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2nd Greatest QB this Century???

Hard to argue against either Rodgers or Brees, so I'd go 2A and 2B ... or is that 2B and 2A?
 
Boston_golfer said:
You really think so? I think Brady has taken worse teams than what Rogers has had over the years to the Super bowl at least 4 times.....out of the 8 appearances. How many bum no name players has Brady turned into studs? Guys who were nothing before brady, and then Nothing after. I can think of about 6-7 off the top of my head.
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I do. And I've heard that argument before but my counter is simply that Brady hasn't been threading the needle on every play or throwing guys open all the time, he's been throwing to lots of open receivers. So where some may have the urge to diminish their skill set, they've been open and he's hitting them like a QB should.

As to the particular players though, he had Moss when he was the best WR in the game, Welker when he was the best slot receiver, and Gronk who many feel is the best TE in history. Brady has also consistently had the stronger OL play.

I say this all not as criticism of Brady as I readily admit that his accomplishments render him as the GOAT. But just like my comparison to Rodgers or Sanders to Smith, I'd also take Dan Marino over Brady.

I just feel that there's nothing Brady can do physically that they can't while there are areas where they are dominant to Brady (mobility and spontaneity for Rodgers, ridiculously quick release of Marino). I don't believe the Dolphins would've been any better with Brady yet I believe the numbers Marino may have put up on Brady's NE teams could be epic.

Means nothing, the height of subjectivity, just my thought pattern.

Also feel similar at present about my own team's QB, Jared Goff. He's played sensationally and I'm extremely happy with him. But I still think they should've taken Carson Wentz. There's no box that Goff checks that Wentz does not yet there are a few that Wentz can that Goff couldn't (size, strength, mobility, sheer arm strength).
 
Wake said:
So we are going to give Eli credit for the Giant's D holding Brady to a combined 31 points in those two games?

Foles scored more points in his ONE victory over Brady than Eli did in his two.
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Why light up the score board when there is no need to?
 
luvagoodshot said:
Why light up the score board when there is no need to?
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That makes sense,

Also explains why he played so average throughout his career, why play like an elite qb when he could be rich playing like a pretty good one.
 
Brady's work ethic and Football IQ is 2nd to none. I've hear Welker's name dropped a couple times, but let's not forget Welker was garbage before the Pats, and hot garbage after. I haven't seen another player bring out the best in everyone around them. I would say Rogers is a super talent. Great arm, athletic....he's 2nd on my list.
 
Boston Golfer....what's up man? Do you think bringing out the best has anything to do with Coach Bill and the way HE uses his guys? I respect both of them but the coach is brilliant.
 
Can we revisit this thread in 10-15 years and see if Patrick Mahomes career continues on his current track?
 
Boston_golfer said:
Brady's work ethic and Football IQ is 2nd to none. I've hear Welker's name dropped a couple times, but let's not forget Welker was garbage before the Pats, and hot garbage after. I haven't seen another player bring out the best in everyone around them. I would say Rogers is a super talent. Great arm, athletic....he's 2nd on my list.
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Not exactly correct. Watching him play with Miami, it was obvious that he was underutilized. The guy got open and made plays, the fact that he didnt play with anyone capable enough to consistently get the ball to him counts for something.

And when playing for Denver, he struggled due to injuries. Yet his TD % was awesome with the Broncos, better than with NE and he averaged more yards per catch with Miami.

It's just silly to devalue Welker with the Pats, it's not like he was routinely blanketed and Brady was throwing lasers to him or throwing him open. Brady had nothing to do with Welker's speed, his fantastic hands, his uncanny feel in the zone and great route running. Those are traits that served Welker, the Pats and Brady very well.

Welker, like the top talent in the slot that he was, got open often and Brady hit him often. It's absolutely as simple as that.
 
WMac19 said:
Not exactly correct. Watching him play with Miami, it was obvious that he was underutilized. The guy got open and made plays, the fact that he didnt play with anyone capable enough to consistently get the ball to him counts for something.

And when playing for Denver, he struggled due to injuries. Yet his TD % was awesome with the Broncos, better than with NE and he averaged more yards per catch with Miami.

It's just silly to devalue Welker with the Pats, it's not like he was routinely blanketed and Brady was throwing lasers to him or throwing him open. Brady had nothing to do with Welker's speed, his fantastic hands, his uncanny feel in the zone and great route running. Those are traits that served Welker, the Pats and Brady very well.

Welker, like the top talent in the slot that he was, got open often and Brady hit him often. It's absolutely as simple as that.
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Well said. The Fish played the Stillers in Week 1 of the 2006 season and this slot receiver named Welker was consistently getting open. Unfortunately for him, Daunte Cuplepper was the Miami QB. He still got 67 yards. The Steelers were defending SB champs, and at that time they still had a strong defense. I had to look up the details, but I remember Welker made a very positive impression on me after watching the game. Next time I heard of him was when the Patriots acquired him. I thought that was not going to be good news for opponents. I was surprised that Miami traded him, that they traded him in-division, and that they traded him in-division TO THE FARGIN PATRIOTS.

A discussion of Wes Welker is the only way Daunte Culpepper will get a mention in a "2nd Greatest QB of This Century" thread.
 
moosejaa said:
And I'm going with Brady as #2 since he even says Rodgers is the best.
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Did he say that before or after Brady beat him this year?
 
Reframmellator said:
Well said. The Fish played the Stillers in Week 1 of the 2006 season and this slot receiver named Welker was consistently getting open. Unfortunately for him, Daunte Cuplepper was the Miami QB. He still got 67 yards. The Steelers were defending SB champs, and at that time they still had a strong defense. I had to look up the details, but I remember Welker made a very positive impression on me after watching the game. Next time I heard of him was when the Patriots acquired him. I thought that was not going to be good news for opponents. I was surprised that Miami traded him, that they traded him in-division, and that they traded him in-division TO THE FARGIN PATRIOTS.

A discussion of Wes Welker is the only way Daunte Culpepper will get a mention in a "2nd Greatest QB of This Century" thread.
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Well that or the fact that the Dolphins picked him over Brees... Oops.
 
Yeah that's what I mean, Brady beat him this season and hes got 5 SB rings to 1 for Rodgers..Belichecks got the whole team brainwashed..every other teams better, every other team is better..right before you play them..

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Muzzy said:
Yeah that's what I mean, Brady beat him this season and hes got 5 SB rings to 1 for Rodgers..Belichecks got the whole team brainwashed..every other teams better, every other team is better..right before you play them..

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Yeah, pretty sure Brady isn't brainwashed... And QBs aren't playing 1-on-1.

Brady said Rodgers physical abilities were superior, which is hard to deny. But physical abilities are just part of being an all world QB. I think it's very reasonable people rank Brady no. 1. That's fair. But he has also been fortunate to play in the best organization for arguably the greatest coach of all time


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Yup I agree with all of your points with the exception of the brainwash part. All of the players are coached to not use language that would fire up the other team. You'll rarely if ever hear a Patriot player trash an opposing player or team. That's a Belicheck thing...they'll always be complementary..Rodgers has better physical skills as far as his legs and scrambling ability goes..I think Drew Brees is the number 2 behind Brady..

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Tom Brady


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Am I the only one old enough to have witnessed Dan Marino's career from start to finish?

I'd take him over Rodgers or Brady. Best pure passer ever, imo.
 
I remember when Marino and Bledsoe went at it..incredible game..one if the best QBs without a SB ring..Kelly too..

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WMac19 said:
Am I the only one old enough to have witnessed Dan Marino's career from start to finish?

I'd take him over Rodgers or Brady. Best pure passer ever, imo.
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You are not the only one, and he was the best pure passer, imo. Not sure whether he would be the guy I'd take to win one game, though.
 
Reframmellator said:
You are not the only one, and he was the best pure passer, imo. Not sure whether he would be the guy I'd take to win one game, though.
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With his weapons, I'd agree. But give him some semblance of a running game and one, just one dominant receiver and look out.

Not trying to diminish the greatness of any QB as I've marveled at them all.

But Brady has Gronk, had Moss, (will be) two HoF'ers and Welker (#22 all-time NFL receptions). And while no sheer stars at RB (save for Corey Dillon, 37 TDs in his last 3 yrs in the NFL with the Pats), always an effective running game and at times a dominant D.

Manning had Marvin Harrison (HoF) and Reggie Wayne, Reggie will also get the nod for HoF enshrinement (#10 all-time receptions) along with #88. Then he had Demaryius Thomas. PLUS he had Marshall Faulk (HoF) and then Edgerrin James, Dallas Clark and Julius Thomas.

Montana had Jerry Rice (HoF), John Taylor, Dwight Clarke and the incredible dual threat of Roger Craig.

Steve Young had Rice (HoF), Terrell Owens (HoF), Brent Jones and Ricky Watters (HoF numbers, no doubt, check them out. Always a stud player, dual threat, but a malcontent who grated on sports writers, he'll never get their vote).

Drew Brees had LaDanian Tomlinson (HoF) and Antonio Gates (sure fire HoF'er) with SD, Marques Colston, Jimmy Graham, Brandin Cooks, Michael Thomas, a capable Mark Ingram at RB and now the sensational Alvin Kamara in N.O.

I'd contend that it's Rodgers and Marino who had less talent around them for the entirety of their careers yet they both rose to the very top of the game.

Imagine his numbers if Marino had Rice or Moss or Harrison or even just Demaryius Thomas or Colston? He never had a dominant receiver, ever. Mark Clayton and Mark Duper were really good but never great. They were Brady's version of Troy Brown and Deion Branch.

Marino never had an adequate running game, ever. Bernie Parmalee? Please. Only had a good D for a scarce couple of seasons very early in his career.

He's the best passer ever in my book. Played the hand he was dealt and put an entire team on his back. No one man can effectively carry an entire roster, but damn, did he come close...
 
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Well, I guess the assumption here is that Brady is the best ever. I suppose it would be semi-interesting to have a debate about the 2nd best of the 21st century, but honestly I have little to say on such matters anymore. Since this thread assumed that Brady was the best, I think it's fair game to talk about how Tom Brady, and the New England Patriots have destroyed the NFL, and it's inherent popularity to those outside of the New England hypnotic trance state.

Having grown up a Miami Dolphins fan, and going to a lot of Marino's games in person, I am nostalgic for those years. But honestly, even when Miami was winning every year with Marino, what did it get them? One trip to the Super Bowl with a young and naive Marino, where San Francisco took them to school in how to win a championship. So even the best years of my memory of the Miami Dolphins are clouded with frustration and bitterness. I suppose it would be the same as being a Bills fan. You went to four straight Super Bowls and walked away with nada. That's like going to four straight proms with the prom queen, and not getting lucky with her in any of those four years. Sure, she let you make out with her, but you got all hot and bothered for nothing as she just walked away and left you holding your...well, you get the idea.

Brady and the Patriots ruined professional football for me personally. I stopped watching games a couple of years ago, because I got sick of seeing the same dog and pony show every year. In September everyone is supposed to have hope. Well, based on the body of work Brady and the Patriots have put up in this century, any of the other three teams in the AFC East might as well not even show up to play their games. Just give the Patriots the Lombardi trophy every August 31st and don't even bother playing a bunch of meaningless games. Because come January, we already know the outcome. The Patriots will be right there and hosting the AFC Championship, or close to it, and they may get beat deep in the playoffs, but chances are they go to another Super Bowl. And I laugh at the notion of Kansas City being in the conversation. When was the last time Kansas City won anything? When did they last make a run in the playoffs that you could take seriously?

And maybe it's KC this year, as it was some other team last year, and the year before, etc. But the constant remains Brady and the Patriots. So I just stopped watching because it's boring, and it's not fun anymore. It's just a joke, as if you look at the records of the four teams in the AFC East we've got the Patriots owning that division for the entire century, and the other three teams are taking notes from the Cleveland Browns on how to F up a franchise perpetually. You'd think that Belichick was making the draft picks for all the other teams in the AFC East, because you've never seen such ineptitude in 3 front offices in your life. The combination of the 3 faux franchises in the AFC East with New England having everything work for them every time and every year, just makes watching the NFL a complete waste of time.

So sure, Brady is the best, and no one else is even close. He's got the most Super Bowls, the most championships, the most wins, the most yards, and the most in every positive category they can come up with. For all I know he's got the most orgasms with his smoking hot wife. Maybe the'll make a category with that as well, because Brady needs one more thing to be the best at.

So what was your goal with this? To rub it in everyone's nose that Brady is the best and they own the NFL? Sure, I guess it's good for you. I honestly wouldn't know anymore, as I don't even pay attention. Seriously.
 
GolfSwag said:
So what was your goal with this? To rub it in everyone's nose that Brady is the best and they own the NFL? Sure, I guess it's good for you. I honestly wouldn't know anymore, as I don't even pay attention. Seriously.
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My intent was for a discussion. Nothing more nothing less. Yes I think Brady's the best ever but we have some pretty Freaking good QB's playing in the same time frame.
Brees,Rodgers,Manning,Farve to name a few and thought we could have a discussion.

Sorry if you have a Patriots hangover but the Run is coming to an end if it hasn't already.

I was a fan of the Patriots back when they were the Joke of the league and we suffered thru our own 1-15 season just prior to Bledsoe arriving. Sure we have been Amazingly fortunate to have Brady/Belechick for 17 years. Sorry the Rest of the Division can't seem to get out of their own way but not our Fault the Bills are a dumpster fire and the Dolphins can't seem to find a QB who can stay healthy.
 
The 2nd best QB of this century might not have been born yet. Heck, his parents might not have been born yet for that matter.
 
OGputtnfool said:
The 2nd best QB of this century might not have been born yet. Heck, his parents might not have been born yet for that matter.
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I meant up till now!
 
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