to do the job, but is it going to be as good as the skilled tradesman?
Another point to consider, does the country have the raw materials they need for the production? If not, how much is it going to cost to import it? All of these costs add up and for some countries it just doesn’t make sense financially to try and start a mass scale production based on the possible income it will generate
distortedinfluenced by national policies, including national manufacturing strategies, trade protectionism, regulations, and taxation.I suspected trouble about 20 years ago when I was changing a bulb in the bathroom light fixture. When I double-checked the GE bulb to be sure I had the correct wattage, it bore the phrase "MADE IN CHINA." Think about that – it was cheaper to make that bulb in China and essentially ship air 8,000 miles than it was to make it in Nela Park in Cleveland and ship domestically. There’s no doubt those national policies influence those comparative economics.
I’m an Adam Smith/Milton Friedman guy as well, but there things such as second-order and higher effects. When the US imports over 95% of things like N95 masks, pharmaceuticals, and rare earth elements that go into the magnets used in everything from EVs to smart bombs, IMO those examples beg for a cohesive national manufacturing strategy. Not a centrally planned economy, but a deliberate plan to subsidize the things we want/need to produce more of and to tax the things we want/need less of.
That said, I would pay a premium for domestically produced clubs. I might pay as much as 20%.
Regulatory hurdles are another huge issue! Asian countries use lip service regarding reducing the pollution their factories cause, but they don’t have an EPA nor the climate activists that would try to shut them down here in the US.
Finally, most OEMs are public companies that have a fiduciary duty to their shareholders to grow their profits quarter after quarter and the costs to build factories here and pay a living wage would severely cut into profits that higher club prices could not offset.
True Temper Shafts are American Made.
Many of the putters that are considered premium are American Made.
Im curious about our population shrinking thing though. Based on census that isnt the case, but there is a predictor that it might shrink for the first time ever on record due to the pandemic. Although data is not out yet, right?
The last long-term forecast I saw showed two large countries showing population gains through 2050 – the US and India. Russia and Japan in particular were predicted to be facing major challenges. IIRC, this was before China reversed its one child policy.
I just read an article this morning saying the forecast for the first time on record was a shrinking population in the US, but it was not determined yet (Census will be done of course). I expect that with the pandemic and tighter rules. That is pretty short term though.
That makes sense.
I do a lot of raw material price forecasting, and when reviewing it with management, I always tell them, "At some point, this forecast will be right."
I work for a manufacturer, and have had these types of discussions many times with the upper management. They’d love to do it, but, the money isn’t there.
Now, there’s a boatload of other factors, but, there would need to be a thread for each one.
Is this accurate? I mean Scotty Cameron, Odyssey Toulon, etc sell a lot of putters and certainly make up more than 1%, right?
While my 99% was more of a waxing philosophic number, I’ll try to answer the question. Yes, the above do sell a lot of putters. Do I think if you went to a generic muni course and did a straw poll of the putters in the bags that you would see a ton of them? I doubt it. Even if you did, I’d say probably half of them were purchased used.
That part is in the first post haha
I like the idea of being self sufficient, and I am always willing to pay a little more if I know it supports local businesses and workers. This is why I buy most of my gear & apparel from local Pro Shops rather than http://www.cheapclubsnow.com
Who knows, those dollars may end up back in my jeans when they need some Plumbing fixed.
Should be more specific. We are getting close to a 0% population growth rate. Millennials will not replace themselves. That said the labor force participation rate (number of workers/number of adults) has been shrinking since 2009. The labor force participation rate shrinkage is faster than population growth so our labor force is actually getting smaller and that has accelerated during the pandemic for a variety of reasons (women leaving due to no daycare, Boomers retiring early, unemployment benefits, closed borders, etc).
I think wage growth in the US is going to accelerate substantially over the next decade as this trend holds. Most of the stagnation in wages over the last 30 years has been due to onboarding 3 billion workers to the world economy in China and India. That was devestating to low skilled workers wages around the globe, but the world has absorbed that production and is now consuming everything they can produce (longer supply times and increased prices of overseas goods is starting). There aren’t 3 billion more people hiding under a stone on this planet anymore so we are to the point now where US employers need workers desperately. This is going to persist well past this pandemic based on all the economic data I have seen. I would say the next 20 years are going to be a huge boon for the American worker.
That said, these are $400+ shoes. The difference in price is jarring when you compare to an essentially identical product made in China – Johnston and Murphy sells a cap toe Oxford for $179 list, AE’s version runs $395. I don’t know the margins here, but I’m guessing the %’s are similar. And remember, these aren’t things like golf clubs where technology changes all the time and you need to upgrade – it’s easier to justify the extra expense for quality when you know you’re hanging onto them for a long while.
Also, it’s worth noting that even a proponent of American craftsmanship like Allen Edmonds has added styles that are made overseas to try to appease the more trend oriented buyer – because they know the extra expense for quality doesn’t often enter the mind of a buyer who expects to want something different once it wears out.
All in all, I think there is a market for American made for stuff that really lasts and that you don’t need change much (putters, for example), but for items where technology changes all the time or that wear out, I think the added cost of an American made product is going to fall in a very niche market at best. Similar to JDM type market or hand forged irons. There’s going to be a very small percentage of people willing to spend $1000 on a driver (considering they currently run in the $400-500 range, even with overseas made components).
If the cost was reasonably similar, I would be okay with it, but I don’t see anyway that would be the case.
But golf clubs? Boutiques, shafts, putters, etc., are made in USA. It would be great if Countries like Mexico or Canada, closer to us and part of trade agreements, would have the ability and economics to produce clubs – Mexico assembles clubs for Callaway, and makes Lamkin grips, what’s the next step?
But parts of the USA have so many regulations, and that makes it difficult. The closest we may be able to come is possibly free trade zones on the Southern border with Mexico-US cooperation. But I have no idea of the details – haven’t upped my education level on that end in 30 yrs.
I don’t think it could work for the mass produced stuff, but in a boutique setting or even a subdivision of a big company could make it work in lower numbers.
Long term I think it would be beneficial in a lot of reasons if you can get the costs to a reasonable point but I think it would require massive upfront costs to get machinery and facilities where it would even be feasible.
Or the robots.
You make a valid point about the increase in the global workforce, but in that same timeframe, technological innovation has played a huge role in increasing productivity. I wouldn’t count that out as a factor in the next 30 years.
I see robots trending upwards already in the USA.
I think it could only be done here on a small scale/boutique level. And at a higher price than many would want to spend.
Ethylene is the biggest building block of the chemical industry. About one-third of all chemicals in use are based upon it. It is made in huge, billion lbs/yr. billion dollar plants known as crackers.
In 2007, I attended an industry conference in which every expert said, "The economics are such that there will never be another cracker built in the United States."
Today, about four billion pounds of ethylene capacity are under construction in the US, not counting the multiple plants that have started up in the last ten years. The US has a favorable ethylene cost position vs Europe and Asia. Why? Fracking led to availability of low cost feeds for the crackers.
Things are seldom static. The social, economic, political, and technological landscapes are always changing.
Go talk to a hiring manager anywhere and ask them how far away we are from that. Also that chatter has been around for a millenia. The cotton gin was going to kill the American labor force, the computer was too, now it’s the robots, but yet people still find work. Look at the entertainment industry. How many more restaurants are there now than there were 40 years ago? How many more people are involved in entertainment (more tv shows than ever, more movies than ever, more concerts than ever, more sports than ever, more YouTubers than ever). There will always be human work for people to do.
Ultimately that is how 90% shop…They speak of wanting made in USA but buy stuff from all over continuously….
Numbers I am seeing point to the number of robots in the economy growing by 15-20%/yr. Their introduction will create other jobs. Creative destruction always does.
I’d gladly pay more for stuff that is built in sustainable ways, particularly if it is local. ymmv.
If I had 2 options in front of me that were equal in every way apart from price and country of origin, I’d be willing to pay more for the American made to a point. I’m not sure where to say that point is.
I’m all for things costing less, but I’m also all for the US not being dependent on other countries for basic goods.
I don’t fault companies for pursuing the highest profit margin possible. It is mind blowing to me, though, that so many things can be made cheaper overseas when you include shipping. Obviously there are a lot of reasons for this, but its crazy to me that this type of environment exists.
In today’s global economy, the argument that you’re putting money in foreign pockets is pretty ridiculous. The idea that you’re taking an American job is also off base, considering the number of American workers in the import/export business, as well as logistics, truckers, etc. If moving production abroad allows companies to stay in business and maintain fair pricing, how can that be a bad thing? I’d like to see if a company says, "we’re moving everything back to the US, but raising our prices another 30%." Would people pay that premium for the exact same product just to get a little USA stamp on the side?