Kuchar - Mayakoba Caddie Drama - Your Take?

[MWard]

This thread is still going? Thought this was settled lol


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Apparently it’s now if Cink cheated.

 

[DG_1234]

Saying that Cink cheated is not based on facts in evidence.
.

There is video of Cink's actions within the waste bunker. I think evidence on video is about as factual as evidence can get.

 

[PKorf]

Apparently it’s now if Cink cheated.

Lol I entered and then exited pretty quickly after reading the Cink stuff which basically has nothing to do with the Kuchar story.


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[mikeg_74]

I will say the one good thing that came out of the caddie speaking out is that the theory of him not wanting the true amount coming out because he lived in Mexico was debunked.

People pivoted away from that defense of Kuchar onto something else. Not sure why I didn’t agree with it, but those statements kinda bothered me tbh. Maybe it’s because I work somewhere where we’re not compensated to the same degree as in the States for the same output, and a lot of us have to work pretty darned hard to provide well.


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I think it was a safety concern that someone brought up because that amount of money being made public could put him in danger where he lives. I lived in Mexico for a while and even though we were considered middle class, you still didn’t “flaunt” money or wealth for fear of something happening.

As far as compensation, I get where you’re coming from, but a lot of this is apples and oranges. Do I believe Kuchar paid him less than the 10% a tour caddie gets, yes I do. Do I have an issue with it, no I don’t.

This guy was not a tour caddie, he looped at the resort and up until the Monday or Tuesday of that event he was on the bag of another pro, had an argument that lead to him being kicked off that bag. I’m saying that because this guy was looking at a $0 payday and he ended up with $5k and could have had another $15k based on reports of what he turned down. Good money for a resort caddie for one weeks worth of work imo.

Now does $15k seem light for the win, maybe, but I go back to how he isn’t grinding week in and week out like others on tour. I’m a capitalist and I’m all for a guy getting paid what he feels he is owed, but I don’t like that he made public his negotiations to try and shame/extort Kuchar to paying the $50k he wants.

 

[MWard]

Lol I entered and then exited pretty quickly after reading the Cink stuff which basically has nothing to do with the Kuchar story.


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I’ll move this post to the dad joke thread, but.. seems this thread is Cinking quickly.

I don’t see anything else coming from this Kuchar/caddie situation other than a lot of nonsense and online keyboard warrioring. Thank you, Tom Gillis, for making a stink where it wasn’t yours to make.

 

[PKorf]

I’ll move this post to the dad joke thread, but.. seems this thread is Cinking quickly.

I don’t see anything else coming from this Kuchar/caddie situation other than a lot of nonsense and online keyboard warrioring. Thank you, Tom Gillis, for making a stink where it wasn’t yours to make.

That’s what they do. Over sensationalism at its finest.


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[DG_1234]

Lol I entered and then exited pretty quickly after reading the Cink stuff which basically has nothing to do with the Kuchar story.


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To me the "Kuchar story" is about his reputation. So, to this thread discussion I think it's relevant to mention Cink at Harbour Town 2004, also Fuzzy Zoeller 1997 Masters, Sergio spitting in the cup at Doral 2007, Lexi Thompson Mission Hills 2017 etc...
Each of these cases is a matter of a players words or actions possibly damaging his or her reputation, image, or business marketability.

 

[obedt]

I think it was a safety concern that someone brought up because that amount of money being made public could put him in danger where he lives. I lived in Mexico for a while and even though we were considered middle class, you still didn’t “flaunt” money or wealth for fear of something happening.

As far as compensation, I get where you’re coming from, but a lot of this is apples and oranges. Do I believe Kuchar paid him less than the 10% a tour caddie gets, yes I do. Do I have an issue with it, no I don’t.

This guy was not a tour caddie, he looped at the resort and up until the Monday or Tuesday of that event he was on the bag of another pro, had an argument that lead to him being kicked off that bag. I’m saying that because this guy was looking at a $0 payday and he ended up with $5k and could have had another $15k based on reports of what he turned down. Good money for a resort caddie for one weeks worth of work imo.

Now does $15k seem light for the win, maybe, but I go back to how he isn’t grinding week in and week out like others on tour. I’m a capitalist and I’m all for a guy getting paid what he feels he is owed, but I don’t like that he made public his negotiations to try and shame/extort Kuchar to paying the $50k he wants.

I fully agree with you on the compensation. I thought 20k was enough for the caddie to not have any possible gripe. It does seem like extortion now. I don’t think his actions are defensible at this point. Don’t think we’re far off at all.

I have a completely unrelated story about the dangers of flaunting money, but I never got the vibe of that being the case here. McGillis was the first tour pro to speak up about a potential issue, but there were other pros. My theory is that Kuchar’s popularity is what drove that narrative about the caddie feeling peril at the common knowledge of a huge payday. That a $2k bonus after winning $1.3M is pretty low is still not a popular opinion though, even after the debunking of the original theory.




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[PKorf]

To me the "Kuchar story" is about his reputation. So, to this thread discussion I think it's relevant to mention Cink at Harbour Town 2004, also Fuzzy Zoeller 1997 Masters, Sergio spitting in the cup at Doral 2007, Lexi Thompson Mission Hills 2017 etc...
Each of these cases is a matter of a players words or actions possibly damaging his or her reputation, image, or business marketability.

I will politely disagree. None of those names and instances have anything to do with this non story. All of them have different connotations but none of them have had their reputations ruined let alone even temporarily damaged because of them.

Carry on though. Just seeing if the thread can get back to the non kuchar story instead of all of the conjecture about Stewart Cink. That might need it’s own thread


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[Jman]

So, here’s what I’ve got since I last posted in here.

Cink is a cheater so Kuch is a terrible human.

 

[obedt]

Kuchar - Mayakoba Caddie Drama - Your Take?

I want to add though that in my eyes, Kuchar did a lot to redeem himself by offering a more fair payment after the fact. It’s unfair for me to trash him. The initial payment was way too low, insultingly imo. The other offer was adequate.


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[Lynford]

What has to be done about it? You sound like Cink personally harmed you in some way. The situation was reviewed and decided at the time. Just because you don't agree with the decision does not make it less valid. Calling Cink a cheater over that decision is like treating someone unfavorably because they were charged with a crime even after the trial result is not guilty. Maybe he "got away" with something you wouldn't do but he did not cheat according to the rules officials.

Cink has done far worse than that. He ‘killed Bambi’ in 2009 at Turnberry.

 

[badolds]

Geez I got busy at work and missed 10 pages of super fun discussion. I skimmed it but my eyes started glazing over. I Know you guys will get it figured out but it might be an allnighter. I will check in in the morning.


Have fun!!

 

[tequila4kapp]

I still think Kuchar's getting a raw deal. He apparently agreed to pay a resort looper a guaranteed rate of 5k for 4 days of work, regardless of how he finished in the event. Tour caddies get nothing if their guy misses the cut. 5K equaled roughly what a tour caddie would get for a 20th place finish at a regular event. That's pretty damn generous, IMO. The fact that caddie claims the deal was for an undisclosed percentage if Kuchar won but he now says he thinks 50K would be fair tells me there was no such deal. If there was a percentage agreed to he'd rightfully be asking for that percentage. Something doesn't smell right to me about his story.

 

[sposey013168]

that's just it though. He didn't pay low. At all.

Come on man 5k to be on the winning bag is really low.

Heck all the web.com guys that people from my club caddy for give a flat fee for the loops and 10 percent. It’s not internet talk it is pretty much the standard even on the web tour.




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[campilobaxter]

Come on man 5k to be on the winning bag is really low.

Heck all the web.com guys that people from my club caddy for give a flat fee for the loops and 10 percent. It’s not internet talk it is pretty much the standard even on the web tour.




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What is 10% of a web.com win? Honest question, I don't know know what the purse is.

 

[sposey013168]

I still think Kuchar's getting a raw deal. He apparently agreed to pay a resort looper a guaranteed rate of 5k for 4 days of work, regardless of how he finished in the event. Tour caddies get nothing if their guy misses the cut. 5K equaled roughly what a tour caddie would get for a 20th place finish at a regular event. That's pretty damn generous, IMO. The fact that caddie claims the deal was for an undisclosed percentage if Kuchar won but he now says he thinks 50K would be fair tells me there was no such deal. If there was a percentage agreed to he'd rightfully be asking for that percentage. Something doesn't smell right to me about his story.

I caddied once and many of my buddies caddy every year on the web event every one I know has always been offered 10 percent and honestly the players pray they have to the 10 percent because in means they made money.

I am only referring to real world experience here not internet pay non sense


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[Jman]

Come on man 5k to be on the winning bag is really low.

Heck all the web.com guys that people from my club caddy for give a flat fee for the loops and 10 percent. It’s not internet talk it is pretty much the standard even on the web tour.




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Not if it was agreed upon and Toucan could have been at home sitting on his butt making nothing.

 

[ASN21]

Most will disagree but Kuchar is a dbag in my book now. His nice jolly guy image is gone. Didn’t really root for him before and now will root against.

 

[tequila4kapp]

Come on man 5k to be on the winning bag is really low.

Heck all the web.com guys that people from my club caddy for give a flat fee for the loops and 10 percent. It’s not internet talk it is pretty much the standard even on the web tour.

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Maybe the web.com is different because the purses are lower? It is pretty common knowledge that pga caddies get 1-2k a week and 5% of earnings, with the percent moving up to 10% for a win. So 5K is arguably what a caddie would get for a top 30 type finish. But this caddie had the guaranteed pay out up front, meaning he wasn't taking any risk in exchange for the potential bonus.

 

[sposey013168]

What is 10% of a web.com win? Honest question, I don't know know what the purse is.

Last years winner received 121k

A local guy was on trainers bag and made 22k I saw the check


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[PKorf]

So, here’s what I’ve got since I last posted in here.

Cink is a cheater so Kuch is a terrible human.

This is exactly what my sentiments were too


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[sposey013168]

Not if it was agreed upon and Toucan could have been at home sitting on his butt making nothing.

I agree with that, and don’t care about the drama between kuchar and the caddie.

I am just saying from real world experience 5k is really low and 10 percent is not an internet rumor. It’s the norm from my personal dealings

When I caddied for Guy Boros he argued with me that if he made money he would pay me 10 percent because it is the standard. I did not want money for me as I was just honored to be caddying for him


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[MagicSpell]

Sorry for contributing to the side discussion. I should know better than to get drawn in to a baseless debate.

 

[sposey013168]

Maybe the web.com is different because the purses are lower? It is pretty common knowledge that pga caddies get 1-2k a week and 5% of earnings, with the percent moving up to 10% for a win. So 5K is arguably what a caddie would get for a top 30 type finish. But this caddie had the guaranteed pay out up front, meaning he wasn't taking any risk in exchange for the potential bonus.

It’s not, Tom Pernice (my uncles cousin) always pays per loop and 10 percent, that is straight from his mouth.

Damn me for bringing real world experience into the internet haha.

Back to your regular programming


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