Aging, Ego, and Tees

[skujan]

Where I play very few play off the senior tees (even if better suited to it) and while some play off the tips, I never do.

 

[BigMac]

I'm surprised that nearly every poster has used the term "senior's" tees or " women's tees". I called them "women's tees" once a few years ago playing with a female and nearly got my head bit off who corrected me to "forward tees".

Gents, call them the "forward tees", "back tees", or red, white or purple, whatever. It's the only way to help with the stigma and to get folks the right ones for their pleasure. I play course every once in a while that has put the blue tees at the front, red at the back, probably for that reason. Our local munis are putting in Green tees as more forward than the reds, another local course has put in black tees as the most forward.

I just turned 70. I will probably play the red (second from most forward) tees on a couple of the courses I play regularly this year and sometimes on other courses. I and a number of the guys in my (ahem) seniors league hope at least one of those two courses rates a red/white combo that was in the works for 2020 before Covid hit.

I'm pretty "meh" about whatever people want to call them. They were called the "ladies tees" or "senior tees" for a long time, and people who still use those names don't mean any offense by it. I get that it's all PC nowadays not to "label" them as such, but I don't get twisted up if somebody calls them what they were originally called.

 

[RecGolfer]

I'm 71 and don't hit it as far as I used to (big surprise), but I play from tees that let me hit the same clubs on the courses I played earlier from their longer tees.

 

[Buckeyegolfnut]

Our senior tees, are also the women's tees. Even though there's less than 10 yards difference between the whites/reds, this brings one's "male ego" into play.

Our senior/super senior tournaments use the whites, so there's that.

I will play from what ever tees the group I'm with wants to play.....on my home course. There's just not that much difference between the tees.

I think where using the right tees becomes important is on courses that have tee boxes spread out from 5500 yards to 7400 yards. The next question is how many times do we play this type of course? Me, maybe 10% of my rounds, and I play the tees closest to my home course's yardage.

I had to about beat my main golf buddy over the head to get him to move up. I finally got to him one day on a 400 yard par 4. Actually the on-cart GPS read 399 parked right beside the white tee blocks. He hit his usual drive out there and I asked him how far he though he hit it. "Oh, about 260." When we got to his ball I pointed at the GPS and had him take a look. If he had really hit his drive 260 he would have had 140 in. He had 180 in! When I pointed this out he actually tried to tell me that there must be something wrong with the GPS!

The OP mentioned ego. Let's not forget that ego and self deception are best friends!

 

[JonMA1]

I'm pretty "meh" about whatever people want to call them. They were called the "ladies tees" or "senior tees" for a long time, and people who still use those names don't mean any offense by it. I get that it's all PC nowadays not to "label" them as such, but I don't get twisted up if somebody calls them what they were originally called.

It's pretty easy for me to adapt to the way things are. I don't talk or act the way I did 40 years ago for the most part because I understand how and why that vernacular is offensive. And even in my non-PC mind, there are words that are not allowed to be used in my home.

But I honestly don't understand the offense taken when one refers to red tees as senior, women's or juniors. The majority of women, juniors and seniors can beat the tar out of me, so it isn't a superiority thing. If referring to them as forward or red tees is easier for others, then it certainly isn't a big deal for me. Come to think of it, I can't remember the last time they were even discussed by anyone beyond this forum. Maybe they will just become "the tees that shall remain nameless".

 

[braveheart]

My home course the tips are black at 6900 yards. Almost no one I see or play with plays off of them. I have and scored pretty close to what I normally shoot-mid 80s. We all play off the next one up the blue tees at 6431 yards. I am turning 64, but have still got some length so its no issue for me. I have some buddies who who would benefit immensely and should consider moving up to the whites but never will due to ego and what they are used to doing. I would move up if they wanted to.

 

[Buckeyegolfnut]

It's pretty easy for me to adapt to the way things are. I don't talk or act the way I did 40 years ago for the most part because I understand how and why that vernacular is offensive. And even in my non-PC mind, there are words that are not allowed to be used in my home.

But I honestly don't understand the offense taken when one refers to red tees as senior, women's or juniors. The majority of women, juniors and seniors can beat the tar out of me, so it isn't a superiority thing. If referring to them as forward or red tees is easier for others, then it certainly isn't a big deal for me. Come to think of it, I can't remember the last time they were even discussed by anyone beyond this forum. Maybe they will just become "the tees that shall remain nameless".

I read your first paragraph and was ready to disagree with you, then I read the second! Let me say right off the bat that at 68 years old, I have never been, am not now, nor will I ever be PC! However, I was raised properly and there are words that I will not use in polite company! I try not to offend. That said, there are WAY too many touchy people around these days! I held the door for a young lady one time and she glared at me. She said, "I'm perfectly capable of opening a door!" I said, "Here on Earth we say thank you!"

 

[greg19]

When I was in my 20's it was, "I paid for so I'm going to see all of the course. Now in my late 40's its, "I'm not walking all the way back there"!

I agree with the OP that some of the rounds I have had the most fun is when playing forward. I switch tee boxes just to mix things up and it gives the course an entirely different look.

 

[Grand Stranded]

I always find it strange when people talk about the course yardage they feel comfortable playing at without mentioning where they play. So much depends on where you live and the altitude you play at also.
Down here in the low country, 6000 is the equivalent to about 6250 up on Long Island, 6500 in Texas or Arizona and about 6600+ in places like Tahoe. Playing at or below sea level on courses with little run out will make you learn your carry distances really quickly.
We laugh at tourists who automatically move all the way back when they see the white tees at 6000 down here and then complain that their “normal 250 yard” drives are barely going 220. One of the big resort complexes recently changed the tee boxes on all 5 of their courses The whites are now the blacks and the greens are the whites because the starters were ignored when they suggested moving up a tee from what your normal yardage is back home.
This soothed the egos of those who couldn’t bear to play a forward tee, and greatly improved pace of play.
The tourists are scoring better, and the courses were able to add extra tee times. It was a win win for everyone.

 

[leftshot]

I'm at the beginning of this journey. Mid 60s. Still been in the stage of getting every last yard I can out of this body through conditioning and technique. Right now I can handle courses at sea level to about 6,700 yards. So, I'm not bombing it 300+ like some of the younger guys. But at 250-260 yards and keeping it on the fairways, plus really good at hitting long approaches onto the green, I can still get around.

Since I'm definitely in the senior age category, I have played in tournaments where they move you up a tee. So I'll practice from that box for a tourney from time to time.

My time is coming. I think I can embrace moving up when it's time, but we'll see.

 

[leftshot]

If a typical color scheme from back to front is black, blue, white, yellow, red and green what goes in front of green? Why don’t courses have additional teeing areas up to the 2200 yards on the Tee it Forward chart? The forward marker could be low profile or just dots painted on the fairway. I’m a 60 male, a short hitter with limited abilities, I’m playing the yellow during the summer and the reds during the winter, where do I move up to in 10 years?

Don't know about where you are at. But lots of places fill that need with executive courses. Go down to The Villages in Florida and more than half their courses are executive courses.

 

[tahoebum]

I'm a high spin/trajectory player and Dynamic Golds have always been a good fit. My new Srixon ZX7's will have DGS300 AMT Whites so it will be fun to compare them to my DGX100 AMT's that are in my X765's. I'm guessing I won't see much if any difference.

 

[leftshot]

I think most modern course design has more forced carries than older designs. For example, I live in the Boston area and we have a lot of old golf courses...some dating back to the 19th century...and you can play the ball on the ground. With newer courses in my area, you get a lot more forced carries.

To this point. A course can make it play effectively longer just by putting hazards in front of their greens: streams, ponds, bunkers. This takes away the option to run one up on the green with a long iron, hybrid, or fairway metal.

 

[Sean]

When I was in my 20's it was, "I paid for so I'm going to see all of the course. Now in my late 40's its, "I'm not walking all the way back there"!

I agree with the OP that some of the rounds I have had the most fun is when playing forward. I switch tee boxes just to mix things up and it gives the course an entirely different look.

It does, and if you play the same course a lot, it is like playing a different golf course.

 

[leftshot]

Interesting Thanks!
I copied this from the article:
"I did some thinking about which course length is best for me. As it turns out, if you take the total length of a good drive for you and multiple that by 28, it will give you the yardage of a course that will be a lot of fun to play, not too hard, not too easy. If you want to read the whole article on this, go to www.milesofgolf.com/blog and look for an article called “Which Tees Should You Play”."
Per Mile's formula a 6500 yard course is spot on for someone with a 'good drive' (I read that to mean 'good - but not a bomb') of 232 yards total.

Yeah, those formulas don't work if you play a lot of course types in various places. It works on wide open parkland courses where you know your drive length for that elevation and the same rollout for that course. But try to use that formula on a tight mountain course and you'll regret your tee choice all day. Use your standard carry and roll in places like Seattle and use them to select tees on courses in Arizona and you'll think the course plays too short. Lots of other combinations where this just doesn't work.

 

[Sean]

Yeah, those formulas don't work if you play a lot of course types in various places. It works on wide open parkland courses where you know your drive length for that elevation and the same rollout for that course. But try to use that formula on a tight mountain course and you'll regret your tee choice all day. Use your standard carry and roll in places like Seattle and use them to select tees on courses in Arizona and you'll think the course plays too short. Lots of other combinations where this just doesn't work.

I have been using this formula for a while, and find it works pretty well for me.

 

[Daddio]

Yeah, those formulas don't work if you play a lot of course types in various places. It works on wide open parkland courses where you know your drive length for that elevation and the same rollout for that course. But try to use that formula on a tight mountain course and you'll regret your tee choice all day. Use your standard carry and roll in places like Seattle and use them to select tees on courses in Arizona and you'll think the course plays too short. Lots of other combinations where this just doesn't work.

When I read Mile's argument, I didn't get the impression that he intended his 28x formula to be used like that. Instead I read it to mean 28X a golfer's 'good drives' (not best) on a tight, damp, chilly track in Seattle could be used to select appropriate tees at a similar track around Seattle. That same golfer's good drives would be measurably longer at elevation on a hot day in the Arizona foothills and the formula would then recommend a longer set of tees. I've played all kinds of courses all over. From 9000' elevation in August in New Mexico to Seattle in the early spring. I'd bet my 'properly selected tees' are at least 500 yards different from each other at those tracks. Even here, some courses, even with the same grasses, elevation, and temps, have huge fairways and many elevated tees. If I'm playing one of those I'd look to play them a little longer than the opposite courses just because I know from experience that my 'good drives' are longer at them.

 

[leftshot]

When I read Mile's argument, I didn't get the impression that he intended his 28x formula to be used like that. Instead I read it to mean 28X a golfer's 'good drives' (not best) on a tight, damp, chilly track in Seattle could be used to select appropriate tees at a similar track around Seattle. That same golfer's good drives would be measurably longer at elevation on a hot day in the Arizona foothills and the formula would then recommend a longer set of tees. I've played all kinds of courses all over. From 9000' elevation in August in New Mexico to Seattle in the early spring. I'd bet my 'properly selected tees' are at least 500 yards different from each other at those tracks. Even here, some courses, even with the same grasses, elevation, and temps, have huge fairways and many elevated tees. If I'm playing one of those I'd look to play them a little longer than the opposite courses just because I know from experience that my 'good drives' are longer at them.

The main thing is that you realize the limitations of using a formula like this. Unfortunately, every time I've seen an article or video of someone promoting these formulas they never bring up the limitations you listed or I listed.

 

[Dt1741]

According to the USGA you guys are hitting it too far. Can’t move up because it would ruin the integrity of the game.