The conversations I had with Ping were that they HAD to do it that way or they would have run out product entirely and had major setbacks. They had limited product available when it was time to do the standard release here in the US. If they would have released the product here, they would have run out extremely fast and wouldn't have been able to catch back up. Releasing the line in Australia and Southeast Asia gave Ping a buffer period to create more product while operating at limited capacity. It wasn't ideal but it was the best choice for Ping by a long shot.

They are still suffering major set backs even with the delayed us release.. they are really struggling.. custom orders of current product is like 8 weeks back ordered.
 
Ping has always been a steady eddy in equipment. Good stuff very comparable and appealed to a wide audience. The G400 LST was a great driver and I think was the pinnacle of ping offerings.

The G425 series has been a bit of a mess since the beginning. Not all of it pings fault. Covid happened and they made the decision to push it out. That turned out to be from what I can tell a bad decision. Then ping could not keep up and that they were weeks and even months behind on order fulfillment.

then just this week they had two containers full of driver head fall off a container ship and sink to the bottom of the pacific. I heard 10k heads.. that’s crazy bad luck..

On top of all that, the product in my opinion is very underwhelming. The head has maybe the highest MOI rating ever. Something just over a 10 thousand rating. So it is extremely stable and looks pretty good but other than that I am not that impressed..

Ping didn't decide to bring out the product, they switched release regions so they could release at a later date in North America. Every company was weeks/months behind on orders. TaylorMade was almost 3 months behind on their new iron release after about two weeks. Full shutdowns and forced half capacity staff made it very difficult to keep up. I had a client last October that we fit into a TM SIM 3 wood, he was ordering through his Golf Club Membership and was told it would be March of 2022, literally March of 2022. So we were forced to find it at a local golf shop.
 
I don't want to speak for THP, but I would find it extremely difficult to believe that THP and any of their staff would be going out their way to ensure Ping product gets a bad wrap or little marketing.
I would have to agree. As a recent Ping convert, (everything of theirs I have tried in the last 12 months, driver, hybrid and wedges, have outperformed anything I’ve had in the past from other manufacturers, by a noticeable margin too), I’m a little surprised Ping don’t get more love on here. That’s down to posters though. If a Ping thread is started, and it only gets 2 or 3 pages of response, as opposed to the 100’s of pages we see for other manufacturers, I think that’s a little unfair to knock the site. I think Ping is just one of those brands that have a smaller hardcore following. Those that know, know LOL.
 
They are still suffering major set backs even with the delayed us release.. they are really struggling.. custom orders of current product is like 8 weeks back ordered.

There are a lot of companies set back on product. Some of those setbacks are not Pings fault, like shaft companies not having product. Cobra is out of certain Modus shafts until March.
 
Ping didn't decide to bring out the product, they switched release regions so they could release at a later date in North America. Every company was weeks/months behind on orders. TaylorMade was almost 3 months behind on their new iron release after about two weeks. Full shutdowns and forced half capacity staff made it very difficult to keep up. I had a client last October that we fit into a TM SIM 3 wood, he was ordering through his Golf Club Membership and was told it would be March of 2022, literally March of 2022. So we were forced to find it at a local golf shop.

sure mid summer everyone was behind. Golf was booming and covid was slowing things down.

But ping was by far the worst and it was not even close.

The best was mizuno followed closely by callaway.
 
There are a lot of companies set back on product. Some of those setbacks are not Pings fault, like shaft companies not having product. Cobra is out of certain Modus shafts until March.

Of course. I am not saying it is all their fault. But none the less they were struggling more than everyone else from what I have seen. It got so bad that we had zero ping product for 2 and half months!! No demos, stock sets, nothing.. people would ask and we had to say we can’t get it. That sucks!!!
 
On top of all that, the product in my opinion is very underwhelming. The head has maybe the highest MOI rating ever. Something just over a 10 thousand rating. So it is extremely stable and looks pretty good but other than that I am not that impressed..

The G425 line is good, it just isn't a big jump like we saw going into the G400 line and then the G410 lineup (G400LST to G410LST was a smaller jump). From my testing so far, the SIM and SIM2 aren't going to be that big of a jump either. I'll see more of my SIM players stay with the SIM rather than move into the SIM2. It's really tough to have every product each year be "great". Not one OEM has done that to date.

The G425 line is one that needs to be dialed in to get it to open up and show performance. I went from the G410 LST with a Diamana TB 60TX and threw that shaft in the G425 LST assuming it translate over. It did not. I had to change shaft profiles in a fairly drastic way to get the club to open up. It isn't as plug and play as it has been in the past.

I will say that the G425 probably won't win in ball speed contests, but that category doesn't hold much weight for me if other variables aren't kept in line. We will see how the year goes for Ping, but I have already had some good success with the 425 lineup.

Not to mention the fairway woods are miles better than last years, in my opinion.
 
sure mid summer everyone was behind. Golf was booming and covid was slowing things down.

But ping was by far the worst and it was not even close.

The best was mizuno followed closely by callaway.

Callaway is March now on their X Forged UT. Mizuno now is still a few weeks on certain orders. Mizuno and other "smaller" OEMs got by without having to do many cutbacks on staffing. I believe Ping had to shutdown the longest out of all the OEMs, but I can not back that up factually.
 
The G425 line is good, it just isn't a big jump like we saw going into the G400 line and then the G410 lineup (G400LST to G410LST was a smaller jump). From my testing so far, the SIM and SIM2 aren't going to be that big of a jump either. I'll see more of my SIM players stay with the SIM rather than move into the SIM2. It's really tough to have every product each year be "great". Not one OEM has done that to date.

The G425 line is one that needs to be dialed in to get it to open up and show performance. I went from the G410 LST with a Diamana TB 60TX and threw that shaft in the G425 LST assuming it translate over. It did not. I had to change shaft profiles in a fairly drastic way to get the club to open up. It isn't as plug and play as it has been in the past.

I will say that the G425 probably won't win in ball speed contests, but that category doesn't hold much weight for me if other variables aren't kept in line. We will see how the year goes for Ping, but I have already had some good success with the 425 lineup.

Not to mention the fairway woods are miles better than last years, in my opinion.

this could be.. I currently feel they took a step back with this one. But, I have not had a ton of time with it yet. They Fairway’s look way better for sure. Losing the turbulators was smart.

the SIM2 while not a step back is a smaller step forward for sure. Agreed there. So far the biggest leap forwards far I have seen was by Titleist and they TSi line..
 
this could be.. I currently feel they took a step back with this one. But, I have not had a ton of time with it yet. They Fairway’s look way better for sure. Losing the turbulators was smart.

the SIM2 while not a step back is a smaller step forward for sure. Agreed there. So far the biggest leap forwards far I have seen was by Titleist and they TSi line..
But a step back in which way? Is it slower than the 410?
 
But a step back in which way? Is it slower than the 410?
So far from what I have seen. Much slower. When everyone is getting heads that are both fast and stable. Slow is bad.
 
My answer is no, it is not slower than the G410. It requires more work than the G410 did to get dialed though.
For many many a golfer that is bad thing. When every other driver can be much more easily plug and play..

plus it does not sound good.
 
For many many a golfer that is bad thing. When every other driver can be much more easily plug and play..

Every other driver is not easily plug and play. Rather Pings have just been so easy in the past, it creates an outlier with G425 needing some extra work. G410 was very easy to work with last year. SIM was not easy and required some in depth dialing in to get it work well. SpeedZone Extreme was pretty plug and play. SpeedZone required a little work to dial in. Mavrik was really hard for the guy who wanted more spin without draw bias.

My point in all of that is every club truly requires "work" to dial in, but Ping has been such an easy club for golfers to get to work for them. I will not argue that G425 seems a bit different (good or bad) than the previous two generations.
 
Some hot sports opinions based on my impressions over the years.

I like Ping drivers, but I think other companies are ahead in tech. Yes, sometimes Ping will surprise by going less conservative, and I can't put my finger on it, but they seem cautious. They are less conservative than they once were but if I want to see the latest in tech, I will look at Callaway and AI and Cobra, or for a company more forward with face material and consistent ball speed, Tour Edge and Exotics.

Ping seemed slow in manufacturing thinner steel faces. And the squarish/flat sole of their fwy and hybrids, just lacked appeal to me - I had no idea why they designed the sole in that manner other than forgiveness.

Since then, they've gone better material and thinner faces. With the 425, at least they've got a face cup type of tech. They are far behind Tour Edge and Callaway in that regard.

Love their irons and wedges for durability and some innovation.

If you want durability, Ping is great. I've play the G400 Max driver for over 3 yrs now and don't know if I will change - it seems that good.

I agree with Ping not being the leaders in "tech" but I think that is where they want to be. No one really reads Ping tech and rolls their eyes or laughs at their marketing, but all of us have done it with Callaway and more predominantly with TM.
 
Every other driver is not easily plug and play. Rather Pings have just been so easy in the past, it creates an outlier with G425 needing some extra work. G410 was very easy to work with last year. SIM was not easy and required some in depth dialing in to get it work well. SpeedZone Extreme was pretty plug and play. SpeedZone required a little work to dial in. Mavrik was really hard for the guy who wanted more spin without draw bias.

My point in all of that is every club truly requires "work" to dial in, but Ping has been such an easy club for golfers to get to work for them. I will not argue that G425 seems a bit different (good or bad) than the previous two generations.
Do you think because of the head weight that’s where it’s requiring some fine tuning to get optimal numbers? I’m guessing throwing in a certain shaft a player has used before might not work and a counter balanced shaft would need to be considered to help unlock the potential.
 
Do you think because of the head weight that’s where it’s requiring some fine tuning to get optimal numbers? I’m guessing throwing in a certain shaft a player has used before might not work and a counter balanced shaft would need to be considered to help unlock the potential.

Ping heads have always been heavier than most others. That’s why their stock offerings are majority CB. However, with the G425, I’ve done more with shafts they aren’t CB than I did with the G410. I also play with the weight in the back of the driver to really dial in swingweight and feel that we are looking for.
 
Ping drivers are heavy by usually 10 grams over the others. Heavy hammer to drive the nail. Release cycle is bad but can’t be helped. The lack of an i series iron while all the other companies release products such as Forged, Apex, King Tour, ZX5/7, have all of our interest peaked. I won an event ticket and haven’t fully decided but I deep down know I’ll buy the i210 replacement if it’s close to the same. The wedges are greatly under rated to go with all of their products.
 
So far from what I have seen. Much slower. When everyone is getting heads that are both fast and stable. Slow is bad.
My answer is no, it is not slower than the G410. It requires more work than the G410 did to get dialed though.
For many many a golfer that is bad thing. When every other driver can be much more easily plug and play..

plus it does not sound good.

I've hit them side-by-side a couple times now, and found the G425 LST to have higher ball speeds than G410 LST at the same lofts. Even the G425 Max was getting higher ball speeds for me, but I had the 9* head turned down in loft (small -) which may have played a role. The bigger difference for me was spin, where I found both G425 heads consistently spinning a few hundred RPMs less than the old G410 head. The range of spin on the G410 was also higher, so I would see a nice low spin ball followed by mid 3k spin on a slight mishit, which killed distance.

As for the sound, I won't argue that haha. Sounds like a frying pan. The new LST is "better" than the Max though.

I think I'm still going to make the switch to the G425 head in the next couple of weeks because that forgiveness combined with good-enough performance is the way to go for tournament play. SIM can still hit the ball miles, but misses are much more punishing.
 
However I get over it very quickly and realize there is a ton of good stuff out there and the reviews are people's opinions and they should have their own opinions.
Shoot, I was hoping that this was the part that stood out the most. I missed the mark on that, as my intent was - my bias towards my favorite brand wants everything to be about Ping and have yearly events were other THPers get all new Ping setups 😂.

I also didn't want to create a feeling that I think THP is biased in their stuff. I enjoy reading all the Ping reviews and in the 5 years on the site I've never seen them not review a release. Heck @Jman G410 hybrid excitement got me to put the hybrid in the bag even though I had just got the G400 hybrid.

Back to the G425 discussion, I can't seem to find a concrete answer as to why the turbulators were taken off the fairway models as they do a great job framing the ball. Was it because a lot of people hated them and at the smaller heads they didn't really help create faster club head speed?
And the staff that has hit the fairway clubs, did you find the Spinsistency claim to be true?

-TJ
 
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Back to the G425 discussion, I can't seem to find a concrete answer as to why the turbulators were taken off the fairway models as they do a great job framing the ball. Was it because a lot of people hated them and at the smaller heads they didn't really help create faster club head speed?
And the staff that has hit the fairway clubs, did you find the Spinsistency claim to be true?

-TJ

They took them off to do face wrap. They take their maraging steel face and wrap it over the crown and under the sole to increase flex and give it better ball speeds across the face. They also have a roll at the bottom of the club that they are calling "spinsistency" that gives better ball speeds/spin/launch on low strikes.

Screen Shot 2021-01-23 at 5.29.32 PM.png
 
Ah yes that makes sense. With the face wrap there's no way to keep the turbs
 
They took them off to do face wrap. They take their maraging steel face and wrap it over the crown and under the sole to increase flex and give it better ball speeds across the face. They also have a roll at the bottom of the club that they are calling "spinsistency" that gives better ball speeds/spin/launch on low strikes.

View attachment 8990023

its all about spincistency
 
I can't speak to that event as somehow I missed that even though I'm a pretty engaged member for 10+ years now.
If it doesn't really hit the equipment pages I tend to miss it.

I think where Ping gets lost on here is with events like the Grandaddy, Morgan Cup and TEEm Tour Edge. Those events/contents provide many members with full bags or at least several clubs to very engaged members that post long term reviews. This keeps their threads at the forefront of the site and keeps the dialogue going. I am not saying this is a negative as I was part of TEEm Tour Edge in 2020. It's a great thing for the oems like Cobra, Callaway and Tour Edge amongst others who participate. But Ping in my opinion loses out on forum engagement because they are not as involved with the club seeding per se.

As for your comment on them getting caught by alot of brands that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. I do agree that Ping who and is still known for very stable drivers are getting caught by other oems in that area. I have played the Flash for two seasons now and still shake my head at how good of results I get with off center strikes.

I haven't fit into Ping clubs very well lately with my crazy swing so I can't really give any of my own feedback. I just have to go on what I see and read online, how it fares on the Tour etc., and it seems Ping is still in the mix with the best of the oem's. Heck a couple weeks back I believe every winner on the Tours that weekend (Champion's, PGA and LPGA) all had i210 irons in the bag.
I like Ping - one of my dumbest moves was taking the i25s out of the bag. But I’ve felt for a while now they aren’t really trying to stay relevant from a technology and innovation perspective. Sure, they still produce very good gear. But for example, is there any other major OEM that doesn’t use a carbon fiber crown on at least one driver? That’s a lost opportunity for weight movement, which means more forgiveness is being left on the table. At some point those things have to catch up to them.
 
I like Ping - one of my dumbest moves was taking the i25s out of the bag. But I’ve felt for a while now they aren’t really trying to stay relevant from a technology and innovation perspective. Sure, they still produce very good gear. But for example, is there any other major OEM that doesn’t use a carbon fiber crown on at least one driver? That’s a lost opportunity for weight movement, which means more forgiveness is being left on the table. At some point those things have to catch up to them.
I can't answer for Ping on the carbon crown but they had carbon on the original Rapture driver. Maybe they tried it and saw something they didn't like and decided not to go down that road again.
 
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