Do I need a higher spinning/launching shaft?

luckydutch

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I'm being fit for my first new driver and am not completely confident in the shaft/loft combination so could use some advice.

I'm a semi-fast swinger (typically 95-105mph with driver) so I know I definitely want a stiffer shaft but am unclear as to whether that should also be a low-launch/low-spin shaft or a more moderate one.

I was very inconsistent in my striking in my club testing which didn't make it easy. Plus the data I captured doesn't include where I struck it on the face so I'm not sure how strike point affected these numbers.

Nonetheless, I seemed to most commonly get two very different types of shots.

Low-spinning, low-launching shots that were OK but dropped out of the sky way short of their potential:

1642504419055.png

High-spinning shots that balooned-up and didn't even carry as far as my hybrid:

1642504379773.png

Neither of those were particularly fast swings because I got frustrated and started slowing down in an attempt to gain consistency but my normal swing speed on a good day is above 100.

I have no idea what to do now. Do I stick with this low-spinning, low-launch shaft (Hzdrus Smoke Yellow) even though on some of my best shots, the ball didn't go high enough to reach a decent carry? It's possible that they would have gone further if I had been swinging at my normal 100+mph swing but not guaranteed. Or, do I try more loft than 9 degrees? Or try a higher-spinning/launching shaft?

I'm lost! :confused:
 

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I'm being fit for my first new driver and am not completely confident in the shaft/loft combination so could use some advice.

I'm a semi-fast swinger (typically 95-105mph with driver) so I know I definitely want a stiffer shaft but am unclear as to whether that should also be a low-launch/low-spin shaft or a more moderate one.

I was very inconsistent in my striking in my club testing which didn't make it easy. Plus the data I captured doesn't include where I struck it on the face so I'm not sure how strike point affected these numbers.

Nonetheless, I seemed to most commonly get two very different types of shots.

Low-spinning, low-launching shots that were OK but dropped out of the sky way short of their potential:

View attachment 9060677

High-spinning shots that balooned-up and didn't even carry as far as my hybrid:

View attachment 9060676

Neither of those were particularly fast swings because I got frustrated and started slowing down in an attempt to gain consistency but my normal swing speed on a good day is above 100.

I have no idea what to do now. Do I stick with this low-spinning, low-launch shaft (Hzdrus Smoke Yellow) even though on some of my best shots, the ball didn't go high enough to reach a decent carry? It's possible that they would have gone further if I had been swinging at my normal 100+mph swing but not guaranteed. Or, do I try more loft than 9 degrees? Or try a higher-spinning/launching shaft?

I'm lost! :confused:
Those numbers on your low launch/spin shots are actually not terrible. For you, the optimal launch and spin is about 15° and 2300rpms, which you aren’t far off from. Ping has a nice chart to show ideal launch/spin for different ball speeds, which is below. If your driver is adjustable, adding loft might be a place to start before you start tinkering with shafts. What is your current setup?
1642506329983.jpeg
 
What got ball was used?
 
I don't think 14° is considered a low launch angle? If you could bring up the spin on the first shot you would be fine I would say
 
Those numbers on your low launch/spin shots are actually not terrible. For you, the optimal launch and spin is about 15° and 2300rpms, which you aren’t far off from. Ping has a nice chart to show ideal launch/spin for different ball speeds, which is below. If your driver is adjustable, adding loft might be a place to start before you start tinkering with shafts. What is your current setup?
View attachment 9060679

Well I didn’t actually buy it yet so I can choose either a different driver loft or shaft.

Not going to get a chance to actually test another shaft though so I’d be making a big gamble.

How can I get the spin and launch up a bit? I definitely could be hitting up on the ball a bit more but no idea how to impart more spin.

I definitely wasn’t hit slap-bang in the middle of the face every time, either!
 
What got ball was used?

I believe a pro v1.

Although, I personally don’t use them for my golf. I play cheaper balls like the AD333 or Inesis 500/900.
 
What exactly did your fitter recommend and why? Did they say? How long was your fitting? How many different heads and shafts did you try?
 
I believe a pro v1.

Although, I personally don’t use them for my golf. I play cheaper balls like the AD333 or Inesis 500/900.

The ball you use for your game should be used in the fitting, or at least close as you could see a fairly large change in both launch and spin.
 
What exactly did your fitter recommend and why? Did they say? How long was your fitting? How many different heads and shafts did you try?

Fitting was an hour.

We tried 4 heads (2 models, 2 lofts) and I believe 2 or 3 shafts.

Early in the session I was really off my game and was sending everything into space with way too much dynamic loft. This was with the 10.5 head and stock stiff shaft.

We dropped the loft down to 9 degrees and set the weight back in the head and I started to find a bit more consistency.

Last, he swapped me over to the Hzrdus Smoke Yellow shaft. He said this was because it had a bit more of a "kick" that would help me. I did quite like the 'feel' of the shaft and so didn't really question him.

Although with that final configuration I felt like I was at least a little more consistent with ball striking, I wasn't really happy with my distances which is why I went digging into the trackman report after the fitting and it was at this point that I learnt this shaft was also described as a 'low launch/spin' shaft. I didn't know that in the club fitting, just that it was a stiff shaft with more "kick".

Edit: one other thing of note - we were using the slightly shorter pink castle tees. I've never really known which is correct for me and experimented with both pink and orange in the past. Is it possible that the shorter pink tee is also a factor on the low max height and thus, shorter carry?
 
Fitting was an hour.

We tried 4 heads (2 models, 2 lofts) and I believe 2 or 3 shafts.

Early in the session I was really off my game and was sending everything into space with way too much dynamic loft. This was with the 10.5 head and stock stiff shaft.

We dropped the loft down to 9 degrees and set the weight back in the head and I started to find a bit more consistency.

Last, he swapped me over to the Hzrdus Smoke Yellow shaft. He said this was because it had a bit more of a "kick" that would help me. I did quite like the 'feel' of the shaft and so didn't really question him.

Although with that final configuration I felt like I was at least a little more consistent with ball striking, I wasn't really happy with my distances which is why I went digging into the trackman report after the fitting and it was at this point that I learnt this shaft was also described as a 'low launch/spin' shaft. I didn't know that in the club fitting, just that it was a stiff shaft with more "kick".

Edit: one other thing of note - we were using the slightly shorter pink castle tees. I've never really known which is correct for me and experimented with both pink and orange in the past. Is it possible that the shorter pink tee is also a factor on the low max height and thus, shorter carry?

Did they use any type of impact tape? Do you happen hit the crown of the club sometimes and other times, you hit worm burners?
 
Did they use any type of impact tape? Do you happen hit the crown of the club sometimes and other times, you hit worm burners?

When I first started driving I was steep as hell and would scuff the crown often.

Less so now. Still sometimes quite high on the face as I’m not amazing at maintaining that slight spine tilt through the driver swing. Still, not so much on the crown as high on the face.

I do occasionally hit a low hook too but I’d say my most consistent miss is slight slice that’s high, short and strays 20-30 yards offline to the right.

My good shots are quite strong draws. Arguably too strong but if it was consistent without the occasional slices, I could just aim a little right and let it draw into the fairway.

No impact tape. I think the computer could show face impact but that data wasn’t included in what was sent to me after the session, sadly.
 
Well I didn’t actually buy it yet so I can choose either a different driver loft or shaft.

Not going to get a chance to actually test another shaft though so I’d be making a big gamble.

How can I get the spin and launch up a bit? I definitely could be hitting up on the ball a bit more but no idea how to impart more spin.

I definitely wasn’t hit slap-bang in the middle of the face every time, either!
Simple answer is to increase loft. The dynamics of it can probably be between explained with a YouTube video (TXG usually has really good stuff.

@JB makes a really good point about doing fittings with the ball that you typically use on the course. That will give you the most accurate results. Another point he has made in the past is that the shaft is more about timing and controlling strike locations than impacting launch/spin. You can do more with the golf ball and head choice than shaft, which is more fine tuning strike. Just my two cents. When in doubt, find a fitter you trust who knows what they’re talking about. If you don’t trust the fitter, it’s hard to trust the results if you think they’re just forcing a product on you in order to get your money.
 
I would consider increasing loft and using the hazardous smoke shaft. Using your ball during a fitting is important. Which head are you going to get? If you're all over the face maybe wait and look at the Rogue ST Max or Max D
 
Simple answer is to increase loft. The dynamics of it can probably be between explained with a YouTube video (TXG usually has really good stuff.

@JB makes a really good point about doing fittings with the ball that you typically use on the course. That will give you the most accurate results. Another point he has made in the past is that the shaft is more about timing and controlling strike locations than impacting launch/spin. You can do more with the golf ball and head choice than shaft, which is more fine tuning strike. Just my two cents. When in doubt, find a fitter you trust who knows what they’re talking about. If you don’t trust the fitter, it’s hard to trust the results if you think they’re just forcing a product on you in order to get your money.

Maybe that’s not such a bad situation then. In terms of feel/timing, I did prefer the Hzrdus shaft to the others.

I was just bugged by the lack of distance and then panicked when I saw on the Project X website that it is their ‘low launch, low spin’ shaft.

I guess the question now is: do I go for 9 degree head and increase the loft or the 10.5 and decrease the loft?

Noted on the ball point. I will bring my own balls in future!
 
If you tend to go towards hosel at all I'd think 9* and open it up. What's everybody else think?
 
I would consider increasing loft and using the hazardous smoke shaft. Using your ball during a fitting is important. Which head are you going to get? If you're all over the face maybe wait and look at the Rogue ST Max or Max D

It was the PXG 0811 XF. The head was large and confidence-inspiring. It seemed pretty forgiving, given my inexperience with driver. The price was just too good to pass-up.

I also tried the PING G425 and new Stealth.

Didn’t get on with the Stealth at all and moved-on after 5-6 balls. I found it aligned a bit strangely and it really threw me off.

I did get good performance out of the PING even though it sounded horrible, the forgiveness was good. It costs 50% more than the PXG and they wanted me to sign some waiver saying “it arrives when it arrives”. I did not love that.
 
Doesn’t sound like you trust the fitter. We all could speculate for days but the better approach would be for you to go to a fitter that you trust.
 
I guess the question now is: do I go for 9 degree head and increase the loft or the 10.5 and decrease the loft?
This is a great question. It depends what your typical miss is. If your miss is a slice, I would do the 9° and add loft before that closes the face. If your miss is a pull/hook like me, the higher lofted head dropped a degree or two will open the club face and help with that miss. Can’t wait to hear how this goes for you!!
 
This is a great question. It depends what your typical miss is. If your miss is a slice, I would do the 9° and add loft before that closes the face. If your miss is a pull/hook like me, the higher lofted head dropped a degree or two will open the club face and help with that miss. Can’t wait to hear how this goes for you!!
I hope this is correct, but I thought lower lofted club, then jacking the loft opened up the face. Oh what a stupid I am.
 
I hope this is correct, but I thought lower lofted club, then jacking the loft opened up the face. Oh what a stupid I am.
This is Titleist’s chart. I know Taylormade and Callaway are the same with lowering loft and opening face. Not sure about the other companies.
1642513660189.jpeg
 
This is a great question. It depends what your typical miss is. If your miss is a slice, I would do the 9° and add loft before that closes the face. If your miss is a pull/hook like me, the higher lofted head dropped a degree or two will open the club face and help with that miss. Can’t wait to hear how this goes for you!!

I do unfortunately miss both ways.

Typical driver shot shape is quite a strong draw, pulling the ball 20-30 yards left of target. Sometimes that's an over-draw that puts me in trouble.

Bad miss is the high slice that goes right or the occasional low hook. The low hook is pretty rare, though.

Average face-to-path is -2.
 
I do unfortunately miss both ways.

Typical driver shot shape is quite a strong draw, pulling the ball 20-30 yards left of target. Sometimes that's an over-draw that puts me in trouble.

Bad miss is the high slice that goes right or the occasional low hook. The low hook is pretty rare, though.

Average face-to-path is -2.
That face to path makes me think the 10.5 lofted down might be the best option. Again, find a fitter you trust who does this every day. This is just an internet golfer talking haha
 
For what it's worth - it seems like you didn't get what you wanted out of this fitting. It may be worth ponying up and getting another fitting done, with another fitter, so that you can have confidence in your new equipment the day it arrives.

I had a fitting last year - admittedly I was all over the place for a bit. My fitter quit looking solely at numbers for a bit and focused on feel. I hit 5 or 6 heads, some with mulitple shafts. Everything I thought I wanted... not good for me LOL After we settled on the right feel, he went back to focusing on numbers. As we dialed the numbers in, the confidence grew. The day my driver arrived, I already knew that I'd never put my old driver back in the bag (and I've not even thought about it). My results on course are actually miles better than my results were on the computer :ROFLMAO:

I did have to wait a bit, so did a bit more research after my fitting - but put my trust in the guy I just paid to sort out the details. I also got a 90 day performance guarantee, so some peace of mind if things didn't work out.
 
That face to path makes me think the 10.5 lofted down might be the best option. Again, find a fitter you trust who does this every day. This is just an internet golfer talking haha

I appreciate the advice anyway. I might see if I can discuss that particular issue with the fitter.

The tricky thing is I am new to golf but obsessed, taking lessons and practicing relentlessly so my swing can change fast.

2 months ago I had a steep, over-the-top swing and nasty slice. I've made great progress to control the OTT move but now I might be over-correcting a little. No idea where I will eventually settle as a 'natural' ball flight. I like the idea of having a slight cut as it seems to me that draws tend to go more offline than fades.
 
For what it's worth - it seems like you didn't get what you wanted out of this fitting. It may be worth ponying up and getting another fitting done, with another fitter, so that you can have confidence in your new equipment the day it arrives.

I had a fitting last year - admittedly I was all over the place for a bit. My fitter quit looking solely at numbers for a bit and focused on feel. I hit 5 or 6 heads, some with mulitple shafts. Everything I thought I wanted... not good for me LOL After we settled on the right feel, he went back to focusing on numbers. As we dialed the numbers in, the confidence grew. The day my driver arrived, I already knew that I'd never put my old driver back in the bag (and I've not even thought about it). My results on course are actually miles better than my results were on the computer :ROFLMAO:

I did have to wait a bit, so did a bit more research after my fitting - but put my trust in the guy I just paid to sort out the details. I also got a 90 day performance guarantee, so some peace of mind if things didn't work out.

I would be happy to pay for a second-opinion but unfortunately PXG only seem to fit their clubs themselves.

I had the PING/TaylorMade fitting seperately. They recommended for me the Tensei Orange shaft. It seems PING don't offer the Project X shafts so my options were the Alta CB Slate or the Tensei Orange and I hit the Tensei better.

Like the Hzrdus, it's a counterbalanced shaft but it appears to be described as mid-launch/spin not low, so in that way it is different.

That fitter recommended a loft of 9.5 or 10 degrees but I don't remember whether it was a 9 degree head with loft increased or 10.5 with loft decreased.
 
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