How do you score your GIR, Scrambling, and Putts near the green?

[zbeekner4]

IMO the stats aren't for anyone's consumption but your own so you should count them how you want. Personally if I am on the fringe 10 or 15 feet from the hole and I 2 putt from there I am counting that as 2 putts. I don't want to look at my stats and think my short game is great and I need to work on my iron game if I hit a shot onto the fringe and gave myself a really good shot at birdie. That is how I track stats when something is on the line.

This is me exactly. No one gives 2 craps about your stats except for you, so if I’m 3 inches from the green and it’s basically a normal putt, I count it as one. It’s only for feedback and figuring out how I can get better.

If I miss 14/14 fairways by an inch, my stats will say I’m terrible at driving and need to work on that. But that would be a big waste of time.Not saying everyone should cheat and not count each stat as it is but you have use some discretion

 

[DataDude]

This is me exactly. No one gives 2 craps about your stats except for you, so if I’m 3 inches from the green and it’s basically a normal putt, I count it as one. It’s only for feedback and figuring out how I can get better.

If I miss 14/14 fairways by an inch, my stats will say I’m terrible at driving and need to work on that. But that would be a big waste of time.Not saying everyone should cheat and not count each stat as it is but you have use some discretion

Yep, I hut a fade so if I am on a dogleg right and I aim down the left and hit pound it fairly strait, but it's 1 foot into the rough and I have a great shot at the green, then mission accomplished for my game. I really want to make sure I highlight my mistakes and don't count good shots against myself when I am stat counting. If I 3 putt from 15' on the fringe I want to know my putting sucked, not my short game and approach.

 

[Cmontgomery]

I’ve always counted a putt as a putt, regardless of fringe or green. I also only count a GIR if it is physically in the putting surface.

I’m intrigued by what the consensus is on what is right.

 

[Brucem609]

Sometimes stats are misleading. You really need to take everything into account.
2 putts from the fringe for a par is still a par. For a golfer like me, some stats are non conclusive

 

[BlueHen2006]

When I remember to track all this, I will count putts when they are on the green only. If I putt from the fringe I might make a note if I am counting chips too, So I can remember I used a putter on that shot but it’s rare.

 

[TCB2010]

Are you in Hastings? But are you moving is that what I read somewhere?

 

[myspinonit]

A few years ago I went for lessons with a guy I had seen before for issues "on my long game".

He asked me to track the next handful of rounds and come back. A check mark for every fairway hit, GIR,up and downs within 70 yards, and number of putts. An X for every one missed, and that included an X for EVERY shot from within 70 I didn't get the next one down. When he saw the string of X's for missed up and downs he said "so, you really think the problem is your LONG game?"

This doesn't specifically address the question the OP asked, or dealing with automated software. But for me, it's still the one I want to look at to improve, and I should likely start doing again. So, if that ball on the fringe was one that just missed getting on in reg, but you made the next shot, job done. (Check mark). If you were short on your second shot, the pitch/chip from within 70 yards got you on the fringe, and you missed the putt from the fringe, an X.

 

[mikeg_74]

You are absolutely tracking stats correctly. Like anything you have to look at the whole picture and get a better idea of your game.

for that reason I count putts every time the putter is in my hand. Off the green or on the fringe, if I putt i count it. That has helped me “normalize” my numbers and my game. For me It also helps me see where my deficiencies are in relation to GIR. The higher the putts per round usually means my ball striking was bad and of course my GIR suffered.

 

[OldandStiff]

Are you in Hastings? But are you moving is that what I read somewhere?

I'm in North Platte. We're moving (wife already has for work) to Little Rock. I had planned on being gone already, but things changed and it looks like end of this coming week.

Like I said, if you come this way while I'm still here shoot me a message. I don't have most of my clubs here, but I do have a bunch of Mavrik heads and shafts you can try, and I'm always up for a quick round if I have time.

 

[OldandStiff]

This is me exactly. No one gives 2 craps about your stats except for you, so if I’m 3 inches from the green and it’s basically a normal putt, I count it as one. It’s only for feedback and figuring out how I can get better.

If I miss 14/14 fairways by an inch, my stats will say I’m terrible at driving and need to work on that. But that would be a big waste of time.Not saying everyone should cheat and not count each stat as it is but you have use some discretion

I'm tempted to count a fairway or green on occasion when it's just off but EXACTLY where I wanted it, but I don't, because I want my stats to be accurate and like someone said, it's usually balanced out by one that's a bad strike but straight, or something like that. I don't even aim for the fairway on #1 at my old home club, because if you're in the fairway there's a huge tree in your way. So I aim left, go exactly where I wanted (left rough), and count it as a missed fairway. It all evens out in the end.

And I just track mine to compare to other people's who may do something better than me, so I know what I might need to work on, and to gauge my progress or regression on different things.

 

[OGputtnfool]

I'm just looking for some feedback to kind of double/triple check my process and numbers.

So I was taught that the fringe is not the green. That a GIR is being on the actual green. That number of putts is based solely on putts on the putting surface. That a putt from the fringe/fairway doesn't track towards total putts. So holing one from there is a 0-putt green, same as if you'd holed it using any other club.

I'm asking this because my numbers this year have gone in some kind of scary good direction when it comes to scrambling and putting. I've had a lot of what I score as a non-GIR (on the fringe/greenside short cut), that are within easy 2 stroke distance. So I chip or more importantly putt from there, tap in, and it's scored as a missed green, up and down (scramble), 1 putt. And that's right, right? I'm not asking to talk up my numbers or anything, I just want to make sure I absolutely have this right. Because as weird as those scrambling and putts numbers get, the only way to change that would seem to be to count them as GIR, and 2 putts (if I used the putter), and that can't be right. A green is a green. You have to be on for a GIR.

All this is correct.

Or just count it still as a scramble, and add 1 to total putts when I use a putter to do it? Which screws with the apps, because it doesn't seem right to them either, apparently. They autocorrect it. I'm just double checking the whole thing because it's kind of twisting my brain a little.

So how do you score those fringe-y holes?

The only time a stroke from off the green should count as a putt is if you putt the ball from on the green and it goes off. Once you're on the green, all successive strokes are counted as putts. Furthermore, if you use a wedge from on the green (similar to Gary Woodland's shot on 17 at last year's US Open), then that's counted as a putt.

 

[Tenputt]

Everybody has it correct. A strike with a putter is a putt only if on the green itself. However, Arccos will record a putt, if the putter is used. Thus, I count it as a putt if I used my putter. I am too lazy to go back and edit the Arccos data.

 

[OldandStiff]

Everybody has it correct. A strike with a putter is a putt only if on the green itself. However, Arccos will record a putt, if the putter is used. Thus, I count it as a putt if I used my putter. I am too lazy to go back and edit the Arccos data.

Interesting. So it's recorded as the third scenario then? A converted scramble and an extra putt?

 

[Tenputt]

Interesting. So it's recorded as the third scenario then? A converted scramble and an extra putt?

I guess. Arccos can only discern what club is hit, not whether its on the green or off. If it records a putt after two strikes on a par 4, its going to record the hole as a GIR. Thus, my database in Arccos has my GIR a bit higher than it truly is and my putting a bit worse than it is (i.e., more putts per round than what is actually happening.). I figure that as long as it is giving me a consistent database, I can still track my improvement, or, lately, my struggles.

 

[OldandStiff]

I guess. Arccos can only discern what club is hit, not whether its on the green or off. If it records a putt after two strikes on a par 4, its going to record the hole as a GIR. Thus, my database in Arccos has my GIR a bit higher than it truly is and my putting a bit worse than it is (i.e., more putts per round than what is actually happening.). I figure that as long as it is giving me a consistent database, I can still track my improvement, or, lately, my struggles.

Awesome. Thanks for responding. I've been really curious how some of that type of stuff is with arccos.

 

[leftshot]

You were taught according to the Rules of Golf. Like a lot of situations in golf there are 'good' misses and 'bad' misses around the green. Your stats will change as you game improves. Scrambling stats are influenced appreciably by how 'good' or 'bad' are your misses. Number of putts per round may actually increase for awhile as you hit more GIRs.

 

[G-Man]

I was taught the same way as you first cut is just that not a fairway, fringe is just that not a green. Since you are not on the green you cannot put so it's simply a stroke.

I think keeping these stats tell the true story. Miss by an inch foot or mile still missed and should be worked on. Especially with putting because if you are on the front it took you a shot (chip,flop, pot) to finalize

 

[OldandStiff]

Scrambling stats are influenced by appreciably by how 'good' or 'bad' are your misses. Number of putts per round may actually increase for awhile as you hit more GIRs.

That's how mine are a little out of whack right now. I've been sacrificing GIRs for proximity to pins. And the close proximity, though off the green slightly more often, allows for easy scrambling conversion and results in less putts.

 

[davis20]

I just think counting a lag putt on the green from 55ft. a putt but not one 3 inches on the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole is not a true representation of what you were doing. That "shot" 3 inches into the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole was almost certainly "read and executed" like a putt. Conversely that 55 footer would probably actually be played better by a lot of people if they chipped it from that distance. Of course no one would do that on a green.

I just have a hard time not counting a putt a putt. I understand what the rules are in counting stats I just disagree.

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[Jmk202]

Yup, you've got it right, as far as I understand it! Don't feel guilty about the stats. Overall with a large enough sample size you'll probably have enough bad breaks, tight pins with green sloping away and no green to work with, etc. that it will probably even out your scrambling numbers a bit. That's the thing about stats as a whole the are interesting and meaningful, but you zoom in too much you can get the wrong idea. Don't sweat it and enjoy it!

 

[leftshot]

I just think counting a lag putt on the green from 55ft. a putt but not one 3 inches on the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole is not a true representation of what you were doing. That "shot" 3 inches into the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole was almost certainly "read and executed" like a putt. Conversely that 55 footer would probably actually be played better by a lot of people if they chipped it from that distance. Of course no one would do that on a green.

I just have a hard time not counting a putt a putt. I understand what the rules are in counting stats I just disagree.

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There are lots of stats like that. It all gets down to what the stats are telling you. For example, using your scenario a mid handicapper would probably aim for the fat of the green and would likely end up with something like that 55 footer. A better iron player with good course management would in many cases aim for the pin even though it is tucked close to the fringe, especially on a back pin sloping toward you, knowing that a miss still likely puts them close to the hole. That 8 footer from the fringe or collar being a likely miss.

That's also why you hear many pros talk about some stats being important and real indicators of how you are playing and others being meaningless or not an indicator of how well you are playing.

 

[BigMac]

I just think counting a lag putt on the green from 55ft. a putt but not one 3 inches on the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole is not a true representation of what you were doing. That "shot" 3 inches into the fringe that's 8ft. from the hole was almost certainly "read and executed" like a putt. Conversely that 55 footer would probably actually be played better by a lot of people if they chipped it from that distance. Of course no one would do that on a green.

I just have a hard time not counting a putt a putt. I understand what the rules are in counting stats I just disagree.

The nice thing is, the "rules" for counting stats can be whatever you want to make them. It's not like keeping score where you're cheating if you don't record it correctly. I can completely understand why some would choose to keep them differently - as long as you do it that way consistently, the numbers will still be useful to you.

...That's also why you hear many pros talk about some stats being important and real indicators of how you are playing and others being meaningless or not an indicator of how well you are playing.

My putting stats are probably artificially low because I miss a lot of GIRs and end up chipping/"zero putting" onto the green, leaving me closer to the hole when the putts start counting. It doesn't necessarily mean I'm a great putter, it means I have a crappy approach game. I know this, but I stay consistent with how I keep them just so the stats six months from now will be relevant to the stats six months ago.

 

[leftshot]

The nice thing is, the "rules" for counting stats can be whatever you want to make them. It's not like keeping score where you're cheating if you don't record it correctly. I can completely understand why some would choose to keep them differently - as long as you do it that way consistently, the numbers will still be useful to you.




My putting stats are probably artificially low because I miss a lot of GIRs and end up chipping/"zero putting" onto the green, leaving me closer to the hole when the putts start counting. It doesn't necessarily mean I'm a great putter, it means I have a crappy approach game. I know this, but I stay consistent with how I keep them just so the stats six months from now will be relevant to the stats six months ago.

That's a good example and very common. While we don't have all the stats available to the pros on putting one that is commonly tracked is putts per GIR. It's still an amalgamation of how well you hit your approach shot and how well you putt, but it removes the effects from most chips, putts, or pitches from around the green.

 

[oumagic]

If it isn’t on the green, it doesn’t count as a putt for me regardless of the club I use. If I use a putter off the green, it isn’t a putt. If I use a 3w on the green, it is a putt.

 

[OldandStiff]

That's a good example and very common. While we don't have all the stats available to the pros on putting one that is commonly tracked is putts per GIR. It's still an amalgamation of how well you hit your approach shot and how well you putt, but it removes the effects from most chips, putts, or pitches from around the green.

Yep. That'll show it. I forgot that would be in my grint stats, so I just checked and my putts per GIR (1.67) the last 20 has actually been lower than it is now, barely. My putts on nonGIR (1.19) however is just stupid right now. Thanks. I really hadn't thought of comparing that, and it confirms my suspicions about my total putts.