Should short knockers play faster than bombers?

[CBaker]

I did "lemme explain", so...lemme explain.

My answer is Yes, but only if all conditions are equal including skill level. Just sheer amount of time to walk and or ride to your ball, to then hit again and you typically would not ever wait on the green to clear on a par 5. Those two things alone would add up over 18.

It's not much. but in theory it should be quicker overall. I mean it's gotta be theoretically what, like a few minutes?

Now add in a slightly better short hitter vs a slightly worse longer hitter and the shorter hitter could probably play faster by a lot if that longer hitter is spraying it a bit.

 

[RecGolfer]

I hit 235 off the tee. I played from the appropriate tees. All par 4's are two-shotters, all par 5's are three shotters. I don't have to take extra shots to get to the green on any hole. I play the hole as it was designed. When I get shorter over time, I'll move up a set of tees and play the same game.

 

[InTheRough]

Also an example on a par 5 playing with long hitters who play from the whites. There have been occasions where I've hit a better than average drive into the middle of the fairway and have 230 yds left to the front of green. My playing partners are all waiting for the green to clear. I pull my 5W, line up, and take a couple of practice swings and get ready to hit because I know that since my avg driver is 210, the likelihood of reaching the green is nil. I'll probably hit a 200 yd shot if I connect. Yet they look on in horror. I'm not reaching the green, guys. Chill. Ball ends up 25 yds from the front of the green.

 

[TWright971]

live action example. Out in Vegas I played a round where I was playing from a more forward tee box than normal, an experiment I had been wanting to try. On the first hole I had a choice...I could wait and hit driver or go immediately hitting a 4 iron.

For 8 holes I chose to hit the shorter club so being a longer hitter had zero relevance. Had I chosen to hit driver, there would have been a ton of waiting both for me off the tee, then the guy I was with would have looked slow as he would often have been hitting three shots to my two but could not go to his ball until I teed off...even though it would have been me causing the delay. On the back the group ahead of us had quit or something as I was able to go driver.

But in this instance your pace was determined by the group in front of you, not if you are a short or long hitter. I’m sure hitting the shorter club made the wait feel less, but it had no effect on your pace.

 

[leftshot]

Bottom line: Every group on the course has to meet the same pace of play requirement. Now does that mean the shorter hitter has to play faster than the bomber? Depends.

If the short knocker takes a stroke or two more to get from tee to green than the bomber, then yes, the short knocker may have to play faster for the group to meet the pace of play required. However, if the bomber is sending his tee shot into the trees or one or two fairways over then the bomber may be the one who has to play faster.

Having said that, I've known short knockers who get right to the ball and hit without delay, bombers who dilly-dally and vice-versa. Most of the time the pace of a group has far less to do with how far the players hit the ball and far more to do with what those players are doing between shots.

The pace of play has to do with an allotted time to play each hole. It doesn't say anything about HOW you have to achieve that goal.

 

[darthweasel]

But in this instance your pace was determined by the group in front of you, not if you are a short or long hitter. I’m sure hitting the shorter club made the wait feel less, but it had no effect on your pace.

there are different ways to fill the same amount of time. In the morning round it was go to shot, hit, go to shot, hit...and was 3:24. In the afternoon there was waiting to hit on 5 or 6 holes and the group behind us caught us on an early hole....and it was 3:29. But it felt a bit longer because of the waiting.

When groups move in sequence where you are consistently either moving or hitting, the time moves different than it does when it is move, wait, hit, move, wait....now on the day in question it was fun company so did not feel bad, but to the point of whether different length hitters affect pace...it absolutely affects the feel of it.

On the first hole I felt internal pressure to select a club to hit, particularly knowing there was another group heading toward the tee box. Lee had already hit and I was well aware my driver would need to wait for the people ahead to hit at least one more shot and then the people behind us would see us go to a ball that would not have required waiting. Our respective distances 100% could have had even more impact on how the round felt.

to paraphrase some unknown physicist* who once said, "spend a few minutes waiting to hit a golf shot and it feels like hours. spend a few hours moving to your ball and being able to hit it straight away and it feels like minutes."







* Einstein's actual quote was, “Put your hand on a hot stove for a minute, and it seems like an hour. Sit with a pretty girl for an hour, and it seems like a minute. That's relativity.”

 

[echico]

I am confused by the question. If you are playing in the same group short knockers may hit 2 or more shots while long hitters wait for it to be safe to hit but the group is still at the same pace. If it is a group of short hitters in front of a group of long bombers I can see how the long bombers may feel they are waiting. If short hitters are behind the long bombers they are able to play their normal shots as they will not reach long bombers. They can both play in the same time and similar scores so I don't see a definitive answer except to say slow players are slow.

 

[leftshot]

The Definitive Statement on Slow Play

There are two types of slow players: those who are oblivious to their slow play and those who know they play slow and don’t care.

The former need to be advised and instructed. The latter need to be flogged.

 

[annsguy]

No, if you play slow, know it and speed up. If you are a long knocker, bless you and be patient. We are moving as fast as we can.

 

[Briton G]

The only thing I can think of that holds me back from hitting and typically being the last to hit in a group is having to waiting on a group to clear the green or get to the green of a par 4 to make sure I don't get close to hitting anyone. Where "short knockers" typically can swing and go up to their ball a lot quicker.

 

[Hamfist]

Well, it is a shorter walk to my next shot, so, sure.

 

[Bernoulli]

Nearly everyone should play faster, regardless of how far one hits the ball.

 

[Et Tu Brute?]

Yes, as long as they're either walking or their carts are allowed in the fairways.

Really short hitters and cart path only is basically a 5+ hour round waiting to happen.

 

[OldandStiff]

But in this instance your pace was determined by the group in front of you, not if you are a short or long hitter. I’m sure hitting the shorter club made the wait feel less, but it had no effect on your pace.

That math doesn't check out beyond the two groups. It absolutely makes a difference overall.

By going with an iron he kept the pace moving, and prevented the group behind him from having to wait on him. It all trickles down. The good and the bad.

Say the group ahead of him has a big hitter in front of them. Who's waiting before going. And he waits instead of hitting the irons himself. That absolutely slows everyone down.

I played with my wife yesterday. I hit irons off some tees to keep it moving. In the moment I did that, she actually would have had to still be waiting a couple times to tee off herself, from her tees. But we're not playing the same tees. And sharing a cart. So if I wait for it to clear and go, I have to watch it, grab my tee, slip on my headcover, get in the cart, and drive us to her tees. Where she gets out, gets her club out, figures out where she needs to hit, tees up, goes, we watch it, she headcovers, gets in, and we're off to our balls.

So besides the fact that no one would be teeing off when I did a couple times, there's a lot of time from when I go until she's done. I wait and none of that journey even starts until I'm done. Even if she was clear it's not like we're going to drive up to hers, have her tee, and then backtrack to mine. Still going to cost time. And as that holds up the group behind us, breaking the flow and ultimately the pace, so would it if the same thing was happening in the group ahead of the one we're waiting on. And we'd be waiting longer. This is literally how 6 hour rounds happen. Whether it's waiting to tee or going Cantlay on the green, everything behind you slows down.

 

[TWright971]

That math doesn't check out beyond the two groups. It absolutely makes a difference overall.

By going with an iron he kept the pace moving, and prevented the group behind him from having to wait on him. It all trickles down. The good and the bad.

Say the group ahead of him has a big hitter in front of them. Who's waiting before going. And he waits instead of hitting the irons himself. That absolutely slows everyone down.

I played with my wife yesterday. I hit irons off some tees to keep it moving. In the moment I did that, she actually would have had to still be waiting a couple times to tee off herself, from her tees. But we're not playing the same tees. And sharing a cart. So if I wait for it to clear and go, I have to watch it, grab my tee, slip on my headcover, get in the cart, and drive us to her tees. Where she gets out, gets her club out, figures out where she needs to hit, tees up, goes, we watch it, she headcovers, gets in, and we're off to our balls.

So besides the fact that no one would be teeing off when I did a couple times, there's a lot of time from when I go until she's done. I wait and none of that journey even starts until I'm done. Even if she was clear it's not like we're going to drive up to hers, have her tee, and then backtrack to mine. Still going to cost time. And as that holds up the group behind us, breaking the flow and ultimately the pace, so would it if the same thing was happening in the group ahead of the one we're waiting on. And we'd be waiting longer. This is literally how 6 hour rounds happen. Whether it's waiting to tee or going Cantlay on the green, everything behind you slows down.

So when playing with your wife you can't Drive to your Tee box, you grab the club you are using off the tee and your tee and ball and go while your wife drives to her tee box. You hit when clear then walk up to her tee box. I can't see the time difference being that much.