We've launched the new forums! Read more here

I wonder if I'm just supposed to be using super improvement player irons?

SuperStroke
I do think lessons could be extremely beneficial and help your swing so you aren't fixing swing flaws with more flaws. However, to the original question, I wouldn't have any reservations about considering super game improvement irons. If they help, they help. I would think a store like Club Champion would certainly have options.
 
Not a fan of youtube for golf instructions but this explains it, you need to hold your angles later in the swing.
 
E4450FEE-5393-491E-AC00-01BBC7BE6E4E.jpegBAE721DA-3F63-44B5-9BF2-B99AF5C49617.jpeg
 
I mean I can see it there. I’m assuming that line should stay in the same spot relatively speaking. Clearly swaying left, or my right.
 
NEhomer said:
Yes, there are many possible thoughts but right now, for you only one of the 4 you listed are important. "Hands high at top of swing, Don't worry about how high your hands are, they're high enough to break 100. flick wrists at impact" Um, no, don't make any conscious effort to flick your wrists. Cripes, I hope your instructor isn't telling you that. "Rotate hips, Your hips will rotate, you can't keep them from rotating and they too are rotating enough to break 100. stop sway" Bingo...that's the one. You can't make consistent contact if you're not centered.

Stay centered/balanced and hit the ball first. Yeah, limit swing thoughts but dial in the most important one or two for you.

kiwicris suggested a great idea in adjusting ball position to start.
Click to expand...
V14_Heels said:
Alright this is a confusing one to explain my thoughts on, but I just want to be slightly better than a bogey golfer...17 handicap or so would thrill me! Right now i'm lucky if I break a 100. According to arccos i'm a 30 handicap.

I golfed a 104 yesterday and comparing it to a 17 handicap it's something like this:
Lost 7 strokes to driver
Lost 11 strokes to approach shots IN PARTICULAR 9 from 100-150 yards
Lost -0.7 shots on short game
Gained +2.5 on putting (averaged 1.8 putts and had 3 up and downs)

It's not hard to see where I struggle, and this is consistent across multiple games this season. So in comes my question. I have two clubs I love. My putter. And this dumb 37 degree chipper I got from Pinemeadow 2 years ago for like $40. Can't say I have any confidence with any other club in my bag. It's basically a 7 iron with a massive sole. I use it off the fringe, out of the rough, anywhere from 10 yards to 50 yards. https://www.pinemeadowgolf.com/golf-clubs/wedges/excel-egi-chipper.pfs

My question is should I be looking at some of these super game improvement irons that almost look like this 37 degree chipper? Would a club champion even fit those type of irons? I'm talking something like the Cobra T Rails or the Cleveland Turbo HB's? I have just cheap player improvement irons now that kind of mimic an old school ping (gigagolf p3 bros). I just don't understand how much you take away from your play when you go this super improvement route. My weakness is literally contact. I just struggle to make clean contact with any of my clubs on a full swing, and I'm wondering if equipment can't help me? I'm currently trialing a set of OL Cobras from globalgolf to try to improve consistency but...was curious if anybody like me has had success moving from the club they learned golf on, took lessons with and still moved to some of these super improvement player irons with the really fat soles?
Click to expand...
I was a 23 at the start of last season. Finished at an 18.

Couple things really helped me:

Slow motion swinging all winter, no ball. It taught me where my club bottoms out and taught me what my club face does on the downswing. It taught me I had to move my ball further back in my stance. It taught me I have to start with my club face slightly closed cuz my swing opens up my club face.

If I keep my lead arm straight, bad **** doesn't happen on the way down.

I learned how far I hit my clubs. It taught me that I had to learn how to layup. If I can't hit a shot 8 out of ten times, layup.

The wall drill. Butt against wall, no club, arms crossed. Practice taking a back swing and downswing, while not let your ass bounce up or down or forward or back.

Its a stupid hard activity. and bouncing up and down while trying to get that club face back to the ball ain't helping.
 
Get a lesson and see what’s really going on. Don’t buy anything without being fit. If all else fails pay for a fitting and buy those specs used. It makes a huge difference.
 
? How hard are swinging? Used to watch a lot of Golf Channel how to golf and I think it was Jason Gore that said only swing as hard as you can hit the ball straight. I am a firm believer that when you quit trying to hit the ball hard you play better golf, reason is that you make better contact. I do a lot of swaying at times so understand the chunky shots,
 
Man do I understand the swaying thing. Late 2019 I really struggled with moving my head up and down as much as eight inches and getting off center bad. I got large a mirror and went to work in my hitting bay keeping my body more stationary while better developing my swing.

Swaying and up and down movement is not a bad thing if you can still hit the ball square, but most of us cannot do that unless we are one of those extremely talented individuals that can hit a golf ball in most any position. For most of us excessive body movement changes the bottom of the swing arc and of course that changes where the club strikes the ball.

My buddy struggles with one small body movement that causes him issues. He falls back slightly on his right foot. When he maintains pressure on his left foot through the swing he hits some great shots. The second his pressure moves to his right foot no telling what will happen on his strikes.
 
V14_Heels said:
View attachment 8995713View attachment 8995714
Click to expand...
Watched your vids several times and please take this with a grain of salt as they say. Sometimes it is hard to tell what is going on in the vids without seeing in person swing. A couple things come to mind, one is your club position and second is the bottom of your arc. This could be caused by a number of things. For some people it is grip, body movement, being armsy, etc, that tends to cause other issues. When I get fatigued on the course I can get armsy and my game will suffer because of it.

It appears from the vid that your swing becomes "armsy" at some point on the down swing (hard to tell where though as I could not do a frame by frame of it) putting your arc bottom behind the ball and the top part of the club shaft is almost straight up or even slightly behind at impact.

In other words, your actual swing does not come back to where your setup position is. I remember one guy saying, the club needs to be the same at impact/address as it was at setup, that is if your setup position is correct.

IMO your left hand needs to lead through the ball toward the target getting your club angle better and your arc slightly in front of the ball toward the target. It will take some work but you can do it easily enough.
 
I started golf almost 10 years ago in 2012 (early 30s) but since I went the completely opposite route of what you’re considering I’ll offer a different viewpoint of what worked for me:
1- lessons (I had 3 months of weekly group lessons both on my first year and second years)
2- complete disregard for equipment (I got 2nd hand player irons, mizuno mp67 regular steel. I had no idea about golf nor clubs, these irons were cheap and I got them for the simple reason that they seemed easier to clean - you can easily tell how newbie I was. Interestingly, I stuck with them until 1-2 years ago)
3- plenty of unsupervised practice but I never got very often out on the course (maybe 5 times a year? Far from ideal but I don’t often have the time to play a round of golf. I still tried to get on the range every week or so).
4- I watched a lot of instruction videos (I learned the flop shot in my living room watching Mickelson’s short game secrets, whilst trying to flop a rubber ball from the carpet onto the tabletop)
5- I always accepted it would be a rather long journey with a lot of work along the way and no quick fixes
6- whenever golf stopped being fun I would give it a break

Last sunday I shot -1 on a 9 hole short par3 course (each hole is 100-120 yds). I had 4 birdies and a triple bogey, I missed 3 greens which is not bad considering how windy it was.

TLDR; everyone will have their opinion but I think that the people who are telling you to forget about getting new clubs are right.
 
V14_Heels said:
For reference I'm headed in to my 13th lesson next week. I've had lessons, I feel good about knowing what I SHOULD be doing. But it's alot, and for whatever reason I just can't seem to execute the steps I've been given consistently when it comes to irons in particular. It's frustrating obviously. I do think some of it is I just need to swing and not THINK so much, but I do wonder if a more forgiving iron would help.

As a low handicap...do you all think about your swing at all when you step up to a ball? I'd love to hear what like a 17 handicapper thinks about at address. I've always heard only go to the ball with 2-3 thoughts cause it's all your mind can handle. But my 2-3 thoughts change 50 times throughout a round. "Hands high at top of swing, flick wrists at impact" "Rotate hips, stop sway" "F everything...just think about HITTING the ball" "hmm ok that didn't work um how about we think about keeping my head down, left arm straight." "Crap...ok lets really think about rotating that hip out before downswing this time." Like...that's how my mind goes lol..
Click to expand...
Mine is relax! and swing at 85% effort.
 
V14_Heels said:
...As a low handicap...do you all think about your swing at all when you step up to a ball? I'd love to hear what like a 17 handicapper thinks about at address. I've always heard only go to the ball with 2-3 thoughts cause it's all your mind can handle. But my 2-3 thoughts change 50 times throughout a round. "Hands high at top of swing, flick wrists at impact" "Rotate hips, stop sway" "F everything...just think about HITTING the ball" "hmm ok that didn't work um how about we think about keeping my head down, left arm straight." "Crap...ok lets really think about rotating that hip out before downswing this time." Like...that's how my mind goes lol..
Click to expand...
I try to think about as little as possible, but usually fail miserably at it. I'm a notorious overthinker when standing over a shot and the more I do it, the worse it is. I try to have one swing thought - lately it's been "tempo", because when I'm swinging with a nice smooth tempo things work well. Sometimes I try to get everything else out of my head and my swing thought is "Just hit the ball, dumba**!"
 
@V14_Heels There have been a lot of good suggestions on equipment and lessons. I can't really add to those. But as someone who only wanted a modest bogey level game and who still continues to struggle after many years, I would caution you not to measure your rate of improvement against others or against where you think you should be.

You will improve. That's almost a certainty - even if it's not obvious to you. And you will likely get below bogey golf. You will naturally start finding the center of the face more often and reduce the amount and frequency of fat and thin shots. You'll learn what a flip is, how to avoid it and how to recognize it when it returns. You'll understand what a centered turn is and why it allows other good things to happen throughout the downswing and into impact. You'll develop lag because of the other things you're doing more correctly. You'll develop the tempo that suits your swing.

You won't do any of these things perfectly, but you'll do them a bit better than you are doing them now.

The thing is, you may or may not get there as quickly as others and certainly not as quickly as you'd like. If I could go back to when I first started, I think I'd try to learn to enjoy the crappy golf just a bit more. Instead, I was hellbent from day one on getting better sooner until it became an obsession. It's ok to be driven to improve, but you've got to remember this game can be really tough.
 
Guys. I was able to get a last minute iron fitting with Club Champion today. I'm just gonna try the Super Player Improvement. I want to try a heavier graphite shaft like a recoil 95. Heck I might even get wild and try a players iron just to see what it feels like. Hopefully I'll get some sense of if my current irons are good enough or not out of this.
 
V14_Heels said:
Guys. I was able to get a last minute iron fitting with Club Champion today. I'm just gonna try the Super Player Improvement. I want to try a heavier graphite shaft like a recoil 95. Heck I might even get wild and try a players iron just to see what it feels like. Hopefully I'll get some sense of if my current irons are good enough or not out of this.
Click to expand...
You need to start a thread and tell us how us how it goes! :cool:
 
Luchnia said:
You need to start a thread and tell us how us how it goes! :cool:
Click to expand...
Will do. I'm definitely excited about it. I want to understand the numbers. I definitely don't have a super consistent swing, so it makes me a little nervous, but from everything I read high handicappers can benefit from a fitter just as much as good golfers, so I'm not gonna wait any longer. I'd rather spend the $150 and see what happens.
 
V14_Heels said:
Will do. I'm definitely excited about it. I want to understand the numbers. I definitely don't have a super consistent swing, so it makes me a little nervous, but from everything I read high handicappers can benefit from a fitter just as much as good golfers, so I'm not gonna wait any longer. I'd rather spend the $150 and see what happens.
Click to expand...
I got fitted for my irons at CC and it was great! They are very helpful and don't forget if you want the data you will need to ask them to send it to you. I did not buy my clubs there but did get my fitting there.
 
Luchnia said:
I got fitted for my irons at CC and it was great! They are very helpful and don't forget if you want the data you will need to ask them to send it to you. I did not buy my clubs there but did get my fitting there.
Click to expand...

You're keeping us all in suspense.... what did they fit you into??? :p
 
NeverWiff said:
You're keeping us all in suspense.... what did they fit you into??? :p
Click to expand...
I got fit for irons in February of last year and the iron I hit the best was the Callaway Mavrik MAX and I am still playing them after the entire year. They just seem to work well for me and have a comfort feel. The PW and GW are money for my old bones LOL

I am extremely intrigued by the Cobra OL Radspeed and do plan to try them out. I was at a pro shop yesterday and messed around with the 5, 7, and 9. I did not hit them, just looked them over good. Of course I walked out with a new Radspeed driver with a Motore F3. I already play a Cobra SpeedZone driver so that was only an upgrade.

As far as my irons, it would have to be some type of eye opener before I would use anything else. The strange thing is the shafts in my irons are only 50G KBS shafts, but every time I try a different shaft I don't have the consistency or the feel and most of them feel like a board.
 
Appointment is at 4:30 haha. We're not quite there yet! ALMOST TIME. They're gonna have a curveball though cause I legit have two sets of irons now. I have my old gigagolf ping g30 knock offs but i have the 14 day trial cobra speedzone OL's too. So I'm curious to see how they handle this.
 
Well...

I gained about 25 yards and 20 ft of height with a NON super improvement iron. Tried several, and I couldn't hit the super gamers all that well. The Callaway B21 was the best of the super gamers but definitely not best overall.

The Aerotech i95 steel fiber shaft was the best by a large margin and it felt really good to me also. The Mizuno JPX-921 Hot Metal Pro is what came out best but the Cobra Radspeeds were also real close.

I got do some studying now though to see what other graphite shafts might align closely with those aerotechs in terms of specs. I just can't justify 2100 on irons lol.
 
V14_Heels said:
Well...

I gained about 25 yards and 20 ft of height with a NON super improvement iron. Tried several, and I couldn't hit the super gamers all that well. The Callaway B21 was the best of the super gamers but definitely not best overall.

The Aerotech i95 steel fiber shaft was the best by a large margin and it felt really good to me also. The Mizuno JPX-921 Hot Metal Pro is what came out best but the Cobra Radspeeds were also real close.

I got do some studying now though to see what other graphite shafts might align closely with those aerotechs in terms of specs. I just can't justify 2100 on irons lol.
Click to expand...
Glad it was an informative fitting.... but what in the wide world of sports ran the tab for irons to 2100 ???
 
Welcome to club champion...the whole process was just ok for me. I don't know that I'm all in on the you need much more than the Golf Galaxy fitting to figure some of this out with a little research, but I learned a little bit. It's just alot for what it's worth and I'm not quite sure they are purely unbiased. I think the fact that they actually sell the clubs makes it a little more biased in what they're handing you and comboing up.

$125 a club head
$85 a shaft
$10 a grip
$150 for the fitting
Some tax

That's $1,750 right there. If you wanna add a SW that's another 225ish. Then they offer you some puring of the shaft which sounds like hocus pocus to me, so you can eliminate that 240 bucks but it definitely racks up.
 
Last edited:
V14_Heels said:
Welcome to club champion...the whole process was just ok for me. I don't know that I'm all in on the you need much more than the Golf Galaxy fitting to figure some of this out with a little research, but I learned a little bit. It's just alot for what it's worth and I'm not quite sure they are purely unbiased. I think the fact that they actually sell the clubs makes it a little more biased in what they're handing you and comboing up.

$125 a club head
$85 a shaft
$10 a grip
$150 for the fitting
Some tax

That's $1,750 right there. If you wanna add a SW that's another 225ish. Then they offer you some puring of the shaft which sounds like hocus pocus to me, so you can eliminate that 240 bucks but it definitely racks up.
Click to expand...

It seems most people do not buy their clubs. Maybe, that is why they overcharge on their fitting time? In my opinion, narrow down a brand and go to their demo day and make a logical choice based on hitting balls at a driving range, not a sim.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top