Golf or Marraige?

[BASDawg]

I’ve been a member of the THP for a couple of years now, but re-registered for this special post for reasons of anonymity and paranoia.

First of all, my wife is a wonderful woman. She’s been a terrific mother to our two children – now grown- and has been a great life’s partner. This is not a “my wife’s an unreasonable b*&^h post.” She's not. We've been married for over 25years, and have had very few arguments.

A couple of nights ago we had the latest in an ongoing series of “you love golf more than me” discussions. This one, though, was the most serious. She asked me if I still wanted to be married. She said that she has considered moving out and getting an apartment in our old hometown.

Frankly, she’s got a point. Though I would not say that I love golf more than her, the fact is that I pretty much would rather spend my free time playing golf than doing things with her. We usually have one date night a week where we’ll do the dinner and a movie deal, and my weekend play generally consists of an early a.m. round, but she’s right when she says that most of my time off from work is spent on the golf course. Typically we’ll have dinner together, and then I’ll go out to the course. It’s more of an issue during the summer with the longer days.

We used to live on a golf course, so it actually was a little bit worse, but at that time we lived some place else where she had friends in the neighborhood. A couple of years ago we moved to a different city, and it would be safe to say that mentally she still hasn’t quite made the move. She still goes back “home” a couple times a month for doctors’ appointments and to spend time with her friends. She doesn’t work outside the home, so as she sees it, she spends most of the day at home alone, and at least during the summer, most of the nights as well.

She’s got a point. A good one, actually. She’s more right than wrong. But the fact is that I really don’t want to change my lifestyle. I probably will, but I know I’ll resent it. I will not be happy being a recreational 2-3 times a week player. What I enjoy about playing golf is trying to do it to the best of my ability. I don’t enjoy playing golf; I enjoy playing it well. I know that if I cut down on how much I play, I also will not play it as well, and if that’s the case, I’d just as soon not play at all. My current GHIN handicap is a 0.3, and I know I wouldn’t be happy just hacking the ball around.

This is not a she’s wrong and I’m right deal. If anything, it’s probably the other way around. She didn’t give me an ultimatum – not in so many words anyway – but I know that we can’t go on like this.

Thoughts?

...married over 25 years
... she doesn't work outside the home

dooooooood, it's cheaper to keep her.

 

[GolferGal]

What an interesting topic. I know it's based on the OP but I find the idea of Golf vs. Marriage interesting. I personally love when JB goes out to play golf, but I have explained in other threads that I enjoy my 'me' time. I can, however, see how a person who works all week would be frustrated that their spouse has chosen to spend 4-6 hours a day away from the house. I think for the OP, like others have said, if he is even asking this question then he already knows the answer to it.

I also wonder what it's like for single guys who are used to golfing whenever and however much they like. If they started dating a person who didn't golf, could they or would they give up some of their golf time?

Now, as a person who has moved to a new city and doesn't know anyone, I 100% understand where the wife is coming from. It's hard to be in a place with no friends, and then the one friend who you could always count on (your husband) is busy with his friends at the course. That's a tough situation. It would be great if he could find a friend who has a nongolfing wife and try to introduce the ladies.

As far as divorce goes, I do think it's a lot easier for older kids. They understand what is going on and it's not like they are being split between two homes every weekend. I remember growing up my parents would fight all the time and my sister and I begged my parents to get a divorce. They never did and 30 years later they are still together, but we still wonder if it would have been better for both of them if they had divorced. If a couple is no longer happy then they shouldn't be together. Sure you will have ups and downs and compromises will be made, but if this is an ongoing thing and both parties are miserable then it's time to think about moving on.

 

[blugold]

Again, I disagree and agree here.

It wasn't hard on us. Like I said, we all wondered why they were staying together. We were sad that their marriage was over, but glad they could finally be happy (or happier). It might have been hard on us as little kids, but at age 18,19 and 23, we were more glad it was finally over than sad that it happened. If an adult has issues when their parents get divorced, then that's a messed up adult right there.

I guess since my situation was different, I can't really say. But I am sure that some adults would have difficulties in different ways.

I do agree that as soon as the marriage is over, it should be dissolved right away. Staying together for the kids is bad for not only the sdults, but for the kids too. Living in an f-d up family environment where the parents aren't happy together is harder on kids than a divorce would be, any day of the week.

Luckily, that wasn't me, but I have many friends and other family members where that's the case. It is f-d up hardcore.

On a side note, my step-father caught his wife having an affair with a preist. Want to talk about messed up.

 

[SethO]

I also wonder what it's like for single guys who are used to golfing whenever and however much they like. If they started dating a person who didn't golf, could they or would they give up some of their golf time?

I absolutely could. There is a hole in my life that golf cannot touch and I am trying to find the woman who will fill that gap. I have no question that golf will take a back seat and I will have absolutely no problem with that. Golf is not life not even for most tour professionals (Most of them are married no?). Golf is simply a game to be enjoyed. The only difference between the avid golfer and avid World of Warcraft player is that one is more physical than the other. When you have a bad round, golf will not console you, but a loving wife will. Why give that up for something as sterile as golf?

 

[Tbox]

Ok my question is to guys that have young ones at home. How do you get out 2-4 times a week? I get out two times a week at most and I have a 7 month old at home. The reason I only get out that much is because i want to spend time at home with my son and wife since I work all day. I'm not saying that you guys don't, but I guess my real question is what kind of jobs do you guys have and can I work where you do?

I normally go play on Monday and Thursday during the week. My wife has a group of friends that hang out every other Monday. They meet at someones house and take the kids so they can play while the girls talk. I will also take my 2 year old with me when he is home. I am also off work every other Friday so I will usually golf with a money group then and don't take the kid. I also tee off at 8:30 most Saturdays. That way I'm through by 1:00 and can spend the rest of the afternoon and evening with my family.

 

[Canadan]

Has it always been this way, where you enjoyed your free time and she enjoyed hers? Do you find that the issue lies in her not being active in her life more so than you being active in your own?

I know some suggest that they'd give up the world for the one they love, and I probably would too, but frankly, my wife and I would kill each other if we did not have certain aspects of our lives that are independent. We eat most meals together, and shop, do yardwork, golf, and attend social gatherings together, but we don't watch tv together (thank god) and we have fairly busy lives that sometimes keeps us apart for most of a day.

I would agree that some level of flexibility is needed, but it sounds more like she's bored and you're not, and it's starting to get to her. That may be extremely harsh sounding, but I have a close friend who is experiencing the same issue. It's not a matter of them needing to spend more time together, but a matter of his spouse not having her own outlet that she had in the past. During the times where she has things to do, she couldn't care less and actually suggests the guy go to the golf course.

Sorry to hear you're struggling dude.. 25 years is a long time to get comfortable with something only to find out it's not working for someone else..

 

[GolferGal]

I absolutely could. There is a hole in my life that golf cannot touch and I am trying to find the woman who will fill that gap. I have no question that golf will take a back seat and I will have absolutely no problem with that. Golf is not life not even for most tour professionals (Most of them are married no?). Golf is simply a game to be enjoyed. The only difference between the avid golfer and avid World of Warcraft player is that one is more physical than the other. When you have a bad round, golf will not console you, but a loving wife will. Why give that up for something as sterile as golf?

I would agree. But at the same time if Golf is the one thing that has always been a constant in your life and say it's the one thing that truly brings you joy then could you give it up? Although, a good relationship would be about compromise, so in that case you wouldn't have to give it up completely but cut back to learn better time management. I am just playing devil's advocate here. Honestly, I could never answer a question like this because I never had a passion. I never played sports, or was ever really good at anything. I never collected things or had to go to every sports game, or anything like that. So I don't know what it would be like to give up something that could potentially mean the world to you. That would be such an easy decision for me because I would always pick the person, but I don't know what it would be like if I had something else that meant that much to me. And of course now, my husband is what means the world to me so if someone said I had to give up golf, or whatever else I was interested in, I would give that up for him in a heartbeat.

 

[timmyak]

I normally go play on Monday and Thursday during the week. My wife has a group of friends that hang out every other Monday. They meet at someones house and take the kids so they can play while the girls talk. I will also take my 2 year old with me when he is home. I am also off work every other Friday so I will usually golf with a money group then and don't take the kid. I also tee off at 8:30 most Saturdays. That way I'm through by 1:00 and can spend the rest of the afternoon and evening with my family.

I need to find my wife a group of friends with kids that like to hang out lol. J/k because my wife lets me go when I want which is awesome. The thing that gets in the way for me is parties and stuff on the weekends. We know too many people I guess.

 

[McRock]

Wow, this thread caught my attentions. Skimmed, sorry, so I'll post my quick thought.

I have never been that deep, but I have received the comments of "your never home, your always playing golf, you talk about golf too much, etc." But in the end, what my wife always says is that "at least your not sitting at home drinking all night." I've thanked her several times for not minding and being supportive of all my golf craziness, and each time, she just says "it's better than you sitting at home getting drunk." Clearly, my wife prefers that I go out and golf, which she knows I golf without drinking, than staying at home bored, drinking.

Unfortunately, there is no way for me to apply that story to you. That is simply my situation, and it is a positive one. I could joke that maybe you should sit around home drinking for 10-15 straight nights, but that won't go anywhere good. I don't have an answer, I just know that my wife would rather I golf than sit at home and drink out of boredom.

 

[Zimmy]

Wow. I'm not sure what I expected when I posted this a couple of hours ago, but it wasn't this. Thanks to all who responded. Following are some clarifying points from questions raised.

1. Our children are both in their early 20s. The oldest one is in the service while the other's in college. The youngest one doesn't live at home, even during the summer. There both great, well-adjusted kids. Much credit goes to their mother, who was a stay-at-home Mom, and a great one at that. If we were ever to separate I'm sure they'd be shocked, but I can't see it being that devastating to them. My parents divorced when I was in my mid-20s. I didn't like, but certainly understood why it was necessary for them to do so.

2. It's not a matter of being in love my .3 handicap, but the freedom it represents. For me, in order to play well I need to play a lot. I don't really care if my handicap were a .3, a 3, or a 13. What matters to me is knowing that it's the best it can be for the moment, and that I'm working on improving. By playing 2-3 times a week I would, at best, be simply trying to maintain where I am, and more likely start regressing. Why is this so important to me? I don't now. But it is. Is it more important than marraige? Good question, which in and of itself says a lot.

3. The move to the new city has been hard for both of us, but particularly on my wife. I left for a new position, so when we got here I essentailly was switching one life for another. For my wife it has been more difficult. She feels like she gave up one life for another, and quite frankly, she'd rather have her old one back. My old job has been filled, so there is no chance of moving back any time soon. I expect to retire in 3-4 years. We've talked about where we'll move then. I'd rather move to a warm climate, and she'd rather move back to where we were.

4. My wife and I have a good marraige. I know that probably seems incosistent with my thread, but it's true. In nearly 26 years of marraige I've never had to sleep on the couch, or she's never had to spend a night in a hotel room because I've upset her. No affairs. No drinking or other drug issues. No abuse, verbal, physical or otherswise. In fact, if we ever did split up, I could almost guarantee it would be a "that's the last couple I thought that would ever happen to" discussion with our friends. Golf is but a sympton of a larger diease. With no kids in the home, and no career outside the home, she naturally has latched back on to me. It makes me feel awful to admit, but I don't like it. She's not necessarily the needy type, meaning it's not a situation of her being "I just can't live without you" kinda of person. For her it's a matter of maintaining her self-respect and worth. Which I get. She doesn't feel she should have to take a backseat to a hobby. And she's right. She shouldn't. It doesn't necessarily make it easier, but I totally get where she's coming from.

5. One of the best comments so far was the one related to what I'd do if an accident suddenly took golf away from me. What would I think then? Really good question. I'll be thinking about that one all day. It certainly does put a good perspective on it.

Thanks again to all who responded. My wife is not the problem. I am. She is a great person. If I could do it all over again, I'd marry her again in a heart beat. She's been a wonderful mother to our kids, and a great partner and friend to me. It actually would be a little easier if I could muster up a little bit of anger against her, but I can't.

 

[scott_d]

If you have to think about whether only getting to play golf 2 or 3 times a week is worth the marriage I would say that the marriage sounds like it is over already. If you are even having to think about the decision there are more serious issues than golf.

I go through spells when I play more than other times. Last summer I played several days a week because my wife was working late hours and doing a good bit of traveling for work. I simply played when she was tied up working late or out of town. This year, most weeks I am playing 9 holes one evening after work and play 18 on Sundays. She goes to the gym on Sundays (it is an hour drive to her gym as she goes to one close to her work) and I get to play 18 with my golf buddies and have a beer or two afterwards.

If she is working late or on a saturday I may play more. When she goes out of town I will play more. Between her work and mine we make the time to spend together and also time to do what we enjoy separately - golf for me and gym, quilting and gardening for her).

I am also in the camp that says your game will not go downhill that much if you "only" get to play 2 or 3 times a week.

 

[lemmiwinks]

Ok my question is to guys that have young ones at home. How do you get out 2-4 times a week? I get out two times a week at most and I have a 7 month old at home. The reason I only get out that much is because i want to spend time at home with my son and wife since I work all day. I'm not saying that you guys don't, but I guess my real question is what kind of jobs do you guys have and can I work where you do?

I work 4 10 hour shifts M-Th.
I take my 4 year old usually every other Friday to the course with me.
The weekends I don't take him, I go with friends.

Don't get me wrong, I only just started playing again this year since before he was born.
If I got home from work tonight and my wife said "It's me or Golf", I tell her to take a .......
Just kidding, I don't think that she'd say that because she knows that playing golf makes me happy.
Granted I don't play 2+ rounds a week, but I've also never told her to stop liking all things Coach, shoes or the beach.

 

[CharlieMoy]

Sounds to me like you need a new job to free up some time, not getting rid of your wife.

I've been lucky to have my girlfriend start playing over the past couple months. It excites me her potential and I think the quality time may actually be better f you spend it together on the course.

 

[cj3ap2]

If you're retiring in 3 years anyway, it would seem that compromising on how much you golf would only be a temporary thing anyway. After you retire you'll have twice as much time to spend on golf and the wife. win-win

I'm no expert on these matters by any imaginable stretch, but i'd imagine a short term 3 year compromise is an easier change than a divorce.

 

[burmbuster]

For what its worth, I would give up the game in a second for my wife.
Marriage to me is about being with my best friend every day.
I gave up golf a while back for my career at the time and would do so again in a minute if that choice was presented to me.

If the choice is golf or marriage and someone is even thinking about the options, then there are more issues at stake than just the game of golf. They are just being cloaked by an easy target.

Bingo. JB, you hit the nail on the head. I really don't see this ending very happily. I'm not trying to be negetive here but look at the facts as you stated them.
1) She is not going to be happy unless you stay home more or spend more time with her.
2) You will not be happy if you conceed
3) You already stated you would rather play golf than spend time with your wife
The last one really sticks out to me. How can you pick a hobby over your wife? If you don't fill the void, someone else will.

 

[KellyBo]

Take it from someone who has been there, splitting after being together over 20+ years is much more difficult than you can imagine even if it's what you want. I hope you two can work this out. It seems like she needs something in her life that makes her as happy as your golf makes you. I doubt you slacking a bit is going to fix that but she needs to KNOW that she matters to you more than the game does. I hope you two will consider counseling or at least talking through this and coming up with your own plan.

 

[Tbox]

]If you're retiring in 3 years anyway[/B], it would seem that compromising on how much you golf would only be a temporary thing anyway. After you retire you'll have twice as much time to spend on golf and the wife. win-win

I'm no expert on these matters by any imaginable stretch, but i'd imagine a short term 3 year compromise is an easier change than a divorce.

It would seem to me that if he is retiring in 3 years, there is another reason why he is considering this. Not the lack of golf.

 

[blugold]

1. Our children are both in their early 20s. The oldest one is in the service while the other's in college. The youngest one doesn't live at home, even during the summer. There both great, well-adjusted kids. Much credit goes to their mother, who was a stay-at-home Mom, and a great one at that. If we were ever to separate I'm sure they'd be shocked, but I can't see it being that devastating to them. My parents divorced when I was in my mid-20s. I didn't like, but certainly understood why it was necessary for them to do so..

What would you tell your kids was the reason why you and your wife divorced?

2. It's not a matter of being in love my .3 handicap, but the freedom it represents. For me, in order to play well I need to play a lot. I don't really care if my handicap were a .3, a 3, or a 13. What matters to me is knowing that it's the best it can be for the moment, and that I'm working on improving. By playing 2-3 times a week I would, at best, be simply trying to maintain where I am, and more likely start regressing. Why is this so important to me? I don't now. But it is. Is it more important than marraige? Good question, which in and of itself says a lot..

So being a really good golfer is more important to you than being a supportive and understanding husband?

 

[JB]

What would you tell your kids was the reason why you and your wife divorced?

What is wrong with telling children in their early adulthood that things are not working out and a separation is needed. That it is not a lack of love, but sometimes things are more complicated than that.

It seems that most young adults would understand that emotions are different for different people, and heck, they are probably more aware than you believe. I will say it again, its not a black and white thing with children, especially those that are adults.

I know its not your intent here, but there is no reason to vilify this individual for asking the question or sharing his feelings. It is coming off that way and I just dont think something that is this emotional inside needs to looked down upon regardless of his decisions because in the end, they are just that, his decisions. Whether we agree or not, he has not cheated, lied, broken any law, or anything else (that we know of). In fact just thinking about these questions, shows that he does care and has painted a picture of an admirable woman that has tolerated a lot, just not accepting of his current activity choice timeline.

 

[One-T]

This thread should outlast the Razr X Tour thread

 

[blugold]

What is wrong with telling children in their early adulthood that things are not working out and a separation is needed. That it is not a lack of love, but sometimes things are more complicated than that.

It seems that most young adults would understand that emotions are different for different people, and heck, they are probably more aware than you believe. I will say it again, its not a black and white thing with children, especially those that are adults.

I know its not your intent here, but there is no reason to vilify this individual for asking the question or sharing his feelings. It is coming off that way and I just dont think something that is this emotional inside needs to looked down upon regardless of his decisions because in the end, they are just that, his decisions. Whether we agree or not, he has not cheated, lied, broken any law, or anything else (that we know of). In fact just thinking about these questions, shows that he does care and has painted a picture of an admirable woman that has tolerated a lot, just not accepting of his current activity choice timeline.

I'm not trying to villify. I support the OP in taking a good look at his marriage and priorities.

The point behind my question, "what would you tell your kids was the reason you got divorced." is why are you getting divorced. It isn't so he can play as much golf as he does now. The reason is something bigger than that, which I am not sure if it's been addressed.

My point, be honest with what the bigger reason is.

 

[Richard Rodgers]

Well Zimmy,

There are many valid points floating around here, from both men and women. I am very happily married and have been for 23yrs in October. These days, to even stay married for the length of time you have is a feat in itself but I can't help thinking that you are ready to cast it all aside.

Yes I love golf, it is my passion, and yes as I have stated before on here, I would sell the car before the clubs to raise cash. However much I enjoy playing golf I would not let it wreck my marriage. I, and prob almost everyone on here plays golf as a release from the stresses of daily working life. There are times when we all need to get to the course and bash the s%&t out of that little white ball because someone at work has wound us up so much. I play once per week and can safely keep between 4-6 hcap no problem and I enjoy it. Prior to being married I played 3 times a week and played steady at 3 hcap but cut that down out of fairness to my wife.

I am now older and wise enough to realise that I will never make any money from golf so play to enjoy with my mates. We always have a laugh and then I go home to my wife and kids. If I were to play too much my hobby would soon become more like a job and it would take the enjoyment out of it.

I know that if I played as much as you do i would not have to be posting a question like yours here because my wife would have walked out long ago. The fact that you have posted here suggests that you may be frightened of discussing things with the little lady and are looking for amunition from people on here so that if it all blows up you can poss say to her that others backed you up in some way and try and shift some of the blame.

For god's sake, be a MAN and sit down with her and sort it out. You will regret it if you don't.

 

[One-T]

ahh man, this thread almost got off the first page. we can do it...

 

[Golf 'N Gator]

For what its worth, I would give up the game in a second for my wife.
Marriage to me is about being with my best friend every day.
I gave up golf a while back for my career at the time and would do so again in a minute if that choice was presented to me.

If the choice is golf or marriage and someone is even thinking about the options, then there are more issues at stake than just the game of golf. They are just being cloaked by an easy target.

I tried, but I could not think of any way to say it better than this. I would give up everything for my wife.

 

[Jman]

My wife is my world. She's my high-school sweetheart and we've been through thick and thin.

I love golf, but I love her more than anything else on this planet. It's not even a question for me.