Coming Up Short - A Golf Epidemic?

[Fourputt]

My chart would not be as bad as that one, but it would probably tend toward short more than long. The reason is because most courses I play, long is the worst miss. Long is anything from minor trouble to completely dead. When I'm indecisive, I'll usually go with the shorter club because I'd rather be bunkered and hitting to an upslope rather than in rough trying to pitch from an uneven lie to a downslope. I have a pretty good general idea of how far I hit my irons, so only worse than usual mishits factor into that pattern.

When the hole is cut near the front, I'm more likely to be past it than short. I don't usually mind putting downhill, as long as it isn't a ridiculous slope.

 

[bigapplehacker]

My chart would not be as bad as that one, but it would probably tend toward short more than long. The reason is because most courses I play, long is the worst miss. Long is anything from minor trouble to completely dead. When I'm indecisive, I'll usually go with the shorter club because I'd rather be bunkered and hitting to an upslope rather than in rough trying to pitch from an uneven lie to a downslope. I have a pretty good general idea of how far I hit my irons, so only worse than usual mishits factor into that pattern.

When the hole is cut near the front, I'm more likely to be past it than short. I don't usually mind putting downhill, as long as it isn't a ridiculous slope.

Great topic. I've launched my fair share, but it's usually a snap hook when I do so. Late last season I started to club down more with better results.

I believe the better results are a result of me not trying to swing too hard, which in turn leaves me sometimes not striking the ball as flushly and leaving it short about as often as when I'd try to hit an 8i 155 yards. But less snap hooks OB. Cooler weather probably has something to do with it as well.

First time, long time. Great board. Hit me up if you want to hit a muni in the nyc area. (The snow is melting!) Van Cortland is my home course.


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[Maddog701]

Does the chart above, with the reflection of your own golf game, make you consider more forgiving irons? This is assuming forgiveness comes in a distance package as well as a lateral package.

for me it is more about how I am playing that particular round. when I am hitting the ball well, if I have a miss it is long left,(nuked) and a little pull, when my timing is off a bit and I am not hitting it square I will miss short and right.

 

[Tadashi70]

I don't think about my miss when I pull a club. If I have a yardage I pull accordingly based on the conditions at hand. I miss right or left of my target on average. If I miss its hardly ever short of the green and usually pin high. But I think we are asking for problems if you start the process playing for a miss.

 

[tahoebum]

I learned in high school after our coach for a entire week had us track how many feet short of pin high we were. Until that time I was coming up more that 10 feet of pin high 80% of the time. Since then I would say that I'm within 10 feet of pin high or past the pin all but a few times each round.

 

[amsmith61]

Really like this thread and this has come up in a couple of recent conversations with both the Callaway fitter at the Grandaddy and my instructor. My tendency has been to come up short. During my fitting at the Grandaddy, I hit the both the Apex Pros and the Apex. Distance wise they were similar in yardage, but what was interesting was the yardage I lost on mishits for both sets of irons. He was able to show me the difference between the two sets and it was those numbers that ultimately led to a decision between the fitter and I about the Apex being the best fit for me based on that forgiveness.

Recently my instructor and I have started talking a lot about strategy and my game management. I took a couple of shots from the last day of the Grandaddy as examples that I felt really could have changed the day for me. During our conversations, the main theme from her was that I was expecting to hit a club the exact yardage I knew it flew, when I hit pure - everytime. She wants me to focus this spring on instead of trying to get the maximum distance from a club to instead club up and choke down to prevent myself from coming up short.

So this topic has been on my mind quite a bit. Great conversation!

 

[tgtt]

I do club up at times and it usually seems like a mistake. I swing easier, make better contact, and the balls goes too far. So, with my normal swing with bad tempo and rhythm I make worse contact and miss more often short, left, and right. Also, I play with a lot of guys, and I'm guilty at times myself, that don't give temp and wind enough of a factor. It seems what most consider a 1 club wind is usually a 2 or 3 club wind so that will skew those numbers to the short side as well.

 

[SHIFTY]

I miss short, but I believe its because missing long almost always is harder than missing short. So my club selection is picked so if I error its short, as I never hit too many greens. More my course management due to my bad swing, than misses. I really hope to rectify that problem this year.

 

[Plin]

This is interesting. I think the advice for most people from pros is to club up. But I've always felt going long is no better than short, especially on some holes, you can't just arbitrarily club up, in attempt to counter the off center hit. Say you hit it flush, all of a sudden you are 10, 15 yards over the target over the green, with a lot of greens sloping back to front, meaning you have a high flop with green running away from you.

Clubbing up means lower loft, equals a even more difficult club to center strike than the club you were suppose to hit. Personally, short is not the worst thing that can happen. I say, know your yardages, the minimums and trust it. Strategize and know where not to miss. Most the time, short is better than long.

 

[rbarthle17]

My main strategy when dealing with any approach shot is to aim at the center of the green, and to play away from the bad miss on a hole. Most times that tends to be long where I play. Doing a quick mental inventory of the courses I play most I would put the number of holes where long is really bad at easily over 70%. I do come up short from longer distances a lot, but if long won't be very penal I will definitely think more about clubbing up.

 

[golfinFF]

I don't think about my miss when I pull a club. If I have a yardage I pull accordingly based on the conditions at hand. I miss right or left of my target on average. If I miss its hardly ever short of the green and usually pin high. But I think we are asking for problems if you start the process playing for a miss.

Freddie honest question do you think the left/right miss but pin high is because your a better ball striker with better distance control, than say a 25hc who isn't a great ball striker?

 

[Tadashi70]

The average mid to high handicap player doesn't hit it flush every time so clubbing up is warranted. Blowing way over the green almost never happens.

This is interesting. I think the advice for most people from pros is to club up. But I've always felt going long is no better than short, especially on some holes, you can't just arbitrarily club up, in attempt to counter the off center hit. Say you hit it flush, all of a sudden you are 10, 15 yards over the target over the green, with a lot of greens sloping back to front, meaning you have a high flop with green running away from you.

Clubbing up means lower loft, equals a even more difficult club to center strike than the club you were suppose to hit. Personally, short is not the worst thing that can happen. I say, know your yardages, the minimums and trust it. Strategize and know where not to miss. Most the time, short is better than long.

 

[rbarthle17]

I don't think about my miss when I pull a club. If I have a yardage I pull accordingly based on the conditions at hand. I miss right or left of my target on average. If I miss its hardly ever short of the green and usually pin high. But I think we are asking for problems if you start the process playing for a miss.

This confuses me, because Course Management 101 as taught to me was to look at a hole and always be aware of the bad miss and avoid it. You seem to be advocating the exact opposite?

 

[Tadashi70]

I can't speak for anyone else but if I had to guess, I'd say yes. I know my distances and tend to get after all pins so I miss a great deal one side or the other but almost always pin high.

Someone that does not hit the center of the club face or doesn't have the swing speed to get the distance they want will miss short and right more often then not.

Freddie honest question do you think the left/right miss but pin high is because your a better ball striker with better distance control, than say a 25hc who isn't a great ball striker?

 

[Plin]

The average mid to high handicap player doesn't hit it flush every time so clubbing up is warranted. Blowing way over the green almost never happens.

I am not saying don't club up, I'm saying don't do it blanketly. A shot that would be hit with a 5 iron doesn't automatically become better hitting a 4 iron. Where the issue is not blowing it over the green, but rather just a complete top worm burner rather than a half decent strike short of the green.

 

[salisboss]

I tend to fly greens for the most part. I guess I tend to the extra club but as I get more solid with my irons I haven't adjusted.

 

[Dr RosenRosen]

I think most of us fall into this trap. We define our distances. For example, a player might say "I hit an 8 iron 150 yds." And so anytime a shot comes up that is ~150, he pulls out an 8 iron, without factoring wind/lie/uphill or downhill/etc. Maybe the shot is really a 7 or even a 6. But he hits an 8 and ends up 20 yds short.

Another problem with defining your distances is you don't learn how to hit a "soft" or "hard" shot and really control your distances. I love hitting a soft 7 instead of a hard 8. Plus, I know that if I flush it perfectly, I may be 10 yds behind the flag instead of short of the green. Also, you feel more creative out there and not just a robot automatically picking shots for certain distances.

Tour players are amazing at this. I recently reviewed a round Lee Westwood had on Game Golf. From the fairway, Westwood hit a 7 iron ~137 onto the green for a birdie putt. A few holes later, he hit an 8 iron 184 yds to the middle of the green.

 

[Tadashi70]

How often does that work out for you? How often do you miss it right where you want? How often do you set up and look over the hole and survey where not to miss the ball and still miss the green? If you pull a club and tell yourself not to hit 'there' more than likely you will be thinking about that vary spot instead of the green or the pin. The subconscious takes over and you miss it

I don't fill my head with a negative thoughts, like I don't want to miss right because of the trap or the water. I get my yardage, pull the club that will get you to that yardage, find my target and swing away.

Course management is not about playing your misses, its a combination of what our clubs will do and playing to that level. If I can't carry a trap when I am laying up then I don't try to carry that trap. I play short and wedge it in. I know I am not going to hit every shot flush, no one does. Greg Norman was asked how many flush shots he hit per round and he said 4. This was when he was the best in the world. I know I am not going to hit flush but pretty close and that might mean I am 2 or 3 yards off my intended distance. This puts me on or just around the green. If you are a full club short, then the simple solution is to club up or get better.

I learned this from my college coach. He would role up on us during practice and say ,don't hit it in the water'. that guy would plunk it in the water. Or he would say, 'don't miss it in the trap', sure enough someone would put it in the trap. I learn to find a target and play to the target. If I missed , I dealt with the consequences.

This confuses me, because Course Management 101 as taught to me was to look at a hole and always be aware of the bad miss and avoid it. You seem to be advocating the exact opposite?

 

[IceyShanks]

I would say I feel that would be about my miss, assuming I pick the proper club, but more often than not, lately, I'm going long.

 

[Tadashi70]

NO one said said it was a blanket rule. But maybe it should be based on that chart Dan posted. It seems more that half the balls are way short by a few clubs. Maybe grabbing one extra club or knowing your distances is key.

I am not saying don't club up, I'm saying don't do it blanketly. A shot that would be hit with a 5 iron doesn't automatically become better hitting a 4 iron. Where the issue is not blowing it over the green, but rather just a complete top worm burner rather than a half decent strike short of the green.

 

[McLovin]

totally guessing, but i would say 80% of my misses are short, 15% are missed to the right close to pin high, and the remaining 5% is missed to the left. my miss used to be a long left. but i can't think of a single full swing shot in the last 2 years that was missed long, over the green.

 

[Philly Golf Guy]

I agree that clubbing up is smart. With wind, different lies, turf interaction, elevation changes and most of our swings, it stands to reason that the distances you see at the range or a LM will be longer than what you're hitting on the course.

Me personally, I'm fine with ending up short in many instances because it typically takes a lot of trouble out of the picture. Most greens are open in the front, which leaves a nice chip to the pin, while missing left, right or even on the far side of the pin results in a lot more penal shots.

 

[Miller Time]

I'm really good at leaving my shots pin high and to the left. Short is my 2nd most common miss.

 

[rbarthle17]

How often does that work out for you? How often do you miss it right where you want? How often do you set up and look over the hole and survey where not to miss the ball and still miss the green?

Maybe we are using the term "miss" differently. What I am referring to is looking at the hole and determining where is the general area I am going for. I am not good enough to go pin hunting most times, so first and foremost my goal is "center". I then break the green up into quadrants. From there I see what is around it. I want to avoid hazards, OB, and short-sided chips. Most times that leaves me aiming "center-left", or "middle-front", etc. I am still aiming for the green, just not a pinpoint area of it. That is my focus.

I then go to my clubs and decide which club would keep me from the worst miss vertically. If going over the green will leave me with a more difficult shot than leaving it short, I will pull a club whose maximum expected distance (assuming I don't thin it, which I do not do often) is the center of the green. If it's better to be long than short, I pull a club whose minimum expected distance is the center of the green.

I just started learning course management last year. Using this methodology has borne a lot of improvement for me. My GIR % is low but my handicap went down from a 22 to a 16 last year. A big part of that is because I left myself with much easier greenside shots - longer chips with room to work, or even more putts from off the green. And I hardly ever find myself in a bunker, in large part because I stay away from the parts around the green that have them.

If/when I get to your level of accuracy, I think I would be much more fearless. Right now I just want to 1) hit the green, and 2) leave myself with the easiest shot if I miss it.

 

[Tadashi70]

That makes sense but how do you know what is long over the green. Short is easy, we can see that from the the fairway. But over the green is guess work unless you have played the the course a great deal. Also if you can choose a quadrant to hit to, why not over that closer to the pin. I am not as accurate as I'd like but I know I have a very solid short game. I also take advantage of my scoring opportunities by forcing the issue. Learning course management is a life long task, time to pull up your big pants and start getting more agresssive because., 'Your good enough and by god you deserve it"

We have to play our games but we also need to push to get better. I think you need to push a little bit and you will surprise yourself. Don't play so you have any easy up and down. Play golf and learn to make all up and downs even easier.I am not saying all the time but maybe a few more times a round.

Maybe we are using the term "miss" differently. What I am referring to is looking at the hole and determining where is the general area I am going for. I am not good enough to go pin hunting most times, so first and foremost my goal is "center". I then break the green up into quadrants. From there I see what is around it. I want to avoid hazards, OB, and short-sided chips. Most times that leaves me aiming "center-left", or "middle-front", etc. I am still aiming for the green, just not a pinpoint area of it. That is my focus.

I then go to my clubs and decide which club would keep me from the worst miss vertically. If going over the green will leave me with a more difficult shot than leaving it short, I will pull a club whose maximum expected distance (assuming I don't thin it, which I do not do often) is the center of the green. If it's better to be long than short, I pull a club whose minimum expected distance is the center of the green.

I just started learning course management last year. Using this methodology has borne a lot of improvement for me. My GIR % is low but my handicap went down from a 22 to a 16 last year. A big part of that is because I left myself with much easier greenside shots - longer chips with room to work, or even more putts from off the green. And I hardly ever find myself in a bunker, in large part because I stay away from the parts around the green that have them.

If/when I get to your level of accuracy, I think I would be much more fearless. Right now I just want to 1) hit the green, and 2) leave myself with the easiest shot if I miss it.