Trying to Break 100

[dthrog00]

That concept has been hard for me to grasp. Whenever I try to work the lower body around the hips it throws everything off. I wish I could find a repeatable swing I don't have to think about so much. I want it to be more natural instead of trying to force it. All these steps I run through my mind when I set up. Then something gets lost in the translation. Or I forget something. Muscle memory apparently is not my strength.

First, the usual disclaimer of high handicap to high handicap advice... proceed at your own risk.

The idea is that if the hips haven't opened there's no where for the arms to go except to be thrown outside the ball which ends in with a swipe across the ball, big time out to in path, and the dreaded banana ball.

If your hips have cleared before the arms begin the down swing there's an opportunity to have a neutral or even in to out path and get a straight ball or a draw.

My ball flight tends to be left to right also. I play a fade off the tee, but it is not a banana very often.

Dave

 

[thommo.sx]

That concept has been hard for me to grasp. Whenever I try to work the lower body around the hips it throws everything off. I wish I could find a repeatable swing I don't have to think about so much. I want it to be more natural instead of trying to force it. All these steps I run through my mind when I set up. Then something gets lost in the translation. Or I forget something. Muscle memory apparently is not my strength.

FWIW, even though I have awful body kinetic awareness, I know my slice shots come from when I'm being too aggressive in my swing. No idea if it provokes OTT, too harsh a transition, hands not catching up and leaving the face open, face to path badness or what. But it's definitely when I try and flay the cobblers off it that it doesn't go well.

Purely for me, I decide what my intended shot is going to be, pay attention to static setup, and then ALL I think about is tempo, and let the rest take care of itself.

I've said it a few times on here, but as long as my swing tempo lasts as along as it takes to say "Archibald Cadogan" (ball strike on "dug") it tends to be pretty decent/ not right angle right. That count may not work for you as everyone's natural/preferred tempo is different, but when you hit a good one, have a think and see if there is some phrase or count you can repeat and see how it goes.

 

[UberPete]

my swing tempo lasts as along as it takes to say "Archibald Cadogan"

I'm new so I haven't seen your previous posts on this so I have to ask: How did you come up with that name as a measure of your tempo???

 

[dthrog00]

FWIW, even though I have awful body kinetic awareness, I know my slice shots come from when I'm being too aggressive in my swing. No idea if it provokes OTT, too harsh a transition, hands not catching up and leaving the face open, face to path badness or what. But it's definitely when I try and flay the cobblers off it that it doesn't go well.

Purely for me, I decide what my intended shot is going to be, pay attention to static setup, and then ALL I think about is tempo, and let the rest take care of itself.

I've said it a few times on here, but as long as my swing tempo lasts as along as it takes to say "Archibald Cadogan" (ball strike on "dug") it tends to be pretty decent/ not right angle right. That count may not work for you as everyone's natural/preferred tempo is different, but when you hit a good one, have a think and see if there is some phrase or count you can repeat and see how it goes.

The other issue with slices is the gear effect miss. Face to path can be fine, but if you smash it off the far heel it will slice, likewise hit one on the far toe and it will hook. If you only slice occasionally then check impact location.

Dave

 

[thommo.sx]

I'm new so I haven't seen your previous posts on this so I have to ask: How did you come up with that name as a measure of your tempo???

That came from Peter Alliss, it was his old headmaster or something, and that was how he measured his tempo. I tried it and it worked for me. Some people just count, but the meter of the of the count has to be natural as if you were saying it.

 

[Hamfist]

That concept has been hard for me to grasp. Whenever I try to work the lower body around the hips it throws everything off. I wish I could find a repeatable swing I don't have to think about so much. I want it to be more natural instead of trying to force it. All these steps I run through my mind when I set up. Then something gets lost in the translation. Or I forget something. Muscle memory apparently is not my strength.

I have boiled it down to one though at address "Stick your butt out. Further." As my instructor showed me, my posture had me in a "upside down J" shape, where my hip/pelvis were too close to the Ball/target line. This left me no room to get my hands through the swing without doing a bunch of bad gyrations. Once I thought about sticking the booty out more, the space opened up and I didnt have to do the gyrations. It's a simple, basic thing that I see friends do all the time. That straight up "dowagers hump" posture. And a super easy fix.

 

[tehuti]

That concept has been hard for me to grasp. Whenever I try to work the lower body around the hips it throws everything off. I wish I could find a repeatable swing I don't have to think about so much. I want it to be more natural instead of trying to force it. All these steps I run through my mind when I set up. Then something gets lost in the translation. Or I forget something. Muscle memory apparently is not my strength.

Another high handicapper observation here. I generally don't slice anything but my driver, but I have recently tried a few of Jim Venetos' suggestions from his Youtube videos and it helps me. I am not ready to go all in and sign up for his "method" but his idea of presetting your inside swing path by closing your stance seems to work for me and my inflexible midsection. By doing that it's almost impossible for me to come over the top.

 

[2ezGolf]

Played yesterday. First time with a friend of mine. He's a 7. He decided he was going to walk so I decided to match him. Walking 18 is not the biz for those that don't do it regularly. To top it off on the first hole I was in the trees after I hit my ball I here FORE, FORE as a ball hits me in the heel. lol Not the start. Hobbled around 9. Tried to get a cart at the turn but due to covid and everyone playing one to a cart none available. Anyways long story short worst round in a long time. 115.
Better luck next week.

 

[Hamfist]

Played yesterday. First time with a friend of mine. He's a 7. He decided he was going to walk so I decided to match him. Walking 18 is not the biz for those that don't do it regularly. To top it off on the first hole I was in the trees after I hit my ball I here FORE, FORE as a ball hits me in the heel. lol Not the start. Hobbled around 9. Tried to get a cart at the turn but due to covid and everyone playing one to a cart none available. Anyways long story short worst round in a long time. 115.
Better luck next week.

Ouch. I walked 18 last week and my feet were barking mad.

 

[Joshnoble01]

I mind blanked my lesson this morning because I got caught up in emails. I feel like an opportunity to get better was lost. Not pleased.

 

[SirPercival]

Well, time to tell something about my golfing year. Been some months since my last post. Played more this year than ever before. I guess I have around 40 rounds at this time. Scoring has been better and probably around 1/3 of the rounds is sub 100.But it has been hard to get under 95.
But on Sunday I finally made it. 91 strokes. It could have been better as I made a triple bogey on 17, but otherwise it was solid. A lesson with the head pro gave me some corrections with the setup and it has been very helpful.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[UberPete]

That came from Peter Alliss, it was his old headmaster or something, and that was how he measured his tempo. I tried it and it worked for me. Some people just count, but the meter of the of the count has to be natural as if you were saying it.

Ahh okay. It was pretty random and not a common name now-a-days. I googled it and came up empty so I was thinking, hmmm. Could that be Thommo's real name? Would it be impolite to out him on the spot and ask? In the end, I had to know!

 

[JonMA1]

That concept has been hard for me to grasp. Whenever I try to work the lower body around the hips it throws everything off. I wish I could find a repeatable swing I don't have to think about so much. I want it to be more natural instead of trying to force it. All these steps I run through my mind when I set up. Then something gets lost in the translation. Or I forget something. Muscle memory apparently is not my strength.

I've fought this for so long that I finally just gave up. I now have a swing that looks nothing like a classic swing (actually it's ridiculous-looking), BUT it does help me reduce the root cause of my poor contact.

 

[dthrog00]

Sorry for the rant, but hybrid vs iron...

Everyone says amateur golfers are saved by hybrids instead of those pesky hard to hit long irons. I have very weak lofted irons as I'm playing off a 48* pitching wedge and the 4 and 5 irons in my set are manageable at 24* and 28* respectively. I took the proverbial wisdom today and put the 25* hybrid in the bag instead of the 4 iron. I rarely need this yardage.

I was on the 7th hole with a merciless wind that was blowing left-to-right and hard in my face. My drive was pushed right by the wind, but was playable and ended up in an ok lie. I had 139 left to the pin and figured I had 1.5-2 club wind that I was working against. Long is jail on this hole as you'd be OB in someone's back yard. Left and right misses are not as big of a deal and misses short are fine.

I decide to pull the 25* hybrid (typically 155 club as I'm not a bomber) and aim for the left sand trap. My vision is the ball starts over the trap with a high-ish flight and then with my normal fade and the wind would probably end up on the right hand side of the green pin high. I take my swing and am dumb founded as I watch the ball take off as I've managed to thin it somehow and the ball is headed dead left and not curving. It lands just left of the sand trap, hits a hill, and bounds halfway towards the 8th tee.

I make my way over to the ball and laser the pin at 44 yards away and basically pin high. I hit my pitch but it ends up a little bit short, hits the hill and takes a bad bounce, and ends up on the first cut on the other side of the green. I end up making double.

Did the hybrid actually help me here?

I clearly mishit the ball and the hybrid did preserve ball speed on the miss which is what they are supposed to do, but it ended up 44 yards left! What would happen with that same swing and the 4 iron? I don't think I've ever hit a 4 iron pull that went dead left. I probably would have thinned it curving to the right and end up short of the pin with a vanilla short game shot and likely bogey. I doubt I would have made double from such a position.

If someone just can't get the long irons in the air then I absolutely get it the hybrid is better. But, if you can get an ok trajectory where should the transition happen? Arguably for me, since I rarely have forced carries over water, that the left/right iron accuracy is better as hybrid misses will just go farther into the junk.

How about you?

Dave

 

[greenOak]

I agree with your take on hybrids. Aside from launching higher, they're not any more forgiving than an iron. They don't preserve ball speed any better than a game-improvement iron, and they curve just as much as a similarly lofted iron. I carry a 18* hybrid and honestly off the tee and in the fairway I'd hit a 2-iron just as well. However, out of the rough I find the higher launch of hybrids very useful.

 

[JonMA1]

Everyone says amateur golfers are saved by hybrids instead of those pesky hard to hit long irons

You know how I feel about "conventional" thinking. While there's often truth to it generally speaking, there are always exceptions and it's rarely as overwhelmingly true as the hype would indicate.

That said, I do make better contact with hybrids over long irons - but that's just me. And hybrids are not magic clubs. My most frequent miss is to badly top a shot. I lose at least one stroke every time I do that. I can also hook the bejesus out of ball when I don't control my tempo and have had rounds where I'm plagued by two-way misses. Those penalty strokes are round killers.

But boy, it's so nice to have a longer club that I can make solid contact with on most occasions and get predictable distance. A long iron, on the other hand, requires a very good swing just to get more distance than a mid iron.

 

[dthrog00]

In the particular case I cited the hybrid did exactly what is was supposed to do -- I mishit the ball and it kept enough ball speed to still go somewhere. Where it went led to double bogey I don't think the iron goes as far on that strike and in this particular example I would have scored better.

It makes me wonder for mid-hybrids (25*) like this where the transition is for who it helps and how much it helps their score.

Dave

 

[CoupleQuads]

Shot a 96 yesterday on a gorgeous course tucked away in the hills in Quebec. My second shot has still consistently been my downfall. Struggling to hit low irons consistently.

 

[Hamfist]

Shot a 96 yesterday on a gorgeous course tucked away in the hills in Quebec. My second shot has still consistently been my downfall. Struggling to hit low irons consistently.

View attachment 8961850

Ooooo, purty!!

 

[Hamfist]

In the particular case I cited the hybrid did exactly what is was supposed to do -- I mishit the ball and it kept enough ball speed to still go somewhere. Where it went led to double bogey I don't think the iron goes as far on that strike and in this particular example I would have scored better.

It makes me wonder for mid-hybrids (25*) like this where the transition is for who it helps and how much it helps their score.

Dave

Well, I'm gaming a "6-iron" hybrid and a "5-iron" hybrid right now, still growing into them after 10 rounds or so. As to whether they are/would be better than hitting a couple regular irons is tough to qualify. I've hit bad shots with them and some smoked shots. some wayward some lazer straight.

To me, it really boils down to confidence in the club and the swing you put on it. Do I feel more confidence looking down on these than my old Ping 6 & 5? No. will I as I get better at hitting each of them? I'm sure I will.

One benefit I've noticed right off is the distance. I do hit these further (with comparable swings). And on most quality swings, the direction is as good. Now, I can't seem to "manipulate" the shot as well as I could with the irons, so there is that.

 

[JonMA1]

In the particular case I cited the hybrid did exactly what is was supposed to do -- I mishit the ball and it kept enough ball speed to still go somewhere. Where it went led to double bogey I don't think the iron goes as far on that strike and in this particular example I would have scored better.

It makes me wonder for mid-hybrids (25*) like this where the transition is for who it helps and how much it helps their score.

Dave

I get what you’re saying but you’d have to play several rounds to really get an accurate analysis.

There are plenty of high cappers who prefer irons. For me, the two clubs require very different swings. Maybe it comes down to the idea that we don’t really use the same swing throughout the bag as we’ve heard so many times????

 

[Hamfist]

I get what you’re saying but you’d have to play several rounds to really get an accurate analysis.

There are plenty of high cappers who prefer irons. For me, the two clubs require very different swings. Maybe it comes down to the idea that we don’t really use the same swing throughout the bag as we’ve heard so many times????

Could be.

I'd say to Dave, play both. Just hit two balls from the spot, one with the hybrid, one with the iron. (Pace of play/overcrowded course/etc. notwithstanding.) Compare, contrast. Pick the one you like better.

 

[Crapgame]

Just played my best round of the year - came in at 95 from Green Tees! Was more consistent off the tee, got unlucky with a few bounces hitting the wrong side of hills, but putted much better and did well with the 25-90 yard wedge shots.

 

[fistfullofbeer]

I have boiled it down to one though at address "Stick your butt out. Further." As my instructor showed me, my posture had me in a "upside down J" shape, where my hip/pelvis were too close to the Ball/target line. This left me no room to get my hands through the swing without doing a bunch of bad gyrations. Once I thought about sticking the booty out more, the space opened up and I didnt have to do the gyrations. It's a simple, basic thing that I see friends do all the time. That straight up "dowagers hump" posture. And a super easy fix.

Funny that you mention that because I have been working on the same thing. I try to focus on sticking my butt out at address which makes my backswing so much better. This also lets me start my downswing/transition with almost a 'sitting down' motion. It makes sure that I start my transition/downswing with the lower body instead of swinging with my arms or upper body. When I do that, its basically pull city.

 

[Annhl8rX]

I haven’t really been working at improving for a good long while, but I went out and shot a 98 today on a course that I wasn’t familiar with. The bulk of the credit goes to the fact that I had zero penalties.

After topping my three wood from the tee on the first two holes I switched to my Ping Crossover. That club was money for me, both from the tee and the fairway. I was surprised by my results as I haven’t really used it much.

I had three pars and a birdie, and my worst hole was a triple (I had two of them). This was probably the best round I’ve ever played. I don’t think I’ve ever gone without a snowman or higher before.