How do I cure my 'casting'?

[luckydutch]

This particular issue is absolutely killing my swing at the moment as it can cause everything from a shot off the heel to a shot off the toe, chunks, tops and everything in between... including a lot of vicious slices.

I feel like the first half of my downswing is OK-ish. It's a bit steep but I am absolutely leading with my hips as they reach a point of being slightly open to target by the time I reach about half way through my downswing. However, in the bottom part of my downswing I 'cast' the club down, straighten my arms and my weight ends up on my toes.

Now, I did have a lesson on this but the instructor spend the entire time getting me to turn with my hips which did not help at all. I've spent the last few weeks practicing what he said but it has made no improvement. I try to turn my hips but they get kinda stuck at just past neutral/slightly open until I've hit the ball and then they continue to open. I cannot for the life of me get them to turn any more than they are doing so I feel pretty certain the hips getting stuck is symptom not cause.

I'm absolutely at my wits' end with this now and it's making it hard to enjoy a round as I can't string together two good shots together.

Taking any any all suggestions!!!

View attachment ‘Casting Swing’ - Imgur.mp4
View attachment ‘Casting Swing’ - Imgur (1).mp4

 

[razaar]

Sam Snead wrote that locking the right knee during the backswing is pure poison. It can straighten but not locked. In order to lead the downswing with the left hip, the shoulders need to stay turned and the tailbone needs to rotate away from the target and the right knee staying solid and pointing outside the right foot during transition. It is a lot of multitasking that needs to occur in the timeframe of milliseconds.

 

[luckydutch]

Sam Snead wrote that locking the right knee during the backswing is pure poison. It can straighten but not locked. In order to lead the downswing with the left hip, the shoulders need to stay turned and the tailbone needs to rotate away from the target and the right knee staying solid and pointing outside the right foot during transition. It is a lot of multitasking that needs to occur in the timeframe of milliseconds.

Oof that’ll be a tricky one for me. My back is a knotted tight mess and I really don’t think I can complete a backswing without opening the hips that much. I can certainly give it a try if it might help though. Do you think that could have an impact on my balance/casting issue?

 

[razaar]

Oof that’ll be a tricky one for me. My back is a knotted tight mess and I really don’t think I can complete a backswing without opening the hips that much. I can certainly give it a try if it might help though. Do you think that could have an impact on my balance/casting issue?

Do you walk with locked knees? The legs need to have freedom also in the golf swing not locked up. Loosen up your arms also, they look very tight in the video.

 

[OHIO]

Backswing, left shoulder down and back, then right shoulder down and through ball. Looks like your raising up, especially on downswing.

 

[Molten]

I’ll tell you what, I’d say a few lessons and you are going to be a monster on the course. I won’t dabble with the swing but there are some good things in there that will shine if you figure out that match up. Good luck!

 

[luckydutch]

Backswing, left shoulder down and back, then right shoulder down and through ball. Looks like your raising up, especially on downswing.

I definitely am raising up, yes. I can see that. I can’t really work out why though! That’s what’s so frustrating about this problem is, it’s really hard to isolate the root of it. Lots of observable symptoms but it’s unclear as to what is causing them all.


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[luckydutch]

I’ll tell you what, I’d say a few lessons and you are going to be a monster on the course. I won’t dabble with the swing but there are some good things in there that will shine if you figure out that match up. Good luck!

I appreciate that, thank you. It’s really frustrating because I feel this issue is adding like 20-30 strokes to my game. The inconsistency it causes means I can hit a toe shot followed by a heal shot, then a slice, then a topped shot, then I round it off by chunking the ground.

My first lesson was completely unsuccessful as it just focused on turning my hips more which I already feel I am trying to do as much as my body will allow. I have another lesson booked for a month’s time so until then I’m just recording myself, trying different things and hoping something clicks!


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[tequila4kapp]

I definitely am raising up, yes. I can see that. I can’t really work out why though! That’s what’s so frustrating about this problem is, it’s really hard to isolate the root of it. Lots of observable symptoms but it’s unclear as to what is causing them all.


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You raise up because your mind knows that you are casting and you will need more room to keep the clubhead from striking several inches behind the ball.

Maybe try the drill where you split your hands by about 12-18” then swing.

 

[luckydutch]

You raise up because your mind knows that you are casting and you will need more room to keep the clubhead from striking several inches behind the ball.

Maybe try the drill where you split your hands by about 12-18” then swing.

Interesting thanks. Was unsure which was the chicken and which was the egg with the early extension vs casting.

I can try that drill. Do you mean space my hands apart on the grip with one hand further down and one higher up?


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[braveheart]

I have had this issue and what helps me is keep the wrist set (right wrist extension) or flat left wrist through impact. Actually, I think left knuckles down into the back of the ball and it accomplishes both wrist positions.

 

[tequila4kapp]

Interesting thanks. Was unsure which was the chicken and which was the egg with the early extension vs casting.

I can try that drill. Do you mean space my hands apart on the grip with one hand further down and one higher up?


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yes, exactly correct

 

[BostonSal]

Assuming you're right handed, are you lifting your left heel?
That's a killer for balance. Even if it shortens your backswing, it's worth avoiding.

After that, just pretend that there are two strikes on you and you're trying to hit to right.
If your clubhead beats your hands to the ball, that's a problem.
Concentrating on the rest of your body can just make it complicated.

Or at least that's how it worked for me.

 

[luckydutch]

Assuming you're right handed, are you lifting your left heel?
That's a killer for balance. Even if it shortens your backswing, it's worth avoiding.

After that, just pretend that there are two strikes on you and you're trying to hit to right.
If your clubhead beats your hands to the ball, that's a problem.
Concentrating on the rest of your body can just make it complicated.

Or at least that's how it worked for me.

Yes, I am and I do lift that left heel. Happens naturally in an attempt to rotate my hips further in the backswing.

Perhaps I'm a little shallow in the takeaway and that's causing me to actually over-rotate with my hips, lift my left heel and lock out that right leg?

I've been doing a few practice swings trying to re-train my hips to stay low and keep some bend in my knees during the backswing hoping that helps.

I really need to stop this 'early extension' with my hips and torso. It is definitely linked to my arms casting towards the ball in the downswing but it's really hard to fix. I seem to do it WAY more when there’s a ball in front of me vs just a practice swing. No idea why.

The difference between these two videos (with and without the ball is stark) but I cannot figure out why I swing so differently:

View attachment IMG_213600372.MOV
View attachment IMG_224857560.MOV

 

[Arlo]

Yes, I am and I do lift that left heel. Happens naturally in an attempt to rotate my hips further in the backswing.

Perhaps I'm a little shallow in the takeaway and that's causing me to actually over-rotate with my hips, lift my left heel and lock out that right leg?

I've been doing a few practice swings trying to re-train my hips to stay low and keep some bend in my knees during the backswing hoping that helps.

I really need to stop this 'early extension' with my hips and torso. It is definitely linked to my arms casting towards the ball in the downswing but it's really hard to fix. I seem to do it WAY more when there’s a ball in front of me vs just a practice swing. No idea why.

The difference between these two videos (with and without the ball is stark) but I cannot figure out why I swing so differently:

View attachment 9029115
View attachment 9029116

Our head and pelvis are two heaviest body parts and they counter balance in the coronal (frontal)plane.
EE is caused by the head rising during the DS. When head goes up the hips move toward the target line(frontal plane) its genetic in order to stay balanced, upright.

The solution: Have chin ahead of the toes at address and simply make it your intention to keep your chin ahead of your toes during the swing.
Now find balanced stance to make that happen then swing away.

 

[wadesworld]

I appreciate that, thank you. It’s really frustrating because I feel this issue is adding like 20-30 strokes to my game. The inconsistency it causes means I can hit a toe shot followed by a heal shot, then a slice, then a topped shot, then I round it off by chunking the ground.

My first lesson was completely unsuccessful as it just focused on turning my hips more which I already feel I am trying to do as much as my body will allow. I have another lesson booked for a month’s time so until then I’m just recording myself, trying different things and hoping something clicks!


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If the pro couldn't explain why you're early extending and casting so you know what moves you're trying to correct, I'd seriously consider trying another pro. That said, I have seen lessons where pros concentrate on a better turn as part of the fix to early extension. In general, they're trying to have the golfer move the left knee towards the right rather than towards the ground.

I'd be very careful about trying random fixes from people on the Internet. You've got a dozen different suggestions and if you try to implement too many or the wrong ones, you could get more and more out of sorts before your lesson.

 

[Arlo]

If the pro couldn't explain why you're early extending and casting so you know what moves you're trying to correct, I'd seriously consider trying another pro. That said, I have seen lessons where pros concentrate on a better turn as part of the fix to early extension. In general, they're trying to have the golfer move the left knee towards the right rather than towards the ground.

I'd be very careful about trying random fixes from people on the Internet. You've got a dozen different suggestions and if you try to implement too many or the wrong ones, you could get more and more out of sorts before your lesson.

Most golf instructors and biomechanists dont know much about physiology or genetic tendencies.
Ask your instructor if head and pelvis counter balance in the frontal plane. He will likely tell you how low his hdcp and
that is totally irrelevant. LOL

 

[luckydutch]

If the pro couldn't explain why you're early extending and casting so you know what moves you're trying to correct, I'd seriously consider trying another pro. That said, I have seen lessons where pros concentrate on a better turn as part of the fix to early extension. In general, they're trying to have the golfer move the left knee towards the right rather than towards the ground.

I'd be very careful about trying random fixes from people on the Internet. You've got a dozen different suggestions and if you try to implement too many or the wrong ones, you could get more and more out of sorts before your lesson.

I’ve realised that what I was doing, and the pro didn’t pick up on in the first lesson, was turning my hips but thrusting my pelvis forwards and diagonally to the right of the target, getting my weight onto my left toes. This made it really hard to continue my hip rotation until after I struck the ball.

I’ve been trying to practice getting my weight over onto my right heel instead which promotes better rotation.

Similarly, keeping my bend in my knees in the backswing and early downswing has also helped me to rotate my hips better.

Good progress this week.

However, the problem that I cannot for the life of me cure is the temptation to swing my hands (and thus the shaft) directly at the ball, rather than the space between my feet and the ball which, due to the angle of the club, would result in proper ball striking.

Even when I rotate my hips to be almost completely facing my target before impact, I still get a bit of casting and unhinging of my wrist because my hands are too far out in front of me, rather than staying close to my body. Really hard to cure this because normal sport logic dictates that you swing the bat/racket/whatever at the ball. In golf, due to the angle of the club-head, you don’t want to swing the shaft directly at the ball.


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[G$Indoor]

To get rid of the casting you should stop trying to make a complete backswing so you can learn how to get to impact consistently. Hit a ton of punch shots and only hit them for a month or so until you know what to do at the bottom. Fixing the legs is paramount to this process, but here's a quick video if you want to check it out also.

 

[Arlo]

I’ve realised that what I was doing, and the pro didn’t pick up on in the first lesson, was turning my hips but thrusting my pelvis forwards and diagonally to the right of the target, getting my weight onto my left toes. This made it really hard to continue my hip rotation until after I struck the ball.

I’ve been trying to practice getting my weight over onto my right heel instead which promotes better rotation.

Similarly, keeping my bend in my knees in the backswing and early downswing has also helped me to rotate my hips better.

Good progress this week.

However, the problem that I cannot for the life of me cure is the temptation to swing my hands (and thus the shaft) directly at the ball, rather than the space between my feet and the ball which, due to the angle of the club, would result in proper ball striking.

Even when I rotate my hips to be almost completely facing my target before impact, I still get a bit of casting and unhinging of my wrist because my hands are too far out in front of me, rather than staying close to my body. Really hard to cure this because normal sport logic dictates that you swing the bat/racket/whatever at the ball. In golf, due to the angle of the club-head, you don’t want to swing the shaft directly at the ball.


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I’ve realised that what I was doing, and the pro didn’t pick up on in the first lesson, was turning my hips but thrusting my pelvis forwards and diagonally to the right of the target, getting my weight onto my left toes. This made it really hard to continue my hip rotation until after I struck the ball.

I’ve been trying to practice getting my weight over onto my right heel instead which promotes better rotation.

Similarly, keeping my bend in my knees in the backswing and early downswing has also helped me to rotate my hips better.

Good progress this week.

However, the problem that I cannot for the life of me cure is the temptation to swing my hands (and thus the shaft) directly at the ball, rather than the space between my feet and the ball which, due to the angle of the club, would result in proper ball striking.

Even when I rotate my hips to be almost completely facing my target before impact, I still get a bit of casting and unhinging of my wrist because my hands are too far out in front of me, rather than staying close to my body. Really hard to cure this because normal sport logic dictates that you swing the bat/racket/whatever at the ball. In golf, due to the angle of the club-head, you don’t want to swing the shaft directly at the ball.


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When you swing a hammer at a nail, do you think of swinging your hands?
We use our hands to make use of tools every day of our lives and only when we pick up a golf club
we become obessed with swinging our hands. Why?
Suggest your intent from top of BS is to slide the clubface under the inside of the ball. Thats right, the clubface facing the sky under the inside of the ball.
Of course centrifugal force wont allow you to do exactly that, but the intent will give the proper intention to the rest of the body to support
that intent. Dont think about it.. just do it.

 

[luckydutch]

When you swing a hammer at a nail, do you think of swinging your hands?
We use our hands to make use of tools every day of our lives and only when we pick up a golf club
we become obessed with swinging our hands. Why?
Suggest your intent from top of BS is to slide the clubface under the inside of the ball. Thats right, the clubface facing the sky under the inside of the ball.
Of course centrifugal force wont allow you to do exactly that, but the intent will give the proper intention to the rest of the body to support
that intent. Dont think about it.. just do it.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s not intentional!! It’s my stupid sub conscious.

Even when I consciously try to keep my hands as tight to the body as possible, I watch a recording of myself and I’m still bloody doing it!

I’m not sure what you mean by your suggested intent there but I’m keen to try it. Do you mean I should be thinking about bringing the club face down closer to my feet than the ball, so effectively hitting it off the toe? But my brain will correct for it and hit it cleanly? Or do you mean something different?


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[TxAggie2018]

When you swing a hammer at a nail, do you think of swinging your hands?
We use our hands to make use of tools every day of our lives and only when we pick up a golf club
we become obessed with swinging our hands. Why?
Suggest your intent from top of BS is to slide the clubface under the inside of the ball. Thats right, the clubface facing the sky under the inside of the ball.
Of course centrifugal force wont allow you to do exactly that, but the intent will give the proper intention to the rest of the body to support
that intent. Dont think about it.. just do it.

I'm a bad caster and I'm going to try this.

 

[Jason89er]

I am by no means a swing expert so take this for what it is. I used to get stuck in a similar way. You look to be way more flexible than me and me and my instructor were able to correct it for the most part.

First I get really loose. REALLY loose. Hands, wrists, arms and shoulders. I keep a little extra flex in my knees on the backswing and focus on driving my right knee into the back of my left knee on the follow through. Always finishing with them touching and fully up on my right toes as I finish. Chest and shoulders FULLY facing the target. For me, focusing on where my lower body follow through position ends up made a huge difference and the upper body just followed naturally. I don’t even think about my backswing anymore really except how far back I take it. I’d kill to get into your backswing upper body extension and position. I just don’t bend that way. I think you are really close to having an amazing golf swing.

 

[Arlo]

I'm a bad caster and I'm going to try this.

Suggest at first use a short iron and tee the ball 1/4 inch up. Let your subconscious find the body position relative to the ball
that will allow you to slide the clubface under the ball(clubface toward the sky)... Be the clubface

 

[luckydutch]

I am by no means a swing expert so take this for what it is. I used to get stuck in a similar way. You look to be way more flexible than me and me and my instructor were able to correct it for the most part.

First I get really loose. REALLY loose. Hands, wrists, arms and shoulders. I keep a little extra flex in my knees on the backswing and focus on driving my right knee into the back of my left knee on the follow through. Always finishing with them touching and fully up on my right toes as I finish. Chest and shoulders FULLY facing the target. For me, focusing on where my lower body follow through position ends up made a huge difference and the upper body just followed naturally. I don’t even think about my backswing anymore really except how far back I take it. I’d kill to get into your backswing upper body extension and position. I just don’t bend that way. I think you are really close to having an amazing golf swing.

Thank you! Your advise about getting looser helped, actually. I tend to swing with a bit too much tension in my arms, in particular. Causes me to get a bit arm-y in the downswing, even if it's my hips and body leading.

Had a bit of a breakthrough on this subject this week over 2 range sessions.

Couple of things that resulted in radical improvement:

• Getting a bit looser and relaxed at address
• Standing a tiny bit closer (I believe I had over-corrected after being told by my pro that I was too close and ended up too far away, caused me to be on my toes and make hip rotation harder)
• Keeping my knees bent through the backswing and focusing more on weight transfer and less on rotation, the rotation is MUCH easier for me if I can get my weight and balance in the right place
• Focusing on getting my weight onto my left HEEL in the downswing and follow-through, not onto my toes

I think bad balance and weight transfer was causing my to thrust my hips up and left which rotates them a bit but then blocks them from further rotation. Staying a bit lower and driving my weight into that left heel in the downswing was transformational.

Did about 30 shots with irons and wedges today at the range before moving onto driver/hybrid and I don't think I topped a single one!! Very happy! It's still not a perfect swing; I'm pretty steep and have a bit of a fade but consistency in contact has improved immeasurably and I've gained about 10 yards on each iron.

Thanks for the help of everyone in this thread. I have regained a tonne of confidence now.