The 60 and over Thread

For many, it is possible but not wise to hit driver, as it is quite possible to go over or through the trees, for a very difficult recovery shot back through those trees.
As a slow swinger my 22* 4 iron is perfect for holes like that.

A good example that getting it as close to the hole as possible isn't always a wise strategy.
 
Moving up is not going to be a panacea for all that ails you. However, it should leave you being able to hit shorter clubs for your approaches, which, theoretically, may be easier to hit or at least have tighter dispersion. That should eventually result in lower scores and more fun.
You would think that’d be the case. I’m not arguing against others doing this to get more enjoyment. If I did this all the time, my average score would drop a little. Enjoyment... probably not. And it would eventually catch up to me as I get older.

My average score in 2023 was under 95 for the first time ever (been playing since 2011). That with the majority of rounds played from 5817 yard tips at my short home course. I played one round from 4533 this year and shot a 93.

If my issues only came about from penalties with driver, woods and hybrids off the tee, sure - playing from less than 5,000 yards would have me shooting in the 80's on a regular basis. When I was tracking rounds with Shotscope, I would also keep score on a paper scorecard and writing down penalties so I could edit the round on my computer after I returned home. But those initial unedited scores gave a glimpse of what my golf would be like if I could keep the ball in play - often in the low to mid 80's. I don't hit a lot of penalties with irons (4% vs 15%).

From 5,000 yards, there are one or two 300 yard par 4s, but most are around 275 or less - a well-struck 6i and 9i for me. Par 5s are 400-450 yards. At 450, I'll have to use something longer than a 150 yard club off the tee in order to hit those tiny, well-protected greens in regulation. (I absolutely cannot go after #7 green with anything longer than a 9i).

This is at my current age of 63.

Fast forward 10 years from now when I'm hitting my 6i 125 yards. Those same tees won't provide the same advantage. I'll have to try and learn how to hit hybrids, woods and driver again - something I haven't been doing a lot of in the last 10 years. Golf will be miserable even from the forward tees.

I enjoy golf for many reasons. Yes, being stuck at this level can be very frustrating when I know that almost anyone else who puts in the same effort gets better. But it is what it is.
 
Why play a course that is too hard for you? Maybe you need to find a course that doesn't have tiny, well-protected greens?
I know one guy who shot a dozen strokes and complained bitterly about the tilted fairway. "Worst course ever!"

But, it is his wife's favorite course!

I realized I was hitting far too many trees with driver. I put away the driver and returned to hitting my 4 iron off the tee box.
Now I'm hitting all my irons farther because I'm no longer worried about hitting trees! Some of my longest distances ever!
 
First round yesterday in 5-6 weeks. I normally don’t go to the range, but hit a bucket on Tuesday. Ended up shooting a personal best of 74, which beat my previous 75 which I set 2 months ago. I’m very happy about now!!
 
There is a course around here that I love the hole routing and the terrain, but the greens are very, very small, and they are all built the same, like little upside down bowls. Not any place to land, Approaches hit into the upslope spin back off. Hits on the sides and bounce off away from the green, or hits deep skid down the back side. I don't want to spend a round trying to bump and run onto those little mounds all day on a parkland course. If they would put some money into making better greens complexes they could have a great course.
 
I love the challenge of hitting a small green. It’s very satisfying. But when it’s small and well-protected, you have to play smart and know your limitations.
 
There is a course around here that I love the hole routing and the terrain, but the greens are very, very small, and they are all built the same, like little upside down bowls. Not any place to land, Approaches hit into the upslope spin back off. Hits on the sides and bounce off away from the green, or hits deep skid down the back side. I don't want to spend a round trying to bump and run onto those little mounds all day on a parkland course. If they would put some money into making better greens complexes they could have a great course.
Greens like you describe, or very firm greens, are more difficult for us as older guys as we don't have the swings and swing speed to be able to apply enough spin to hold those greens. Just bringing the ball in high isn't enough; we don't hit the ball log enough off the tee to be able to hit the clubs where height alone would do the job!
 
Greens like you describe, or very firm greens, are more difficult for us as older guys as we don't have the swings and swing speed to be able to apply enough spin to hold those greens. Just bringing the ball in high isn't enough; we don't hit the ball log enough off the tee to be able to hit the clubs where height alone would do the job!
Those greens are bad enough to be impossible even with a high spinning wedge in ones hand. I was told in the 70's the course was designed and built by a regular guy
(he worked at the nearby Ford Proving Grounds) who owned the property, built it using tractors and other recruited farm equipment. The way he flows with the terrain makes perfect sense and a really nice routing. But he skimped on the greens, both size and imagination. I cant say this is accurate but it makes sense.
 
There are a lot of reasons why my course is put together the way it is. It is cheap and well maintained by a wealthy Connecticut town for beginners and Seniors.
The trees protect golfers from errant tee shots on adjacent holes. As well as stopping some balls from leaving the course.
The "neighbors" are a community garden and Tennis/Pickleball court with very high fences on one side and a lake on the other.
The punishingly high rough and bunkers on the first hole is a warning to folks wild off the tee. The wetlands are littered with golf balls around the trees.
Small tricky greens and bunkers make it a challenge for seniors who play on a cheap season pass.
The 8th hole is absolutely brutal, supposedly the 3rd hardest Par 3 in the State of Connecticut. Last impressions matter!
The 9th allows you to finally air out your driver. But the green is wide but narrow with forest between it and the starter's house.
 
Greens like you describe, or very firm greens, are more difficult for us as older guys as we don't have the swings and swing speed to be able to apply enough spin to hold those greens. Just bringing the ball in high isn't enough; we don't hit the ball log enough off the tee to be able to hit the clubs where height alone would do the job!
Playing from about 5200 yards on Friday on a course that is par 70 so it plays longer with only 2 par 5s, my approach shots on the par 3s and 4s consisted of:

On Par 3s:
3W
8i
9i
GW

On Par 4s:
4H - once
5i - once
6i - twice
7i - four times
9i - twice
PW - twice

Overall, I think a decent mix.
 
Greens like you describe, or very firm greens, are more difficult for us as older guys as we don't have the swings and swing speed to be able to apply enough spin to hold those greens. Just bringing the ball in high isn't enough; we don't hit the ball log enough off the tee to be able to hit the clubs where height alone would do the job!
Yeah, we have a course down here called Shaftesbury Glen where almost every hole has that Ridan type green.
10-15 years ago it never bothered me playing there. Now, unless I’m coming in with an 8i or higher, it’s a struggle.
 
Playing from about 5200 yards on Friday on a course that is par 70 so it plays longer with only 2 par 5s, my approach shots on the par 3s and 4s consisted of:

On Par 3s:
3W
8i
9i
GW

On Par 4s:
4H - once
5i - once
6i - twice
7i - four times
9i - twice
PW - twice

Overall, I think a decent mix.
Yes that does look like a good mix of approach shots although that 3W on a Par 3 is unusual for a 5200 yd course? Of your 16 approach shots only 3 required more than a 6 iron, which from what I've seen is another good indicator that you're playing the appropriate tees. How many of these 16 approaches resulted in par or better?
 
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Yes that does look like a good mix of approach shots although that 3W on a Par 3 is unusual for a 5200 yd course? Of your 16 approach shots only 3 required more than a 6 iron, which from what I've seen is another good indicator that you're playing the appropriate tees. How many of these 16 approaches resulted in par or better?
I shot 74 with 13 pars, one birdie, one bogey and one double-bogey. FIRs = 71% / GIRs = 33% / Up&Down = 60%
 
Why play a course that is too hard for you? Maybe you need to find a course that doesn't have tiny, well-protected greens?
Reason #1: A course that is not too hard for me doesn't exist. :ROFLMAO:

Reason #2: I have unlimited yearly memberships to two different courses - 1 within walking distance and the other deep in the middle of the Manistee-Huron National Forest. The total membership cost for both is under $500/year. They are both well-maintained courses.

Reason #3: The value of hitting a large green in regulation is overrated - at least with my putting.

There is a course within an hour drive that is easy - relative to my weaknesses. It has a lot of room left and right off the tee and fairly wide-open greens. In past years, I'd play that course whenever I felt the need to shoot a lower score.
 
I can play tricky greens because I hit a high fade with fitted clubs that give me a good descent angle to help hold the greens.
Even better, after months of ball striking practice, I can swing my irons hard and accurately to hit greens!

But, on the holes that have an inviting path to the green, I'll take that chip and run up the green with a hybrid!
As well as a full swing with a lob wedge if that is what it takes.
 
I shot 74 with 13 pars, one birdie, one bogey and one double-bogey. FIRs = 71% / GIRs = 33% / Up&Down = 60%
Excellent! Played all day in your scoring zone and shot 4 over. That Up&Down of 60% is particularly good, I've been trying for years to average above 40% but have never done it. Related to that is where I miss the greens and how easy the chip/pitch is from there. Hitting 6 iron or less when attempting GIRs results in more manageable misses for sure.
 
I didn't mean to be judgmental towards those who really aren't aware. I apologize for coming across that way.

I've tried so many things over the years to try and improve... I guess I assumed people would realize they're not having a fun and try to figure out why. Playing from different tees has always been something I've done. If I want to work on my driver, I'll play from one set of tees. If I want to work on my irons, I'll play from another. Tracking and knowing my distances has always been easy and it just seems intuitive that people would know to move up. My range is between 5,000 and 6,000 - dependent more on the difficulty of a course than just distance.

My problem is keeping the ball in front of me - with any club. I wish better golf for me was as simple as moving up.
I can appreciate that. It's just that when the subject comes up I can't help but think about my buddy and what a struggle it was to get him to see reality. As for myself, back in my late teens and early 20's I played from the tips and shot around par, and sometimes under. I have traveled a long way from that territory! And the thing about moving up is, you don't have to do it on every hole! I'm not playing for a sanctioned handicap or anything like that, and neither is my buddy. We just started playing the local muni again after many years away. They're actually taking care of the old place, and it's playing very nicely! There's one hole that is really too short from the senior tees, even for us. The last time we played I said that we should hit from the regular tees, and he agreed. Much better to play the hole that way.

There is a course around here that I love the hole routing and the terrain, but the greens are very, very small, and they are all built the same, like little upside down bowls. Not any place to land, Approaches hit into the upslope spin back off. Hits on the sides and bounce off away from the green, or hits deep skid down the back side. I don't want to spend a round trying to bump and run onto those little mounds all day on a parkland course. If they would put some money into making better greens complexes they could have a great course.
This reminds me of a course that I'm pretty sure is closed now. All the greens had not only false fronts, but false sides and false backs too! A friend and I had a tee time there and when he showed up told me that a girl would be playing along. He met her at a bar and invited her. They had a bet on their match and he was giving her a stroke a hole! Seeing the look on my face he said that should be no problem. How good could she possibly be?! So much for the state of male chauvinism in the 1970's!

She shows up and he introduces us and goes into the shop to pay for their rounds. She takes a club to a grassy area and begins practice swinging. I can see right away that the girl can play! When my friend comes back I whisper to him that he might be in trouble. He had his troubles during the round, and on one hole, after a particularly good drive, he hit an approach that looked like it might be very good. Unfortunately it hit one of those false fronts, sides or backs, and caromed away at a sharp angle. He started stomping around, fussing and fuming, and said, "God almighty! Put a green up on a bald guys head and try to hit it up there!"

I started laughing so hard I almost fell down! Long story long, the girl almost beat him on the actual but, giving her a stroke a hole, he got his ass kicked!
 
FW, 53*, back fringe; D, 6i, short (fat); 7i, right; D, FW, FW, left; 6i, short (toe); D, FW, 58*, on; D, 6i, over; D, PW, on; D, 7W, right; D, FW, GW, on; D, FW, short; 8i, on; D, 6i, left; D, 7i, short (fat); D, 53*, on; D, FW, 53*, short; 7W, right; D, 6i, short (fat).

This is in a course that plays 5900 yards, par 72 with hills, sloping fairways and greens. Today was 81 with 31 putts, 6 greens, 8 fairways. It’s not unusual to hit every club in the bag at least once. Today was another bonus day BTW!
 
For many, it is possible but not wise to hit driver, as it is quite possible to go over or through the trees, for a very difficult recovery shot back through those trees.
As a slow swinger my 22* 4 iron is perfect for holes like that.

A good example that getting it as close to the hole as possible isn't always a wise strategy.
Exactly. My KE4 Max ate 20* in the 4 and 23* in the 5. With roll out sometimes to just under 200 yds. Wedge and 2 putt, and on to the next…
 
For many, it is possible but not wise to hit driver, as it is quite possible to go over or through the trees, for a very difficult recovery shot back through those trees.
As a slow swinger my 22* 4 iron is perfect for holes like that.

A good example that getting it as close to the hole as possible isn't always a wise strategy.
For me, not carrying a 4I is a good idea. Not that I can't launch them, I just have no idea where they will land!
 
D, FW, GW, on; 7i, on; D, GW, on, D, FW, 7W, on; D, 53*, on; D, 7i (punch), short left; 4H, right; D, 58*, on; D, 8i, left; D, 7i, short right; D, 53*, on; 6i, on; 4H, 58*, on; PW, on; D, 5H, 53* (pitch), on; D, 7i, on; D, PW, on; D, FW, 58* (pitch), on.

This is the 5300 yard course. Yeah, I shot an easy 74 today, 10 fairways, 14 greens. 33 putts. I had 7 putts for birdie today inside 10’, only made one. I burned the edges a lot though. The weather started turning this afternoon. Golf is going to be pretty spotty from now through March.
 
I had an enjoyable round today despite a bunch of three putts. Blame it on the 40 degree weather, the coldest I've ever played in!
There were a couple of holes with the sun in my eyes, but I knew where the ball was supposed to go and had no trouble finding it!
Golf is so much easier when the Tee shots are in the fairway and the approach shots are close to the greens.
Also had trouble with deep bunkers. Found I had to open the face of the club to get enough height being so close to the lip.
My legs are a bit wobbly after being out in the cold!
 
I can appreciate that. It's just that when the subject comes up I can't help but think about my buddy and what a struggle it was to get him to see reality. As for myself, back in my late teens and early 20's I played from the tips and shot around par, and sometimes under. I have traveled a long way from that territory! And the thing about moving up is, you don't have to do it on every hole! I'm not playing for a sanctioned handicap or anything like that, and neither is my buddy. We just started playing the local muni again after many years away. They're actually taking care of the old place, and it's playing very nicely! There's one hole that is really too short from the senior tees, even for us. The last time we played I said that we should hit from the regular tees, and he agreed. Much better to play the hole that way.
I am going to try and mix it up a bit more next year and play from the reds at least a few times. I could use those tees when I get the hankering to play my old Hogan Radials.

I just enjoy about playing driver off the tee and using hybrids for those long par 3s at my course. That's why I enjoy a good round from the black tees. When I play from the 5400 yard middle tees, a good drive will get me in trouble on a lot of the par 4s. But I think the variety of playing all 3 will allow me to work on different parts of my game.

At my second course, I might do as you suggest and play a couple combo rounds. Not sure how to post a round like that, but I can just not worry about that.

I broke 90 more times in 2023 than I ever have in any other season and half from 5800 yards. Now my goal is to break 85. That'll probably only happen from the middle tees. We'll see. I'm not getting any younger.
 
A tale of two 9's. I was on fire on the front 9. Hit every fairway. 5 greens in regulation. Two birdies. I've never had two birdies in 18 holes much less 9. Easily the best 9 I've ever played with a 38. Never broke 40 on any nine holes before today. And it was from the men's whites not the senior tees.

Then it was like another golfer took over my body. A bad one. Pull hooked a shot into someone's back yard on hole 10. Then trying not to do it again pushed one into the trees on the next hole. Another missed fairway on 12. 7 over on the first 3 holes in the back nine. On my way to a 51. 89 is a good score for me but disappointing after that terrific front nine.

My upper body just felt so tight and achy. I couldn't turn like I wanted to. I need to figure out how to maintain the same flexibility later in the round. I have to wear a compression shirt with lidocaine patches so my back doesn't hurt so much. But I don't know if that causes the stiffness and flexibility problems.
 
Combo rounds. I played Southern Dune this last summer and they had a green/white combo and a white/blue combo. I played at combo that was just under 6000 yards. I think I ended up shooting 81. Was a good test for me.
 
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