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Kuchar - Mayakoba Caddie Drama - Your Take?

Kuchar - Mayakoba Caddie Drama - Your Take?

DG_1234 said:
Your perspective is shared by the overwhelming majority here, and you may be right.
I really don't know the criteria which corporate sponsors, corporate event hosts , advertisers etc... use to to evaluate and decide which player and how much to pay him/her .
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Unless one of his sponsors was a “tip calculating” or “expense reporting app” like CONCUR.....I dont think this is even close to worthy of losing any sponsorship money or endorsements. Do you really think Skechers (Mark Cuban) gives a crap? Bridgestone?

I guess I’ll ask again, maybe you missed it before. Do you or did you have first hand experience caddying professionally at one time to have these kind of figures readily at hand? No sarcasm. Simple question. I appreciate your opinion, I just don’t agree with it respectfully.


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DG_1234 said:
Your perspective is shared by the overwhelming majority here, and you may be right.
I really don't know the criteria which corporate sponsors, corporate event hosts , advertisers etc... use to to evaluate and decide which player and how much to pay him/her .
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I honestly don't know any of that either but I can't imagine it impacts anything. Other than them giving him crap during negotiations.
 
Dude Sergio full on assaulted and vandalized a golf course, the Euro Tour didn’t even ban him. His sponsors are still there.

Kuchar entered into an agreement and paid him on time and more than agreed upon.

(Yes we can debate should Kuch have paid him $50k of the $1.2m)

No way does this affect Kuchar’s business deals.

Yes he may lose fans and get heckled, but this won’t hurt his off course earning potential in the slightest
 
I want to know how much of a bonus Kuch's regular caddy got. Everyone is saying the 10% is a reward for a career caddy for their total commitment, not just the 5 hours between the ropes every day. By that logic, his regular caddy should get "committed partner" portion of the bonus even if he wasn't there and Tucan should get the bag lugging portion.

Anyway, I think most people will agree that $130k is too much and $2k is too little. Kuchar won by 1 shot. The difference between between 1st and 2nd was $500k. This guy didn't contribute to one shot that helped him win? Even with the language barrier, the guy didn't point down a line, grunt, or anything?

There is a big window between $2k and $130k that Kuchar could have landed. Most of those amounts are a figure that amount to little more than a rounding error in the big picture for a guy who has $45M in on course earnings.

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ohnolan said:
I want to know how much of a bonus Kuch's regular caddy got. Everyone is saying the 10% is a reward for a career caddy for their total commitment, not just the 5 hours between the ropes every day. By that logic, his regular caddy should get "committed partner" portion of the bonus even if he wasn't there and Tucan should get the bag lugging portion.

Anyway, I think most people will agree that $130k is too much and $2k is too little. Kuchar won by 1 shot. The difference between between 1st and 2nd was $500k. This guy didn't contribute to one shot that helped him win? Even with the language barrier, the guy didn't point down a line, grunt, or anything?

There is a big window between $2k and $130k that Kuchar could have landed. Most of those amounts are a figure that amount to little more than a rounding error in the big picture for a guy who has $45M in on course earnings.

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Rather it was before or after the media debacle, Kuch or someone from his team offered an additional 15k. The caddie rejected it.

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If I have learned anything from reading this thread and learning about the controversy, it is that there is a huge opportunity for a national law firm to sponsor the caddies and market their services.
 
JDax said:
I think that everyone can agree that the Caddie was a lousy negotiator....


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El Tucan says: I'll take $3k for the week, plus 3% of your winnings.

Kuchar says: Any other caddies out here who want to make a guaranteed $3k this week?

El Tucan says: I'll take the job.
 
I found this interesting. From the Forbes article linked earlier:



Not every player sticks with the same caddie. Chris Kirk used a pool of caddies in 2014 as he climbed into the top 20 in the world golf rankings. Kirk finished second in the FedEx Cup playoff, which carried a $2.5 million bonus. Kirk took 7% of the bonus money, $175,000, and split it up based on the number of events each caddie worked for him last year.
 
DonJuan said:
Maybe this won't go away. I see the piling on has begun. Short version: Allegedly Kuch yelled at another player's teenage caddie for trying to eat another guys ice cream. Also, he didn't talk to the caddie the entire round. I found this to be incredibly whiny.

https://golf.swingbyswing.com/tour/...c1d41803c1bef162b72a1c7ac8a44098734b7420c9467
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20 years ago Kuchar had his dad caddie for him at the US Open. His playing partners were not too happy about the dad's behavior.
Here is a link to the 1998 US Open story (but no information about 1998 caddie payment).

http://articles.latimes.com/1998/jun/21/sports/sp-62293
 
JB said:
I have no opinion on the subject, but let me ask a generic question since some are running pretty hot on the subject.

Let's say a player hires a local caddie because his/hers falls ill. He/she knows the course pretty well and they agree to an amount to carry the bag. After about a day, he realizes he is playing really well, has a shot, but the caddie has not helped a single bit. In fact they don't communicate at all. Literally nothing, other than player telling caddie what club and caddie carrying clubs from hole to hole.

Player wins "in spite" of not having any assistance, does he owe the caddie a bonus for the work?
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Huge skim job as I’ve only read to this point. We don’t know if that is in truth what happened here. We do know the last guys el tucan caddied for at this event finished top 10 so it’s hard to envision that being reality, but regardless if that was the case- if the deal put forth was a 3k flat fee plus a bonus I would have absolutely paid more than a 2k bonus regardless after the win. I find that amount to be close to an insult, but can see how others have a different viewpoint.

I think 2k bonus after a PGA tour win netting 1.3M shockingly, incredibly cheap.


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jdtox said:
I say no, especially if there was an agreement in place. The finishing position should have no bearing on payment, especially if caddie was essentially doing nothing.
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Per all public reports, the deal was 3k flat fee plus a bonus depending on the payday.


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Paladin said:
This is just my take, but I can't wrap my head around the idea that $3K was acceptable on Wednesday but $5K was insulting on Sunday. The only way it matters is relative to how much Kuchar made. Maybe it's because how much I make is a matter of public record and not series of handshake deals, but I can't bring myself to sweat how much money other people make and try to run it thru some algorithm of how much people are then "owed" as a percentage of someone's paycheck.
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Because in PGa tour events the money that a player heavily influences what a caddy males? And that in this case there was an agreed upon 3k flat fee but on open-ended bonus depending on the winnings?


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obedt said:
Because in PGa tour events the money that a player heavily influences what a caddy males? And that in this case there was an agreed upon 3k flat fee but on open-ended bonus depending on the winnings?


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But open ended bonus means player can tip what he feels the caddie was worth. Clearly Kuch didn’t think he contributed much.
 
jdtox said:
But open ended bonus means player can tip what he feels the caddie was worth. Clearly Kuch didn’t think he contributed much.
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But I think it is it ok to think Kuchar was cheap based on that cheapass bonus. I mean, in the world of caddies it’s pretty damn close to an all time low % payout. That this percentage per winnings is really low isn’t an arguable point, can it?


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obedt said:
But I think it is it ok to think Kuchar was cheap based on that cheapass bonus. I mean, in the world of caddies it’s pretty damn close to an all time low % payout. That this percentage per winnings is really low isn’t an arguable point, can it?


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I think it’s fine to think Kuch is cheap nothing wrong with that. It is a low payout but there has to be a reason in my opinion other than Kuch is a cheapskate. If he was he would have a hard time finding a caddy I would think
 
jdtox said:
I think it’s fine to think Kuch is cheap nothing wrong with that. It is a low payout but there has to be a reason in my opinion other than Kuch is a cheapskate. If he was he would have a hard time finding a caddy I would think
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Well, there appear to be multiple pga tour pros stating Kuchar is cheap. If that’s his one character flaw, it’s much better than most others. But it does appear to be true.


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obedt said:
Well, there appear to be multiple pga tour pros stating Kuchar is cheap. If that’s his one character flaw, it’s much better than most others. But it does appear to be true.


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I could see that. Tiger was famous for being a combination of cheap and oblivious to things like that.

Tour is certainly not short of that.
 
Canadan said:
I could see that. Tiger was famous for being a combination of cheap and oblivious to things like that.

Tour is certainly not short of that.
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Despite all my comments here, I don’t think it’s a big deal. If he’s “cheap”, so be it. He’s in the public spotlight so it will be highlighted some, but it isn’t a huge deal and doesn’t make him an awful human being. None of us are perfect, including Matt.


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obedt said:
Despite all my comments here, I don’t think it’s a big deal. If he’s “cheap”, so be it. He’s in the public spotlight so it will be highlighted some, but it isn’t a huge deal and doesn’t make him an awful human being. None of us are perfect, including Matt.


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I'm kinda like you. I find the conversation here is interesting. I like seeing the different viewpoints. I seldom care what someone does with his/her money. I do get annoyed when people throw around words like "deserve" and "fair." When I was teaching, I wouldn't even let students say those words in the classroom. Different strokes...
 
Don’t all people deserve to be treated fairly?

Oops. Now I did it. Just joking of course.


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I'd love to make $5K working this week.

Dave
 
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