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Is pace of play *actually* hurting the game?

something interesting yesterday. We got off at 8:10 in the morning. Only 1 or 2 groups in front of us. We maybe waited a total of 5 minutes all day. At end of round, we were maybe 3 minutes behind group in front of us. The group behind us was about a hole or 10 min behind us. We looked at the watch, 4:20 min round. Same course prior weekend with lots of waiting and we were almost 5 hours. Still, it got us thinking. How did it take us 4:20 when we have played same course during winter golf in 3:45 to 3:50? Heat is our best guess but we don't know. We always play ready golf, we were not held up, we did not hold anyone else up. We seemed to move fast but not nearly as fast as winter golf.
 
DG_1234;n8880857 said:
If you are consistently waiting on the group in front of you, and there is a hole or more open ahead of them, but you cannot get their attention to ask their permission to play thru, then telephoning the pro shop is an option you can use. At that point the shop should send someone out in a cart to tell the slow group to step aside and let you play thru.
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I work at the course so I try not to push too much. Will happily do that at other courses though. I usually walk as well so that makes it slightly harder. If I have a cart I just go to an open hole and go back later.
 
pmm21;n8875422 said:
And many more have been given that don't feel it is. The whole point of this thread was to argue against, what feels more and more like a marketing tactic.

Next we need to ask ourselves what defines pace of play?

Is it taking 20 practice swings, not playing ready golf, etc? Or is it players who don't play as well as the one complaining about pace?

If you go through the numerous posts on this thread, many of the stories regarding a slow day on the course recount tales of players who aren't very good at the game.

That is a huge detriment to the game as a whole, to make newer (or just bad players) feel that they should stay home rather than come out in order to not upset the elites who dictate pace.

Posted by my thumbs.
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Well After today, do you still believe that slow play doesn't hurt the game?

With a player in the group in front of you laying down and resting on the green.

Do you believe that he was playing "Ready Golf"?

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Johan185;n8906310 said:
Well After today, do you still believe that slow play doesn't hurt the game?

With a player in the group in front of you laying down and resting on the green.

Do you believe that he was playing "Ready Golf"?

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Haha absolutely not. But in their (and my argument's) defense, they let us play through as soon as we caught them on a tee box

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Posted by my thumbs.
 
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KEV;n8880819 said:
Yesterday I had a situation where our total round time wasn't terrible (4 1/2 hours) but my playing partners were pretty slow and we were constantly a hole behind the group ahead of us and the group behind would often be waiting on us.

I watched one of them pull a Bryson and take 2 minutes to Aimpoint, stalk all angles and back off the 8 foot putt before missing it. Several times two of the guys also weren't ready when it was their shot and backed off multiple times.

I've learned that nothing will throw me off more than slow play and I'm not sure how to adapt to it.
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I really hate slow play. But learning to not let the pace of play ruin your game is Priceless.

Maybe we can start sharing how each of us handle slow play.

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About slow play on the Tour, slow players truly affect the player(s) in their group. Very frustrating for a Tour player to have to watch a player take 1-2 minutes, sometimes longer, to play their shot or their putt.
 
OnePuttLarry;n8907001 said:
About slow play on the Tour, slow players truly affect the player(s) in their group. Very frustrating for a Tour player to have to watch a player take 1-2 minutes, sometimes longer, to play their shot or their putt.
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but in some sense......and much like ourselves......thats only right up till its their own turn in which then that person will take all the time he needs.
 
rollin;n8907098 said:
but in some sense......and much like ourselves......thats only right up till its their own turn in which then that person will take all the time he needs.
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Our Men’s Club penalizes slow players & the PGA Tour should do the same. A slow player on Tour can greatly affect his playing partner(s) game, negatively.
 
OnePuttLarry;n8907811 said:
Our Men’s Club penalizes slow players & the PGA Tour should do the same. A slow player on Tour can greatly affect his playing partner(s) game, negatively.[/QUOTE
Honestly, I dont believe it affects their game. It may annoy some of them but if it really affected their game they simply wouldn't make it as a tour pro.
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pmm21 said:
Haha absolutely not. But in their (and my argument's) defense, they let us play through as soon as we caught them on a tee box

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Posted by my thumbs.
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Today after my group teed off, we watched and waited on each shot on the opening Par 5 Hole.

We then drove up to the next tee at he second hole, only to see a group finish hitting their first shot. As they drove away, we could not believe that we were the three group in the line up.

After watching and waiting 45 minutes, and still not having even hitting our first shot on the par 4 second hole. We decided to go to Denny's for breakfast.

There was a group on the fairway, a group waiting to hit on the tee box and our group waiting in our golf carts. If we had stayed, it would have been over 6 hours to play 18 holes.

We were given a full refund. The Golf Pro understood, clearly we were not unreasonable expecting to have completed more than one hole after a 50 minute wait. Most courses pace of play have you complete the first 4 holes in 60 minutes. Not one hole per hour.

So yes Pace of Play is affecting Recreational Golfing. To the point of leading to me driving away from the course after one Hole.

No one in our group hesitated. No one had any regrets. And Breakfast was Delicious.
086d356553640a2088016881789cfd26.jpg


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Johan185 said:
Today after my group teed off, we watched and waited on each shot on the opening Par 5 Hole.

We then drove up to the next tee at he second hole, only to see a group finish hitting their first shot. As they drove away, we could not believe that we were the three group in the line up.

After watching and waiting 45 minutes, and still not having even hitting our first shot on the par 4 second hole. We decided to go to Denny's for breakfast.

There was a group on the fairway, a group waiting to hit on the tee box and our group waiting in our golf carts. If we had stayed, it would have been over 6 hours to play 18 holes.

We were given a full refund. The Golf Pro understood, clearly we were not unreasonable expecting to have completed more than one hole after a 50 minute wait. Most courses pace of play have you complete the first 4 holes in 60 minutes. Not one hole per hour.

So yes Pace of Play is affecting Recreational Golfing. To the point of leading to me driving away from the course after one Hole.

No one in our group hesitated. No one had any regrets. And Breakfast was Delicious.
086d356553640a2088016881789cfd26.jpg


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Where was this?
 
I played a 2:30 min round of a easy 9 hole course and it was BRUTAL!

It makes me not want to play. It's hard to find and keep a rhythm going.

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pmm21 said:
Where was this?
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River Ridge, Ventura County, California.

Vineyard Course. The greens are running 11 to 12 on the Stimpmeter and in perfect condition.

A beautiful Sunny Sunday morning.

95a86709ee56d7a4e516c7b8f781f6c5.jpg


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Played with a guy today that had a long setup routine and he sucked!!!! One of these read the putt from 3 directions and then miss the 6 footer every time. There were times we fell over 1 hole behind. Fortunately I was able to get us caught up by suggesting we need to move a bit faster.

I wish I taped it because it was almost comical.
 
Played the Encino Golf course in the Sepulveda golf complex. A 36 hole Municipal Golf course in Encino.

From the Tips our 3 some finished in 3.25 hours. 7023 yards. 250 yard par 3's.

Happy to find out that pace of play is still a possibility.

@pmm21
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Johan185 said:
River Ridge, Ventura County, California.

Vineyard Course. The greens are running 11 to 12 on the Stimpmeter and in perfect condition.

A beautiful Sunny Sunday morning.

95a86709ee56d7a4e516c7b8f781f6c5.jpg


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the pic you posted prior to this is most certainly not River Ridge.
 
pmm21 said:
the pic you posted prior to this is most certainly not River Ridge.
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Must be another Ventura County Track.

I post the best pictures from my current batch to share the beauty of golf.

Cheers.

Olivas? Maybe....

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Here's one from River Ridge @pmm21
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pmm21 said:
I know what River Ridge looks like. Neither River Ridge or Olivas are lined with mountains.
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First Hole at River Ridge. What you confuse for Mountains are the many Hills left from the Garbage Dump.

Many aren't aware, but River Ridge was built on a now Closed Garbage Dump. The trash was piled up high and can give the appearance of Mountains. Depending on the vantage point.

They currently syphon gas, or Methane from the large mounds that we play golf on. It is sold and covers the cost of operations for the 36 hole Facility.

So most of the Vineyard course sits on the top of the Mounds of Trash. And the Victoria Lakes course snakes through the Valleys surrounding the huge heaps of yesterday's manure.

And yes the guys on the green are talking after they finished putting, while two Foursomes wait on the fairway to complete this hole.

I took a video of the putting and relaxing on the green but didn't post it for the sake of fairness to them. They littering had no ware to go after they putted. There were two other foursomes on the second hole waiting to tee off.

Have a blast in San Diego.

Cheers my friend

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Johan185 said:
Today after my group teed off, we watched and waited on each shot on the opening Par 5 Hole.

We then drove up to the next tee at he second hole, only to see a group finish hitting their first shot. As they drove away, we could not believe that we were the three group in the line up.

After watching and waiting 45 minutes, and still not having even hitting our first shot on the par 4 second hole. We decided to go to Denny's for breakfast.

There was a group on the fairway, a group waiting to hit on the tee box and our group waiting in our golf carts. If we had stayed, it would have been over 6 hours to play 18 holes.

We were given a full refund. The Golf Pro understood, clearly we were not unreasonable expecting to have completed more than one hole after a 50 minute wait. Most courses pace of play have you complete the first 4 holes in 60 minutes. Not one hole per hour.

So yes Pace of Play is affecting Recreational Golfing. To the point of leading to me driving away from the course after one Hole.

No one in our group hesitated. No one had any regrets. And Breakfast was Delicious.
086d356553640a2088016881789cfd26.jpg


Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk
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Johan! I don't care about garbage dumps. The above picture which you have posted is not River Ridge. All I am asking is where did you take it? It looks like a nice course.
 
pmm21 said:
Johan! I don't care about garbage dumps. The above picture which you have posted is not River Ridge. All I am asking is where did you take it? It looks like a nice course.
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I will retake the picture from the same location next week and include the GPS coordinates. Time Stamped on the GIF file. In fact it is probably already time and GPS stamped on the meta data that is included on all digital pictures taken these days.

One of the Geniuses who knows knows about hacking, either of my Sons for example, can pull the information from the file same on the Hackers Paradise file.

But cheers and applause for your Small Batch Experience.

We are all Jelly and Happy for you.

But this is River Ridge. Vineyard course. Left side of the fairway. From 100 yards. Zoomed in 10X. First hole.

Sorry that this view is not what you expect.

What you believe is a mountain is actually a work shed in the background behind the 7th tee box.

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Who says you can't find mountain courses in California?

@Space Bandito
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I play regularly with between 10 or so guys on a whoever is available basis. At our local courses, which are all part of a county system, you have to work somewhat hard to get the first tee times which are released a week in advance online. NONE of us will play if we don't get one of the first few times in the morning because the pace of play can be 4.5 hours after those first few times. Some folks will of course will feel that 4.5 hours is perfectly fine, and that's great for them, but the thread was basically about whether pace impacts golf revenue and from direct experience the answer for me is yes, as on those days we couldn't get the early time, we don't play.
 
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