Could Use Some Advice Here: Long Post

[Sean]

As some of you know I'm a senior. At out club I always play the back tees because our tournaments are played from the back tees and I feel in order to be competitive I need to practice from back there. However, it's a bit of a struggle for me.

It's a nine hole course that we play twice. Two of the holes (times two) I can very rarely get to in regulation. Both are always into the wind and during tournaments play 440 yards long and are riddled with hazards. A few other holes I have no business hitting driver (way too narrow), but the greens are too small and surrounded by too many hazards to approach with a mid-iron or longer. If I hit a 5-wood off the tee I'll have a mid-iron or more into the green.

One of the par 3's is always into the wind and is 180 from all the way back. You can a little bit short and a little bit right, but that's it. Anything else is toast. Today was a two club wind...hitting a 5-wood into a small green surrounded by trouble is no bargain. :-0

Anyway, I shot a 41 today...unusual...my short game and putting was very good, but what fun is it to constantly scramble?

The other day I played from the middle tees just to see what would happen and shot a 35. I started out birdie, birdie, par. Hole 2, which I struggle to reach in regulation from the back tees, was driver, 7-iron. How refreshing.

So, I'm thinking of bowing out of the tournaments and just playing the middle tees. That's not to say I won't have my share of bad rounds from the middle tees, but at least I'll give myself better opportunities for GIRs, won't be struggling to reach some of the par 4's (and in some cases having to lay-up on some of the par 4's), and maybe even reaching a par 5 in two.

What do you think of bowing out of the tournaments? I like tournament play, but as they are formatted now I just think they are a bit unfair for folks my age. Yes, they are adjusted for HI, but that's not the point. I don't want to be laying up on par 4's, hitting woods on par 3's, etc. To me that's not golf. I'd rather lose a few strokes and play from tees that are more commensurate with my abilities. In any case I'm thinking of bagging the tournaments altogether.

 

[Beowulf]

Sean, golf is a game. Games are supposed to be challenging, but fun. It sounds to me like you already know what to do. Forget the tournaments until they truly compensate for what father time does to all of us. Play the middle tees and enjoy life!

 

[DevRickus]

I have alwaye been of the philosophy of playing to yiur abilities. There is no reason to play from the back tees if it causes you to struggle and end up not enjoying your round. This is a game and is meant to be enjoyed. Play from the middle tees and enjoy yourself.


Tap tap taparoo

 

[DawgDaddy]

Hard to say Sean, do you really think you would miss playing in the tournaments? Is there a senior league or like in my case weekly blitz that you can play with others that are more the same in distance? I enjoy playing, but my length now dictates that I play courses no longer than 6300 yards or it is just not very much fun as you said, hitting a 5 wood into a par 4 is no fun, and being completely unable to reach a par 4 in 2 is even worse. I personally agree with playing the tees that make the game fun, not make the game more like work.

 

[KellyBo]

In our state, there are many senior groups who travel around and play in tournaments. They play from senior tees and super senior tees depending on age. Surely there are groups in your area that you could join and enjoy from the appropriate tees. I'm glad our club lets people play tees appropriate to their age because there is no way most of our seniors could play from the back tees and not be frustrated.

 

[Golf 'N Gator]

Well, I'm 49 and I'm pretty much in the same boat. Tournaments at my course for men means any age up to age 55. For these tournaments, the back tees are normally moved even further back and this makes it nearly impossible for guys my age to keep up with the guys in their 20's and 30's. For this reason, I have just been sitting things out this year. Our club championship has also simply become too long for me as the course is stretched to the limits length wise. At age 55 I can move to the senior stuff but I'm caught right now in neither land.

I feel your pain.

 

[Canadan]

Are you a member of that course? Do they have a tournament committee? Why not get a voice in and see if they would be willing to allow a senior division that plays from tees closer to the hole. Cite the PGA and USGA initiatives to put players into reasonable distances.

 

[Sean]

Sean, golf is a game. Games are supposed to be challenging, but fun. It sounds to me like you already know what to do. Forget the tournaments until they truly compensate for what father time does to all of us. Play the middle tees and enjoy life!

Thanks Beowulf. It's challenging enough from the middle tees. I would miss the competition, but the struggle. Please give my regards to Grendel.

I have alwaye been of the philosophy of playing to yiur abilities. There is no reason to play from the back tees if it causes you to struggle and end up not enjoying your round. This is a game and is meant to be enjoyed. Play from the middle tees and enjoy yourself.
Tap tap taparoo

Not only struggling Dev, but feeling a bit of stress as well. Thanks for posting.

Hard to say Sean, do you really think you would miss playing in the tournaments? Is there a senior league or like in my case weekly blitz that you can play with others that are more the same in distance? I enjoy playing, but my length now dictates that I play courses no longer than 6300 yards or it is just not very much fun as you said, hitting a 5 wood into a par 4 is no fun, and being completely unable to reach a par 4 in 2 is even worse. I personally agree with playing the tees that make the game fun, not make the game more like work.

It is like work DD. Hitting a wood into a green riddled with hazards is work. The other option is to layup. Ugh. I would miss the tournaments, but I have to weigh that against playing a lot more golf and having a lot more fun over missing just a few tournaments. Unfortunately there are no senior leagues. There is a men's league that alternately plays back tees/middle tees. I just need to find the time to get involved in that.

 

[Chunkylover77]

I would continue to play the tournaments and move up a tee box. You should enjoy your rounds which is why I would move up. I would check to see if you can have the tournaments move the boxes up as well for the more mature golfers

 

[Sean]

In our state, there are many senior groups who travel around and play in tournaments. They play from senior tees and super senior tees depending on age. Surely there are groups in your area that you could join and enjoy from the appropriate tees. I'm glad our club lets people play tees appropriate to their age because there is no way most of our seniors could play from the back tees and not be frustrated.

We don't have any senior groups that I could find. I joined a "tour" group a couple of years ago and they told me I'd be playing from appropriate tees. My first tournament they had me play from 6800 yards (they told me my HI dictated I play from there). One hole the drive was a 240 yard carry. I had to hit a wedge to the ladies tees and proceed from there. Your club sounds enlightened.

Well, I'm 49 and I'm pretty much in the same boat. Tournaments at my course for men means any age up to age 55. For these tournaments, the back tees are normally moved even further back and this makes it nearly impossible for guys my age to keep up with the guys in their 20's and 30's. For this reason, I have just been sitting things out this year. Our club championship has also simply become too long for me as the course is stretched to the limits length wise. At age 55 I can move to the senior stuff but I'm caught right now in neither land.

I feel your pain.

That stinks Hoosier. Heck, even the Champions Tour starts at 50.

Are you a member of that course? Do they have a tournament committee? Why not get a voice in and see if they would be willing to allow a senior division that plays from tees closer to the hole. Cite the PGA and USGA initiatives to put players into reasonable distances.

I've already spoken to them Canadan. They told me that the HI are adjusted. I said I'd be will to give up a few strokes to play from the middle tees as opposed to the back tees, but no go. I even discussed the new initiative by the PGA, USGA, and Golf Course Superintendents Association to get folks to move up, but they couldn't be swayed. They understood where I was coming from, but insisted the course handicap adjustments was enough...but it's not, really, if you're laying up on par 4's etc. As I said, that's not golf.

 

[Golf 'N Gator]

To me this plays into the whole idea behind the "Play it forward" campaign; http://www.usga.org/news/2011/May/%E2%80%98Tee-It-Forward%E2%80%99-To-Increase-Enjoyment-Of-The-Game/

I'm planning for the next few years to just play to have fun and I'll get back into competitive golf once I hit age 55. It is just impossible to compete with the college aged guys at my course who are now winning everything. No one over age 41 has ever won our mens club championship in 52 years, but you are forced to play in it up to age 55. Makes no sense to me.

I think every event should be set up like the USGA events with a regular group, a mid group, senior group and a super senior if needed. Most simply have a regular and a senior and there is just too big of a age spread.

I stopped playing in our county amateur because you must be 55 as well for the senior group. All us guys in the age 40/45 to 55 are in limbo it seems.

 

[TripleBogieTim]

I am starting to feel your pain too, I am a few months away from turning 48 and have lost a few yards(okay more than a few) and at my home course all tournament rounds are played from the tips which is just shy of 7000 yards! The 18th hole is a 493 yard par 4 which always plays into the wind and when you are as close to the coast as I am can be a 2 or 3 club wind at times!! (I've hit driver, 3 wood and still be short more than once)

The course has 4 tees and the next set up still plays almost 6600 yards, compared to the senior tees which play just under 6000. I play from the blues (6600 yards) but I really struggle when it comes to tournament time.

Oh, and my course rates the senior tees for 55 and over as well.

 

[Golf 'N Gator]

I am starting to feel your pain too, I am a few months away from turning 48 and have lost a few yards(okay more than a few) and at my home course all tournament rounds are played from the tips which is just shy of 7000 yards! The 18th hole is a 493 yard par 4 which always plays into the wind and when you are as close to the coast as I am can be a 2 or 3 club wind at times!! (I've hit driver, 3 wood and still be short more than once)

The course has 4 tees and the next set up still plays almost 6600 yards, compared to the senior tees which play just under 6000. I play from the blues (6600 yards) but I really struggle when it comes to tournament time.

Oh, and my course rates the senior tees for 55 and over as well.

WOW! Nearly 7000 yards and a more forward set at 6600 yards! What were they thinking when they setup the course so long? 6000 for seniors is even a pretty good stretch I think. Looks to me like they need to shave about 400 yards or so off of each set of tees. None of us want it to be super easy, but it should not be impossible either.

I know I'm having a lot more fun playing up a little right now. Been a long time since I have been able to have a chance to be on some of our par 5's in two. Lot more fun.

 

[Canadan]

I've already spoken to them Canadan. They told me that the HI are adjusted. I said I'd be will to give up a few strokes to play from the middle tees as opposed to the back tees, but no go. I even discussed the new initiative by the PGA, USGA, and Golf Course Superintendents Association to get folks to move up, but they couldn't be swayed. They understood where I was coming from, but insisted the course handicap adjustments was enough...but it's not, really, if you're laying up on par 4's etc. As I said, that's not golf.

I'm really sorry to hear that Sean. I definitely sympathize with you as many of my regular playing partners are in the +55 category and struggle to play from the "tournament" or gold tees, yet refuse to move up because they don't want their handicap adjusted, just as you've expressed concern with.

In my opinion, a couple of tourneys a year isn't worth laying up for.

 

[Sean]

I would continue to play the tournaments and move up a tee box. You should enjoy your rounds which is why I would move up. I would check to see if you can have the tournaments move the boxes up as well for the more mature golfers

That's not a bad idea CL. The only thing is, my HI would drop and when I did move back to play from the back tees I'd be at a disadvantage. I asked about having the tees moved up for the seniors, but they said no...that the course handicap adjustments would take care of that.

 

[Sean]

To me this plays into the whole idea behind the "Play it forward" campaign; http://www.usga.org/news/2011/May/%E2%80%98Tee-It-Forward%E2%80%99-To-Increase-Enjoyment-Of-The-Game/

I'm planning for the next few years to just play to have fun and I'll get back into competitive golf once I hit age 55. It is just impossible to compete with the college aged guys at my course who are now winning everything. No one over age 41 has ever won our mens club championship in 52 years, but you are forced to play in it up to age 55. Makes no sense to me.

I think every event should be set up like the USGA events with a regular group, a mid group, senior group and a super senior if needed. Most simply have a regular and a senior and there is just too big of a age spread.

I stopped playing in our county amateur because you must be 55 as well for the senior group. All us guys in the age 40/45 to 55 are in limbo it seems.

Gee, if no one over 41 has one in 52 years shouldn't that tell someone something? It's too bad because you guys are left out of playing tournament golf...at least and be competitive.

 

[Sean]

I am starting to feel your pain too, I am a few months away from turning 48 and have lost a few yards(okay more than a few) and at my home course all tournament rounds are played from the tips which is just shy of 7000 yards! The 18th hole is a 493 yard par 4 which always plays into the wind and when you are as close to the coast as I am can be a 2 or 3 club wind at times!! (I've hit driver, 3 wood and still be short more than once)

The course has 4 tees and the next set up still plays almost 6600 yards, compared to the senior tees which play just under 6000. I play from the blues (6600 yards) but I really struggle when it comes to tournament time.

Oh, and my course rates the senior tees for 55 and over as well.

That's just silly Tim. That 18th hole would be driver, 5-wood, and some kind of wedge for me. What fun is that? 7000 yards? Unless people are averaging like 280 off the tee that's way too far back.

 

[Sean]

I'm really sorry to hear that Sean. I definitely sympathize with you as many of my regular playing partners are in the +55 category and struggle to play from the "tournament" or gold tees, yet refuse to move up because they don't want their handicap adjusted, just as you've expressed concern with.

In my opinion, a couple of tourneys a year isn't worth laying up for.

You hit the nail on the head Canadan.

 

[KellyBo]

That's not a bad idea CL. The only thing is, my HI would drop and when I did move back to play from the back tees I'd be at a disadvantage. I asked about having the tees moved up for the seniors, but they said no...that the course handicap adjustments would take care of that.

Have you looked at the difference in slope ratings to see how much difference there would be from each tee box? At our course the forward tees are rated much lower and give you about 4-5 strokes higher handicap than if you shot the same score further back. Also, when you play in tournaments you might have say a 12 from the forward tees but a 14 from the back. Check into the differences to make sure. It should even out.

 

[junior lefty]

Wow, I'm in the exact same position as you haha. My coach made me play the tips yesterday, and on every hole I was hitting driver 5 iron or more on every hole. Some I even hit a 3 wood for an approach on a par 4. It is no fun to scramble all day, so I know how you are feeling. For me, its given me an opportunity to work on my short game while I work out to get longer off the tee, and it could do the same for you. I wouldn't not do tournaments just for this reason. Even if you don't place, it gives you good examples of the pressure you would feel on chips and pitches, which can be the easiest place to mess up under pressure. Just because you don't score well doesn't mean you aren't getting better. I shot a 42 from the middle tees, but when I played the tips, my short game was a huge amount better than when I shot the 42. Just keep on straightening your drives and don't get discouraged. Hitting from the fairway makes a huge difference.

 

[Sean]

Have you looked at the difference in slope ratings to see how much difference there would be from each tee box? At our course the forward tees are rated much lower and give you about 4-5 strokes higher handicap than if you shot the same score further back. Also, when you play in tournaments you might have say a 12 from the forward tees but a 14 from the back. Check into the differences to make sure. It should even out.

I did Kelly. From the back tees the slope is 127 and the middle tees it's 124. The course handicap differential is only 1 stroke based on my HI, but I play the middle tees on average five to seven strokes better.

 

[jnug]

Sean I know the tourney you are worried about bowing out of and I guess that tourney plays from the blacks right? I myself play from the blues as that is really the right tee box for me. While the tourney you are in now plays the blacks I would think you could get onto one that allows play from the middle tees, maybe even one that is designed for guys that are older like you and me.

I was at the range the other day and one of the teaching pros had a young guy in a lesson. He was obviously in his very early twenties, strong and limber, limber like a forgone memory for me. Anyway the teaching pro was trying to get him to build up torque and release it as power, more or less exploding into the ball. Where have we heard this before? Anyway he says to the kid "If I asked a 45 year old guy to do what I am asking you to do he would leave the range limping". I have yet to find anything too wonderful about this age thing and golf is one of those things ending up on the wrong side of the ledger.

 

[Sean]

Wow, I'm in the exact same position as you haha. My coach made me play the tips yesterday, and on every hole I was hitting driver 5 iron or more on every hole. Some I even hit a 3 wood for an approach on a par 4. It is no fun to scramble all day, so I know how you are feeling. For me, its given me an opportunity to work on my short game while I work out to get longer off the tee, and it could do the same for you. I wouldn't not do tournaments just for this reason. Even if you don't place, it gives you good examples of the pressure you would feel on chips and pitches, which can be the easiest place to mess up under pressure. Just because you don't score well doesn't mean you aren't getting better. I shot a 42 from the middle tees, but when I played the tips, my short game was a huge amount better than when I shot the 42. Just keep on straightening your drives and don't get discouraged. Hitting from the fairway makes a huge difference.

I agree JL, you have to keep the ball in the fairway...and you have to have a very good short game, which I work on incessantly for that very reason. BUT, you reach a point where you get tired of scrambling all the time. lol. Today I shot an 83 from the back tees (42/41), but there was a lot of scrambling.

 

[Sean]

Sean I know the tourney you are worried about bowing out of and I guess that tourney plays from the blacks right? I myself play from the blues as that is really the right tee box for me. While the tourney you are in now plays the blacks I would think you could get onto one that allows play from the middle tees, maybe even one that is designed for guys that are older like you and me.

I was at the range the other day and one of the teaching pros had a young guy in a lesson. He was obviously in his very early twenties, strong and limber, limber like a forgone memory for me. Anyway the teaching pro was trying to get him to build up torque and release it as power, more or less exploding into the ball. Where have we heard this before? Anyway he says to the kid "If I asked a 45 year old guy to do what I am asking you to do he would leave the range limping". I have yet to find anything too wonderful about this age thing and golf is one of those things ending up on the wrong side of the ledger.

LOL! I see those kids on the range all the time. I get sore just watching them. I play in a few of the MGA Member Days events and their quite long for me. The last one I played was quite windy. They make no distinction between age, so I could be teeing it up with a 22 year old who hits it 290 from the same tee box. A 426 yard par four dead into the wind is quite a challenge for me. I asked the MGA if they would consider having tee boxes for their senior members and they said, "No." lol.

 

[KellyBo]

I did Kelly. From the back tees the slope is 127 and the middle tees it's 124. The course handicap differential is only 1 stroke based on my HI, but I play the middle tees on average five to seven strokes better.

Wow, not much help then. If it were me, I would probably play both sets of tees. In fact I do that now. If I am playing with the ladies, I play the red and if I'm playing with the guys, I usually play the gold. I get to play a lot of different clubs and it has actually helped me when I go to other courses to play.