Guide me on soft stepping.

Nippon Shafts

OGputtnfool

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So, I have the AMT White X100 in my irons. I like the shaft, but I feel like it's just a bit much for me. When I hit it right, it's ok, but I don't feel like it's the right shaft for me if that makes sense. I have been contemplating getting the same shaft in an S300, but just realized, for far less, I could just pick up a 4i or 4i and 5i shaft(s) and soft step them once or twice.

My question is, what can I expect from it other than 1/3 flex soft, I think? Little higher flight and little more spin? How would the spin and flight compare to the S300? Would the S300 be softer/higher/spinnier than either soft stepped offering?
 

OldandStiff

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So, I have the AMT White X100 in my irons. I like the shaft, but I feel like it's just a bit much for me. When I hit it right, it's ok, but I don't feel like it's the right shaft for me if that makes sense. I have been contemplating getting the same shaft in an S300, but just realized, for far less, I could just pick up a 4i or 4i and 5i shaft(s) and soft step them once or twice.

My question is, what can I expect from it other than 1/3 flex soft, I think? Little higher flight and little more spin? How would the spin and flight compare to the S300? Would the S300 be softer/higher/spinnier than either soft stepped offering?
I will consider these questions more when I'm at the range hopefully getting some eyes on and numbers shortly, but the amt white X100 I recently soft-stepped (twice) seemed to be playing markedly different in the long irons than the S300's I played a lot earlier this year. I'm taking a couple of the S300's with me to get a better feel for it.
 

OGputtnfool

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...the amt white X100 I recently soft-stepped (twice) seemed to be playing markedly different in the long irons than the S300's I played a lot earlier this year.
Anxiously awaiting your input on this especially.

What club are the S300's in? Are they AMT White S300's?
 

OldandStiff

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Anxiously awaiting your input on this especially.

What club are the S300's in? Are they AMT White S300's?
Yeah, amt white s300 (black). That's what I had on my forged tec, and if I could find them in black again I'd buy like 5 more sets. I was wanting to go just a tad stiffer, and save the 6g with the twice soft X100s. I put S300s in cf16 4,5,6 a couple nights ago to compare to the X100 in cf19s. Closest I had laying around. I have extra cf19 heads, but they're busy right now.
 

blueonblack

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Interesting. Have one set of flighted shafts in Tour Concept S300. Really a nice shaft, although I'm not sure how they would turn out either if double soft-stepped.
The long irons already have a higher flight, so not sure how much that would be exaserbated with two soft steppings. The same questions come to mind with the Whites. Can you feel a difference in the tip section on the long irons when installed straight in?
 

Summit

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The biggest issue you run into with shafts that are not constant weight is flex. The heavier heads of the short irons end up going in shafts designed for the lighter heads of the mid irons. So the 1/3 rule doesn’t apply exactly as well as some different results in the end with flight and such. There is no way to truly answer your questions about flight though, because I don’t know what CPM the shafts will be at or how you’ll respond to the different weight/feel

If you’re double soft stepping, I would suggest going with another shaft altogether. The AMT series is not something I typically hard or soft step almost ever. If I see my golfers have ok results with them, but it’s not exactly what we are looking for, we move on to something else. My advice is to jump ship on this one with the AMTs. I would move to something else that has a similar profile, but plays a touch softer than the X100 AMT White.
 

OGputtnfool

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The biggest issue you run into with shafts that are not constant weight is flex. The heavier heads of the short irons end up going in shafts designed for the lighter heads of the mid irons. So the 1/3 rule doesn’t apply exactly as well as some different results in the end with flight and such. There is no way to truly answer your questions about flight though, because I don’t know what CPM the shafts will be at or how you’ll respond to the different weight/feel

If you’re double soft stepping, I would suggest going with another shaft altogether. The AMT series is not something I typically hard or soft step almost ever. If I see my golfers have ok results with them, but it’s not exactly what we are looking for, we move on to something else. My advice is to jump ship on this one with the AMTs. I would move to something else that has a similar profile, but plays a touch softer than the X100 AMT White.
Thank you. I appreciate your input greatly.
 

OldandStiff

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What shaft would you suggest for someone who plays AMT white extremely well, but is between flexes, @Summit ? I think that's basically what @OGputtnfool was saying his issue is. Or is for me. I really enjoy theml, and was kind of doing a weight experiment by putting them together this way this time. I'm kind of between flexes, but the non-constant weight seems to play more of an importance for me than nailing the flex.

They feel slightly different in the long irons soft stepped like that, but not terribly so. I think it seemed more dramatic during the round the other day because I had literally never swung them until on course. Timing just a tad different than I was used to.

Personally, after the range session and some quick swings on a monitor, I think you'd probably be fine soft stepping yours once OG. I didn't have an appointment so I couldn't sign in, but I took as many swings as I could fit in between others' sessions and the difference between the irons wasn't anything crazy. S300 cf16 avg ball speed was 2 mph higher, which wasn't a surprise because they're a little stronger than my 19s. Launch was near identical, but the x100s spun quite a bit less. With the 6's the x100 averaged 3.5 mph better ball speed and the flight was real good. Degree and a half higher launch (16s were slightly stronger though) and a little less spin.

Limited time, and it's just one outing, but I was surprised that the X100s were launching the same or slightly higher, but spinning less. Once I got comfortable with them on the range, I know without having to check that I was swinging them faster than the s300s.

I feel like soft stepping them definitely changed the profile a little. They don't feel quite the same as the s300. I would still call them a little stiffer though, just in a little different way.
 

OldandStiff

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I wouldn't draw too much from my personal experience though. I'm an aggressive transition handle puller that likes stiff butts, enjoys C-tapers, and gets a lower launch with mid profile driver shafts than I do my 'low launch' ones. OG and I do like those same driver shafts though...
 

Summit

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What shaft would you suggest for someone who plays AMT white extremely well, but is between flexes, @Summit ? I think that's basically what @OGputtnfool was saying his issue is. Or is for me. I really enjoy theml, and was kind of doing a weight experiment by putting them together this way this time. I'm kind of between flexes, but the non-constant weight seems to play more of an importance for me than nailing the flex.

They feel slightly different in the long irons soft stepped like that, but not terribly so. I think it seemed more dramatic during the round the other day because I had literally never swung them until on course. Timing just a tad different than I was used to.

Personally, after the range session and some quick swings on a monitor, I think you'd probably be fine soft stepping yours once OG. I didn't have an appointment so I couldn't sign in, but I took as many swings as I could fit in between others' sessions and the difference between the irons wasn't anything crazy. S300 cf16 avg ball speed was 2 mph higher, which wasn't a surprise because they're a little stronger than my 19s. Launch was near identical, but the x100s spun quite a bit less. With the 6's the x100 averaged 3.5 mph better ball speed and the flight was real good. Degree and a half higher launch (16s were slightly stronger though) and a little less spin.

Limited time, and it's just one outing, but I was surprised that the X100s were launching the same or slightly higher, but spinning less. Once I got comfortable with them on the range, I know without having to check that I was swinging them faster than the s300s.

I feel like soft stepping them definitely changed the profile a little. They don't feel quite the same as the s300. I would still call them a little stiffer though, just in a little different way.
Without knowing some more info, it’s tough to point anyone in the right direction. @OGputtnfool and @OldandStiff , what did you feel AND see in the shafts that you liked and disliked?

Feel free to message me as well if you want to dive deeper.
 

BeCu_Ping

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So, I have the AMT White X100 in my irons. I like the shaft, but I feel like it's just a bit much for me. When I hit it right, it's ok, but I don't feel like it's the right shaft for me if that makes sense. I have been contemplating getting the same shaft in an S300, but just realized, for far less, I could just pick up a 4i or 4i and 5i shaft(s) and soft step them once or twice.

My question is, what can I expect from it other than 1/3 flex soft, I think? Little higher flight and little more spin? How would the spin and flight compare to the S300? Would the S300 be softer/higher/spinnier than either soft stepped offering?
Not specific to shaft models you have referenced but I have soft stepped many TT, KBS, etc steel shafts in my irons over the years (mainly the long irons). IMO one step soft (ie. 4 iron taper tip in a 5 iron taper tip hosel/club head) did not give me higher ball flight or even a drastically different feel per se (much heavier/or lighter feel).

What I did feel was how the club felt in my swing and through the ball at impact. In other words the club felt equal to the other clubs in my set which is what I want. Because of the soft step shaft in the club my timing was what I expected and therefore I played with no worrying about how to manipulate the club ( I don't do well in that situation).

NOW I will say in short irons I have always if anything had to hard step but there is enough of a club head weight issue that has to be factored in as agin, those club heads or heavier and I believe do need to be tipped just right. Not so much for lighter club head longer irons --- at least not for me.

Again, I soft stepped to achieve a "feel" not a performance variable like more distance/higher - lower ball flight. Those variables would be addressed through bending the club or playing different club head style (cavity back, high cor face, etc). That is how I apply soft step for my game. Just wanted to share. Good luck.
 

Knot Right

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So, I have the AMT White X100 in my irons. I like the shaft, but I feel like it's just a bit much for me. When I hit it right, it's ok, but I don't feel like it's the right shaft for me if that makes sense. I have been contemplating getting the same shaft in an S300, but just realized, for far less, I could just pick up a 4i or 4i and 5i shaft(s) and soft step them once or twice.

My question is, what can I expect from it other than 1/3 flex soft, I think? Little higher flight and little more spin? How would the spin and flight compare to the S300? Would the S300 be softer/higher/spinnier than either soft stepped offering?
AMT Tour White shafts are ascending weight shafts. (lighter long irons to heavier short iron at 3 grams per shaft through the set)

It's hard to say how they will react after swing weighting them.
AMT TW CHART.JPG



You will be dropping a different profile into at least 2 clubs in the set. By the looks of the numbers I can see a difference, however small. It's something to keep in mind before you do anything.

To me, I think there will be at least two clubs in the set that would feel a little off from the others?

I will be watching this thread closely as I have never soft stepped a shaft like this and would love to hear from anyone that has.
 
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OGputtnfool

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AMT Tour White shafts are ascending weight shafts. (lighter long irons to heavier short iron at 3 grams per shaft through the set)

It's hard to say how they will react after swing weighting them.
View attachment 8955955



You will be dropping a different profile into at least 2 clubs in the set. By the looks of the numbers I can see a difference, however small. It's something to keep in mind before you do anything.

To me, I think there will be at least two clubs in the set that would feel a little off from the others?

I will be watching this thread closely as I have never soft stepped a shaft like this and would love to hear from anyone that has.
I'm debating whether I want to do it now after reading more from you guys. I think @OldandStiff has already soft stepped some so he may be able to help us all out.
 

OldandStiff

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I'm debating whether I want to do it now after reading more from you guys. I think @OldandStiff has already soft stepped some so he may be able to help us all out.
Yeah, and I wrote about my recent range and trackman session with them up higher (I had to double check I posted it in the right thread). I'm going to play them again my next time out, which was supposed to be tomorrow. If I can't move better by then though, it'll have to wait.
 

OGputtnfool

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Yeah, and I wrote about my recent range and trackman session with them up higher (I had to double check I posted it in the right thread). I'm going to play them again my next time out, which was supposed to be tomorrow. If I can't move better by then though, it'll have to wait.
I completely missed that when you posted it. Good stuff.

I'm not so sure I'm between flexes per se. S300 would likely fit me much better. However, if I can get close enough SSing them once, then I might do that to save some $.
 

Summit

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I don’t want to make it seem like it’s impossible to soft or hard step AMTs, it’s not at all. When I read the original post, I saw it as the shaft not being the right fit in general. I only soft or hard step a shaft when it’s the right fit, but there is potential for it to be slightly too stiff or soft. I don’t soft or hard step to change profiles of the shaft, change launch, change flight etc.

I played soft stepped PX 6.5 for years. I fit the mold for straight in 6.5, but noticed halfway through a round I was struggling just a little with my irons. I felt like I was having to work more than I did earlier in the round. After soft stepping them, it helped a lot. That’s an example of when to step shafts. If you’re testing a shaft out and it feels difficult during the testing, I would say it’s not the right shaft.

What I typically see with AMTs is the golfer loves the shaft in certain parts of the set, but struggles a little in others, whether that’s the short irons or long irons. However, those are my experiences and mean nothing other than a personal opinion.
 

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So, I have the AMT White X100 in my irons. I like the shaft, but I feel like it's just a bit much for me. When I hit it right, it's ok, but I don't feel like it's the right shaft for me if that makes sense. I have been contemplating getting the same shaft in an S300, but just realized, for far less, I could just pick up a 4i or 4i and 5i shaft(s) and soft step them once or twice.

My question is, what can I expect from it other than 1/3 flex soft, I think? Little higher flight and little more spin? How would the spin and flight compare to the S300? Would the S300 be softer/higher/spinnier than either soft stepped offering?
I don't know about 1/3 less flex - it makes the tip section softer, which will help you get the ball up in the air and spin a bit more. I had PX LZ Pro 90 graphite shafts in 6.0 - softstepped them, which made them playable as I am more of a 5.5 guy. Did not like them on the range but they worked on the course with a real golf ball.
 

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I'm playing soft stepped iron shafts, but in a much softer flex. I'm using Dynamic Gold R300s soft stepped one-time. My goal was to make the shafts a little bit softer and a little bit lighter. I had Golfworks do the assembly.


Dave
 

OldandStiff

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What I typically see with AMTs is the golfer loves the shaft in certain parts of the set, but struggles a little in others, whether that’s the short irons or long irons. However, those are my experiences and mean nothing other than a personal opinion.
You're not alone in the opinion. I've yet to hear a fitter who really likes AMTs. I assume there are valid experiences that color those opinions. I arrived at them by chance, and just happened to play them well. Since then I've really looked and listened for others playing them, and I haven't found them to be common out there, but I have noticed that the ones that like them really like them, and for some reason an abnormally high percentage of them are real good golfers. There are a few other scratch guys here who swear by them.

My next outing with these frankenstick experiments is going to have to wait just a bit though. Fighting some medical all the sudden.
 

OGputtnfool

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You're not alone in the opinion. I've yet to hear a fitter who really likes AMTs. I assume there are valid experiences that color those opinions. I arrived at them by chance, and just happened to play them well. Since then I've really looked and listened for others playing them, and I haven't found them to be common out there, but I have noticed that the ones that like them really like them, and for some reason an abnormally high percentage of them are real good golfers. There are a few other scratch guys here who swear by them.

My next outing with these frankenstick experiments is going to have to wait just a bit though. Fighting some medical all the sudden.
Get well, man. Some of us live for your live updates.
 

OldandStiff

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So I played the double soft stepped x100 yesterday. I hadn't planned on playing 18, but did, and missed 2 greens by a total of 4 feet. I honestly don't think they're much different now that I've hit them more. Little softer is all. That first time I took them out I hadn't hit them prior and was actively talking about how I was struggling (in general, not just with them) during that round. If they're launching higher, it is marginal for me. Degree or so at most. I only have the spin numbers from the other day, but distances were as expected for how I was swinging or a little longer, and flights were strong. Expected roll out on greens and fairways. I needed to hit a 5-iron stinger on 17, and had no trouble with the 3-iron tip in it on a really tough shot.

It's your time and money @OGputtnfool , but I honestly don't think you'll notice much moving them down 1 other a little softer feel and tip. Just me 2 cents though.
 

OGputtnfool

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So I played the double soft stepped x100 yesterday. I hadn't planned on playing 18, but did, and missed 2 greens by a total of 4 feet. I honestly don't think they're much different now that I've hit them more. Little softer is all. That first time I took them out I hadn't hit them prior and was actively talking about how I was struggling (in general, not just with them) during that round. If they're launching higher, it is marginal for me. Degree or so at most. I only have the spin numbers from the other day, but distances were as expected for how I was swinging or a little longer, and flights were strong. Expected roll out on greens and fairways. I needed to hit a 5-iron stinger on 17, and had no trouble with the 3-iron tip in it on a really tough shot.

It's your time and money @OGputtnfool , but I honestly don't think you'll notice much moving them down 1 other a little softer feel and tip. Just me 2 cents though.
I've got an offer on some AMT White S300's on eBay right now. If that doesn't get accepted, I might look at this. I've actually been hitting the irons better now and my driver has left the building for a bit. Ugh...
 

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jin_xianjun

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I don’t want to make it seem like it’s impossible to soft or hard step AMTs, it’s not at all. When I read the original post, I saw it as the shaft not being the right fit in general. I only soft or hard step a shaft when it’s the right fit, but there is potential for it to be slightly too stiff or soft. I don’t soft or hard step to change profiles of the shaft, change launch, change flight etc.

I played soft stepped PX 6.5 for years. I fit the mold for straight in 6.5, but noticed halfway through a round I was struggling just a little with my irons. I felt like I was having to work more than I did earlier in the round. After soft stepping them, it helped a lot. That’s an example of when to step shafts. If you’re testing a shaft out and it feels difficult during the testing, I would say it’s not the right shaft.

What I typically see with AMTs is the golfer loves the shaft in certain parts of the set, but struggles a little in others, whether that’s the short irons or long irons. However, those are my experiences and mean nothing other than a personal opinion.
Not to go the other way with this but just curious - Have you tried hardstepping PX6.0's? Or did you stick with the soft step for weight reasons? I ask because I can play both 6.0 and 6.5 but sticking with 6.0. I could use the little weight though.
 

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