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Newer Isn't Always Better

Sean

Sean

Earthbound Extraterrestrial
Albatross 2024 Club
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I was reading Global Golf Post this morning and they mentioned that Daniel Berger is playing irons that are 10 years old (TM MC Forged). He won his first tournament with them back in 2016, and after he recently left Callaway, he has won two more times with them since June. He has had them since high school, and is currently looking for another set via Instagram...asking anyone if they want to sell their's, or looking on eBay. I know we get excited every year when the new equipment comes out, but that doesn't mean just because it is new it is better than what you currently have.

This is what they look like:

iu.jpeg
 
I think all YouTubers have an agenda but this test seems fair on the surface.

 
Good post.

The truth of the matter is we don't need the new stuff, but most of us like it. I know a guy that has an old putter and I have never seen a putter worn in such a way. It is convex and looks like someone took a hammer to it and beat it out like a spoon. It is so bad you would throw it in the junk bin.

Here is the thing, he is a really good local golfer and a really good putter and I imagine you would have to pry it from his cold dead arms. He is always at the top part of the list in the local club. I also know some other good golfers and most of them have clubs that are around 10 years old.

I have some older clubs in my shop that I occasionally will hit just for fun and I really don't hit them much different than the news one I bought last year, but I like others do like some new stuff glistening in the sunlight every now and then. :cool:
 
Luchnia said:
Good post.

The truth of the matter is we don't need the new stuff, but most of us like it. I know a guy that has an old putter and I have never seen a putter worn in such a way. It is convex and looks like someone took a hammer to it and beat it out like a spoon. It is so bad you would throw it in the junk bin.

Here is the thing, he is a really good local golfer and a really good putter and I imagine you would have to pry it from his cold dead arms. He is always at the top part of the list in the local club. I also know some other good golfers and most of them have clubs that are around 10 years old.

I have some older clubs in my shop that I occasionally will hit just for fun and I really don't hit them much different than the news one I bought last year, but I like others do like some new stuff glistening in the sunlight every now and then. :cool:
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Yeah, I think a lot of it has to do with we simply like new stuff, another part is that golfer who thinks he can buy a better game, which usually doesn't work out to his satisfaction. I know a couple of guys who go through three sets of irons a year.

A guy I regularly play golf with is 80 years old. He uses his father's putter, which his father bought in 1945, lol.
 
echico said:
I think all YouTubers have an agenda but this test seems fair on the surface.

Click to expand...

I thought this was interesting. The older models were as good in most tests. I think the one variable might be that Peter Finch is a solid ball striker, so most of these comparisons are on good center strikes. I think the supposed benefit (and the companies marketed the clubs as such), is the newer models are more forgiving across the face. But overall I though this video was a good one.

In regards to irons, not much has changed for the "good ball striker irons", but the hollowed bodied players distance irons have brought more launch and more forgiveness to a smaller profile iron category.
 
Man I almost bought those irons a couple times back when they were new. They were really great
 
Tywithay said:
There has been no major advancement to the middle of the face. The center has been at the limit for years. Peter Finch and Daniel Berger aren't exploring the same real estate as I am.
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I have a friend who plays on the LPGA Tour, she is sponsored by PXG and plays the 0211 ST's. Looking at her irons there is just a tiny brown spot right on the sweet spot.

I would be curious to see those driver results if he had a mid-handicap index hit those clubs.
 
Much shorter time scale, but this is what I found with my Mizuno mp-18 mmc irons. A cavity back players irons is a cavity back players iron. It took me over a year trying every option available to find something I thought was worth buying and playing. And the differences are minor in a performance sense. Distance, ball flight, spin are very similar. I like the look, and the feel is a touch better. But that's it. And 3 years from now when I am looking again, I will likely have the same experience if that is still the type of club I want to play. At least that's what I expect will happen.
 
Sean said:
I have a friend who plays on the LPGA Tour, she is sponsored by PXG and plays the 0211 ST's. Looking at her irons there is just a tiny brown spot right on the sweet spot.

I would be curious to see those driver results if he had a mid-handicap index hit those clubs.
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I paid for the whole face. I'm going to hit all over it.
 
Tywithay said:
There has been no major advancement to the middle of the face. The center has been at the limit for years. Peter Finch and Daniel Berger aren't exploring the same real estate as I am.
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Bingo. Too many get hung up on middle of the face, that’s not real golf, contrary to the internet most amateurs miss, a lot, and there have been dramatic gains in forgiveness, stability, and spin retention in a decade.
 
Those TaylorMade TP MC irons are my favorite of all time!!!! I still regret trading those in
 
jfrigo1003 said:
Those TaylorMade TP MC irons are my favorite of all time!!!! I still regret trading those in
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I know a few people who played them and all had positive things to say about them. You would probably have trouble finding a set as Berger seems to be scouring the internet for them, lol.
 
I think the modern drivers have improved a lot in the last decade but maybe not so much in the last 5 years. IMO the added forgiveness in the recent years helps higher handicappers even more than low index players who are striking the ball close enough to the sweet spot that they may not see much or any improvement from a 5-year-old driver. I have a Mavrik that I put in play for a couple of months, and it was slightly longer on a pure drive, but it has a left tendency for me that made it easy to switch back to my Epic SZ.

Fittings and shafts have improved immensely and that along with the recent driver head improvements/options make it easy to get your optimal launch and spin. I'm positive there is a combo out there that can give me another 5 yards and/or equal or better dispersion, so I'll be buying at least one new driver this year. :)

As far as irons go, there are a lot of models from 5-10 years ago that I could put in my bag without them changing my index.
 
tahoebum said:
I think the modern drivers have improved a lot in the last decade but maybe not so much in the last 5 years. IMO the added forgiveness in the recent years helps higher handicappers even more than low index players who are striking the ball close enough to the sweet spot that they may not see much or any improvement from a 5-year-old driver. I have a Mavrik that I put in play for a couple of months, and it was slightly longer on a pure drive, but it has a left tendency for me that made it easy to switch back to my Epic SZ.

Fittings and shafts have improved immensely and that along with the recent driver head improvements/options make it easy to get your optimal launch and spin. I'm positive there is a combo out there that can give me another 5 yards and/or equal or better dispersion, so I'll be buying at least one new driver this year. :)

As far as irons go, there are a lot of models from 5-10 years ago that I could put in my bag without them changing my index.
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I agree with that. For me to change clubs the new clubs would have to have a real WOW! factor.
 
Sean said:
I know a few people who played them and all had positive things to say about them. You would probably have trouble finding a set as Berger seems to be scouring the internet for them, lol.
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hahaha I know... ive been looking!
 
I like the cavity design besides the screw in the middle.

But hey, I like his story about em!
 
I had the CB version of that set, loved those irons!
 
Yeah, I'm one of those people who believes that newer equipment is not always better. Maybe if the golfer is up grading from something, rusted with Sam Snead's name on it.

I tried saving strokes with an upgrade 15 years ago. I was replacing irons that were 10 years old. I shot the same scores with both sets. Even today, I still shoot the same scores with both of those sets. Same with my metals.

I expect to shoot the same scores with my next new set of irons.
 
I have been known to rage at the screen when youtube reviewers state how, after hitting 5 balls, the new stuff is no better than the old stuff. Especially when they look at the pure data averages and don't factor in swing speed and ball strike location on the face. Its like going to a restaurant to review it and because the plates are the same declaring the new menu isn't any better than the old menu. Well, when you don't try out the stuff that changed, its easy to jump to conclusions.
 
I think the irons just fit him extremely well. There are better irons with all the great improvements. Berger is a young pro. He doesn't need those improvements.

I do.
 
Sean said:
I would be curious to see those driver results if he had a mid-handicap index hit those clubs.
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That’s what no one ever seems to test when they do these comparison videos
 
IceyShanks said:
I had the CB version of that set, loved those irons!
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I don't know exactly what my irons are, except being a knock-off of one-or-another version of TM CB irons, nor how old they are. Being as, save the 4i, I hit 'em pretty well, it's going to take quite a bit more than "Ohhhh! Shiny!" appeal to kick them out of my bag.
 
Sean said:
I was reading Global Golf Post this morning and they mentioned that Daniel Berger is playing irons that are 10 years old (TM MC Forged). He won his first tournament with them back in 2016, and after he recently left Callaway, he has won two more times with them since June. He has had them since high school, and is currently looking for another set via Instagram...asking anyone if they want to sell their's, or looking on eBay. I know we get excited every year when the new equipment comes out, but that doesn't mean just because it is new it is better than what you currently have.

This is what they look like:

View attachment 8994572
Click to expand...


There was a statement I read about Karsten Solheim. It was something like: "I want to make a set of irons you can play for life", his grandson wants to make a set you can play for a year."


I paraphrase but that's kind of the idea.


The golf club industry has become an utter racket, only concerned about more new product, and more new product, and more new product...and making money for their investors. I get it, but I don't agree with it - I think it smacks of brutal greed.



What I will say is this: definitely a lot of innovation has come over the years by these companies pushing out new product(s) every year, of that I can't disagree. So it hasn't all been bad.

Plus If I want a $600 driver for $50, all I have to do is wait a year a two after it came out and I am good to go. ;)


Personally I found the greatest irons ever made. And they were produced about 20 years ago. My MacGregor 1025C V-Foil forged. They are purely flawless in every way, for me at least. And pretty as heck to look at.
 
Northerner said:
The golf club industry has become an utter racket, only concerned about more new product, and more new product, and more new product...and making money for their investors. I get it, but I don't agree with it - I think it smacks of brutal greed.
Click to expand...

smacks of greed? should car companies stop making cars every year? or tech companies stop making new computers or cell phones or smart watches or flat screen tvs?

no one is forcing you to upgrade your car every year, or even saying you should.
no one is forcing you to buy a new cell phone every year, or even saying you should.
no one is forcing you to buy new clubs every year, or even saying you should.

there's a pattern here...
 
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