A fair statement about the turn?

[iamachine1976]

I had a moment of possible clarity earlier this week after about what amounted to my worst round of the season. Just a question for you guys and I'll explain. [The Question].. Is a proper full or at least almost full turn (assuming this turn is more or less fundamentally correct) probably the most important element in a good repeatable golf swing? Say for someone who has a solid grasp of the basic fundamentals of set up, grip and posture.
[The Explanation] I live in the mid to low 80s and have for years now. I really have wanted to make the next leap in my game and have been chasing that thing or things in my swing that will make me a better ball striker. As I know this is the key to lower scores for me. I have had very mixed results and nothing that has definitively changed me for the better. Towards the end of this last round (frustrated of course) after stinking up the back nine I ask my partner "what is it that I am not getting about my swing". He says "I don't know? You used to turn way more when we were younger." So the light bulb goes off. Years ago I would turn so much my left heal would come up. Now back then I did a lot of other things wrong and definitely didn't practice. I am definitely a better all around player than my younger self. That said. I was (at least with Irons) a more pure striker of the ball. Accuracy wasn't always there and whatever else. But I found the sweet spot more often with the irons that's for sure. I think I may be chasing something that is not there and forgetting the most important part of the swing? I think you can be so focused on things like "is the club head outside my hands?" "What are my wrists doing?" "Keep your head still" that you simply forget the thing that is the foundation of everything really. Can you really have a solid repeatable swing without a decent turn?

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[chenrio]

I have experimented with this at the range. I was surprised that my shots were actually more accurate, and the distance gains were pretty impressive. Like you, I've been stuck in the low 80's the last few years even though I've practiced diligently. I wasn't really searching for more distance as that has never been an issue, but was impressed by the gains none the less.

 

[Tadashi70]

Yes you can have a repeatable swing with full, half or partial turn. If you want to lower your scores, work on solid contact and your short game.

 

[Mmaynard11]

I’m right there with you, stuck in the low 80’s, and have never really had a full turn. I’ve been working on having a repeatable swing and seeing some gains. My swing pattern has always produced a fade ball flight pattern. My question would be do I need to work on being able to hit a draw, which I struggle to do, or continue doing what works?


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[Tadashi70]

I’m right there with you, stuck in the low 80’s, and have never really had a full turn. I’ve been working on having a repeatable swing and seeing some gains. My swing pattern has always produced a fade ball flight pattern. My question would be do I need to work on being able to hit a draw, which I struggle to do, or continue doing what works?


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Dance with how you brought. Eliminate the left side of the golf course and always be aggressive through the hit zone. This will keep your fade consistent.

 

[tahoebum]

A full turn is not necessary for consistent golf but for me it is important for keeping my distance as I age.

I don’t want to get into a lengthy discussion about swing theory but I’m 54 and after having played most my life with “modern swing” I switched to a “classic swing” a couple years ago mostly to save my back and to keep from losing distance. In the spring I enjoy having long range sessions a few days a week where I hit 300+ balls and it was getting to the point where if I did that, I couldn’t play golf or hit balls the next day. There are plenty of videos on the internet that describe the difference but the main difference for me is my hip turn on the backswing is now much greater, about 50* vs 25* before. In golf terms my “X factor” is much less now. I also slightly lift my left heel off the ground on the backswing. The result is I can now have long range sessions and/or play golf everyday without any pain or soreness. It’s not unusual for me to hit 250 balls and play 27 holes in a day and I’ve had several days in the last couple months where I played 45 holes with no back pain. That was not possible before. Nearly all of my friends are in their early to mid 50’s and all of them have lost some of there shoulder turn and distance where I have not - my 5 iron is still my 190 club and I can comfortably carry my driver 255 yards.

It was a lot of work to make my first real swing change since 1980 but the end result is I can hit 250 balls and play 18 holes without having any soreness in my back. I will say that the switch to a larger hip turn was not quick or easy, it took me almost 2 year for it to become “natural” and I hit way more balls on the range than your average golfer - 1,000 per week is not unusual the first couple months of the golf season.

 

[chenrio]

I'm right there with you. I enjoy hitting balls on the range almost as much as playing. I usually hit a huge basket of balls that takes at least an hour and a half to hit, sometimes 2 hours. Back never gets sore and I'm a 72 year old youngster.

 

[iamachine1976]

A full turn is not necessary for consistent golf but for me it is important for keeping my distance as I age.

I don’t want to get into a lengthy discussion about swing theory but I’m 54 and after having played most my life with “modern swing” I switched to a “classic swing” a couple years ago mostly to save my back and to keep from losing distance. In the spring I enjoy having long range sessions a few days a week where I hit 300+ balls and it was getting to the point where if I did that, I couldn’t play golf or hit balls the next day. There are plenty of videos on the internet that describe the difference but the main difference for me is my hip turn on the backswing is now much greater, about 50* vs 25* before. In golf terms my “X factor” is much less now. I also slightly lift my left heel off the ground on the backswing. The result is I can now have long range sessions and/or play golf everyday without any pain or soreness. It’s not unusual for me to hit 250 balls and play 27 holes in a day and I’ve had several days in the last couple months where I played 45 holes with no back pain. That was not possible before. Nearly all of my friends are in their early to mid 50’s and all of them have lost some of there shoulder turn and distance where I have not - my 5 iron is still my 190 club and I can comfortably carry my driver 255 yards.

It was a lot of work to make my first real swing change since 1980 but the end result is I can hit 250 balls and play 18 holes without having any soreness in my back. I will say that the switch to a larger hip turn was not quick or easy, it took me almost 2 year for it to become “natural” and I hit way more balls on the range than your average golfer - 1,000 per week is not unusual the first couple months of the golf season.

One thing I guess I should have mentioned in my original post. I have a terrible lower back. My doctor says I need a fusion but to hold out as long as i can. I get anywhere from three to five epidurals a year. I am convinced I have been turning less and less as time goes on. I think this is really killing my consistency. Also it is probably harder on my back than if I was turning more? It is probably a subconscious thing and also stiffness just promotes less movement in general. I think (I could be wrong but) the more classic swing allows more hip turn with the shoulders (vs torqued against the hips) and allows the left heal to come off the ground? I am definitely going to try this with and without a more flared open right foot. I am convinced I have been chasing things that are not there. That the (lack of) turn has really been the thing that is killing my consistent delivery of the club back to the ball. I don't expect some magic thing to happen right away. But I think I will get my swing put back together once I groove the idea of turning more. It goes against my self preservation senses I have going right now. But I think it is having the opposite affect. Thanks for the great post!

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[Badger_Golfer]

You certainly can have a repeatable swing but its going to be difficult to generate much power. I know that making a good turn is something that Ive struggled with for many years. My swing used to be almost all arms and only recently have I started to discover making a good turn and its amazing what a difference it makes.

 

[iamachine1976]

You certainly can have a repeatable swing but its going to be difficult to generate much power. I know that making a good turn is something that Ive struggled with for many years. My swing used to be almost all arms and only recently have I started to discover making a good turn and its amazing what a difference it makes.

I think this is what I am getting at in a round about way. Only in reverse order. I feel like I used to get a lot of effortless power. Now I am "fixing" all these things that are not at the root of the issue. I think I have learned some things along the way that are good. But to come full circle with it I need to allow my body to do the work again. Im not saying I need my left heel to come off the ground. But I am saying I am not gonna be afraid of that. If that makes any sense? I do think restricting my hips is not good for me at this point. I think my back will appreciate a more matched turn. I can imagine some other things falling in line this way also..not without putting in the work. But at least I have a picture in my head. Thanks everyone for response.

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[Badger_Golfer]

I think this is what I am getting at in a round about way. Only in reverse order. I feel like I used to get a lot of effortless power. Now I am "fixing" all these things that are not at the root of the issue. I think I have learned some things along the way that are good. But to come full circle with it I need to allow my body to do the work again. Im not saying I need my left heel to come off the ground. But I am saying I am not gonna be afraid of that. If that makes any sense? I do think restricting my hips is not good for me at this point. I think my back will appreciate a more matched turn. I can imagine some other things falling in line this way also..not without putting in the work. But at least I have a picture in my head. Thanks everyone for response.

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Some of the all-time greats allowed their left heel to come up. Hogan, Snead, Nicklaus.

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