Callaway Epic Flash and Epic Flash Sub Zero Driver
I'm definitely interested in that comparison Army. Assuming you were professionally fit, hitting both in the best configuration for you provides the best overall performance comparison. Professionally, my career was almost entirely comparative R&D testing in various arenas. Normalizing as many variables as possible has it's place, especially when isolating specific characteristics of components, but a driver (again IMO) is so much more, in total. How heads, settings, shafts etc... all interact with each other and more importantly with you (as a whole) provides the clearest picture I believe. I've done a lot of H2H comparative driver testing over the past few years and have observed many times that a setting/shaft beneficial to me with one driver become a detriment to the performance when applied to another.
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I’m truly intrigued to see what the competitors (TaylorMade, Titleist, Cobra, Ping, etc) argument is against this release by Callaway vs their new releases and why they think their 5-10 engineering iterations makes more sense than the 15,000 Callaway now has the technology to create.
I’m not even sure how you argue this point or if they should even try to....
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I’m not even sure how you argue this point or if they should even try to....
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I imagine it's a topic they won't highlight. They will leave it up to Callaway to sell their drivers with their tech story. They will continue with what they do and let Callaway do the same.
Am I the only one "shaking my head" at the Flash?
I just saw a video review of the Flash and I could not get past the green/gold color. The black & white pre release pictures actually looked better. Some of the budget on the AI could have been used on looks/color scheme IMO. The second thing (from the video review) is the sound. It sounds like crap. Tinny almost. Too early to say anything else but those are my observations from what is out there so far.
Huge Callaway fan here but disappointed with the Flash so far ...
I just saw a video review of the Flash and I could not get past the green/gold color. The black & white pre release pictures actually looked better. Some of the budget on the AI could have been used on looks/color scheme IMO. The second thing (from the video review) is the sound. It sounds like crap. Tinny almost. Too early to say anything else but those are my observations from what is out there so far.
Huge Callaway fan here but disappointed with the Flash so far ...
Well unless their processes have changed, they really can’t argue fact. I’m not saying it’s better by any means. But, an entirely different process and manufacturing method to get there that proves to be better is different than just saying it’s better but having old methods to try and get to that same point.
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You can get it in whatever color scheme you want in custom order
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While I understand everyone has aesthetic preferences, I'd recommend checking out the performance before you settle into disappointment. The performance has been strong in all the reviews I've seen thus far and in my personal experience.
Looks like this is the real deal. Getting rave reviews by the regular youtubers along with the THP members. I'm driver shopping this season and this is top of list to try along with the Titleist. However, it really is a crappy name.
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I can't speak to any solid numbers but I can say when I played in 44* weather here at home I was carrying to spots that I normally hit in the middle of summer. I have to imagine some big increases are coming for me.
I think that anyone who loved the sound of the original Epic might struggle with the sound here. I'm one who didn't like the original Epic's dull thud and I've been vocal about it. To me the new Flash sounds awesome and strikes a great balance between giving feedback and giving that "crushed" sensation.
Certainly it won't be for everyone but I think a lot of people will love it.
I guess my point was, that they won't even talk about it. There really isn't a positive spin that they can put on it. So, I am not expecting it to be discussed by any OEM aside from Callaway.
I agree about the dull sound of the epic. Sound wise I think I would be in your camp of like epic flash sound better
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So far for me the sound is a matter of feedback. If I hit it high on the face I do get an unpleasant sound. But if I hit is in the middle it sounds great / good / normal? Some people prefer feedback, others don't. I was quite happy with my Rogue and its constant muted sound, so this is an adjustment. But I think it will ultimately be good to know when I did and didn't hit the ball properly.
The color...well, remember that 99% of the color is on the sole and we don't often see that. If you don't like the combo, even on the crown, you can go custom.
As for spending money on the color instead of AI, I respectfully have to disagree. My first concern with a driver is performance. It is still very early for me - and I have seen some uneven results so far - but the forgiveness I've seen and the ability to reach my good summer distance locations in 30 and 40 degree weather has me very hopeful about the future with this one.
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This is a fair and refreshing post. You’re on a roll sir.
I'm with you there, so now I'm even more excited.
I'm really coming around on the aesthetics too. The driver looks WAY better in the photos you guys are posting than those dang pre-release ones floating around the interwebs. Can't wait to get my hands on it.
Yeah, I don't think it is good business to try and put down a competitor especially the one on the top unless you are prepared to go head to head against them in a something particular (like Srixon did with their new drivers and the ball speed discussion). You talk about your product, what it offers and let the others talk about their own product.
Well the easiest thing to say is that the face is just one portion of a driver design.
From what I've read so far, the biggest trade off is that between jailbreak and the new (heavier) face they've moved the CG closer to the face which has also lowered the MOI a bit.
I know MOI isn't the be all end all of a forgiveness story, but my own personal experience moving from the Epic SZ to the Rogue SZ means I'll be taking a close look at forgiveness in my fitting later this spring. It will be interesting to see if face technology or higher MOI makes a bigger difference for my game.
Either way, I'm really interested in the process improvement Callaway has made here. It will be interesting to see which other portions of their design process they start utilizing machine learning in the future. (I'd imagine putter face milling patterns / inserts would be a logical next step).
So you think they avoid it all together? What if it’s a negligible ball speed or distance gain? Or what if it the competitors was better? I’m assuming a lot here but I’d be shocked if it isn’t the “fastest” face on the market. If for some reason it’s not, than I would capitalize on that as a competitor company no?
I understand your point for sure but am just trying to contemplate how a competitor can even talk about ball speed if this release is that far in front of their competitors products. Just some food for thought I guess as I wonder these things out loud
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I wish I could answer this for you but unfortunately I didn't hear this discussed.
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As someone that couldn’t hated the sound of epic, I’m liking this.
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Listening to the story about the AI was jaw dropping. Not only that, Callaway already has some of the smartest guys in golf and then throw in the Supercomputer and it's crazy how much expertise is behind the tech.
I've noticed something when I've been playing in the simulator with my buddies. Normally I'm the shortest driver of the group and rarely hit as far as them. My drives are definitely closer to their snow and I'm actually able to keep up to them more often than before.
I can understand this feedback. I wasn't a big fan of the colors either but the sole doesn't bother me anymore because I don't have to look at it at address and the colors on the top I no longer even notice when I'm standing over it.
The sound is different yes, it reminds me a lot of the classic driver sound from the past. It's such a personal thing that what some hate others may love. We are in an era with so many different materials used in drivers in different ways which has created some different and more muted sounds, this isn't that muted sound. It sounds powerful to me.
Ultimately performance is king.