Trying to Break 100

[JonMA1]

Are you putting a fast swing on these shots?

Do you use the firm wrist approach to chipping, or do you do the Phil M "hinge and hold"?

Have you tried laying the face open and swinging from out to in on a 45 degree angle?

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

 

[BigMac]

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

The flop is a hard shot because it takes full commitment, and if you screw it up you probably just hit a 150 yard line drive instead of a 5 yard flop! To get that hard spin like the pros do takes a pretty hard swing, and flops usually go higher rather than farther when you swing harder (if done right - otherwise, see above!).

 

[dthrog00]

Flop shots are a very skilled shot, messing it up can really hurt your scorecard. If you aren't scoring great take your medicine when you short side yourself, try to limit the roll out, and move on to the next hole.

Dave

 

[Hamfist]

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

Well, once again, remember I’m no pro, you should be able to get a nice pop-up using a 56 laid open. Are you opening your stance a good amount? Try opening your stance about 30 degrees, open the club face about the same, choke down to the end of the grip, and position the ball forward. These should all contribute to a nice spinny pop-up. Remember that you have to finish high with your hands. Low hands means a low ball. Another thing to play with is to snap the club at the ball with a strong right hand move. You will skull a few, but the majority should be good.

Now, get thee to thy back yard to practice!

Edit: full disclosure, i use a 54* SW as my highest lofted club.

 

[ntanygd760]

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

Flops don't really spin much but use height to stop. Speed matters a decent amount for full spinning shots. There is silly technical stuff like having as close to 45 degree spin loft as possible. Grooves need to be clean and a nice tight fairway. Any grass in between the ball and club kill spin. Certain grinds make it way easier to open the club and have it still lay flat so to speak. Keep working, flops and spinners from shorter distances are hard and can make you look silly when it doesn't go well.

 

[jlaakso]

Played not very pleasing 52/52: 104 today. Game was quite consistent bogey-double-bogey-double. Made few penalties and that messed my goal for sub 100. On the positive side, didn't cost me a dime and I got paid for the effort (work hours)

 

[Hamfist]

Flops don't really spin much but use height to stop. Speed matters a decent amount for full spinning shots. There is silly technical stuff like having as close to 45 degree spin loft as possible. Grooves need to be clean and a nice tight fairway. Any grass in between the ball and club kill spin. Certain grinds make it way easier to open the club and have it still lay flat so to speak. Keep working, flops and spinners from shorter distances are hard and can make you look silly when it doesn't go well.

Flops don't really spin much but use height to stop. Speed matters a decent amount for full spinning shots. There is silly technical stuff like having as close to 45 degree spin loft as possible. Grooves need to be clean and a nice tight fairway. Any grass in between the ball and club kill spin. Certain grinds make it way easier to open the club and have it still lay flat so to speak. Keep working, flops and spinners from shorter distances are hard and can make you look silly when it doesn't go well.

As I well know!!
Now, on to more detailed stuff. Wouldn't laying the face open and cutting across the ball at the 45 degree angle as I've been show impart a whole lot of spin? Also, how much grass between the face and the ball is needed to kill spin? I've heard it but never really put my tiny brain to thinking about it. Should one never try a high pop-up out of green side rough? Or should one just expect it to have roll?

 

[JaxHax]

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

FWIW - I checked out the Clay Ballard chipping drills that one of our regulars posted here a while back and it helped me a great deal. The concepts of using body rotation in concert with the arms and keeping the right elbow practically glued to the ribs made a big difference for me. Regarding height - the right elbow tuck seems to keep me from moving the club face to a more closed position at impact (with my right hand), thus keeping the trajectory up a bit compared to my previous chipping motion.

I also like his concept of hinging the wrists a bit at the transition but not getting overly handsy at impact. That's a slippery slope for many of us.

Regarding bounce, I did switch to a 56 with a wider sole and higher bounce and it has also helped me.
(I was gaming a Vokey BV 56-8 before that was rather unforgiving)

This is likely stuff you've already digested, but it helped me, so... Good Luck!

 

[bobellis75]

So I have decided for now, since I'm coming off last year not playing much, and coming off the shoulder...I'm gonna keep swinging the sticks I currently have. I want to keep working on some things I think are definitely helping me improve contact and if I make it thru the summer with my shoulder intact and showing some steady improvement, I'll revisit club fitting.

In the meantime, I did make one investment in the bag. When I started playing again, the guy I took lessons from recommended a mallet type of putter for me, as I have a very straight putting stroke. I had never really used one, but at the time, found a used half mallet (the full mallet was too weird to my eyes) for a good deal and decided to give that spin. I definitely liked the heftier feel to it and soon fitted it with a new grip. It's been an okay putter....but I feel like I could get more of a putter (putting was something I'd always had a good feel for anyway). So...the investment I'll make this year heading into summer is on a new putter. I went last night and worked thru some putters with a local pro for about two hours before settling on THIS.

A full mallet. Love the weight to it, and man do I love the feel at impact. Everything about the setup...the lie of the putter, the grip, the way it sets me up over the putter with the angle of the shaft...all feels fantastic. And I was rolling it very nicely as well. I'll retire the old Odyssey Metal X Rossi to my "garage bag of misfit clubs"...it's always good to have a backup putter so the new putter has someone looking over his shoulder...a motivator to perform

Also talked at some length with him about my now infamous Rocketbladez (which many of you know I haven't hit well) - he disagreed with the pro who told me to dump them. He said to hang on to them and keep working on my swing with the Callaways since that's more comfortable to me (which he said there is a probably a mental aspect to that). He said keep hitting balls and playing with the Callaway and forcing my swing thoughts/improvements on myself...to fight thru anything that doesn't "feel right" even if it means I'm hitting some awful shots until some things are ingrained as habit. Then maybe in anywhere from 2-6 weeks (depending on how I'm feeling) bring the TM's back to the range and give em ago. He emphasized (this is a guy I've talked to and worked with at the range before) that I have a decent swing and coming back from a shoulder injury really sucks and makes it very hard to find the swing again for a while for several reasons (physical/mental).

So....short story long....new putter...good advice from a guy I trust...and I'm not giving up on the TM's just yet. That said...he said if I hit the Callaway better, I hit them better...and it could be the setup of the TM's aren't for me...but to give them a fair shake with a healthy shoulder once I'm sure I'm fully healthy and swinging like I used to. He said the technology is so much better currently and can offer me more than what I get out of my Callaways…(the TM's included) but that everyone is of course different and if I want some new irons at some point, it's just a matter of finding the right clubs, if the TM's don't pan out. He also reminded me (which I already knew) the TM's are delofted (as are most current irons) from what I have in Callaway...so hitting a 4 iron is more like a 3, and so on. He said the back end of the TM's are closer (the 8/9/PW) but that as the iron gets longer, the loft gets weaker...so there is a different feel to them for that reason as well. So he says if I groove my 7 nicely (which I do)...that would be more like the TM 8 iron.

Anyway...shutting up now! Another rainy day here...but I have a putting mat I'll be using later to play with my new toy.

 

[bobellis75]

No on the fast swing, not from next to the green. I have read club head speed is where the spin comes from, but I'm too chicken $#*! to swing hard next to a green.

I'm not sure what Phil does - other than hit impossible shots - but as much as possible I try to hinge my wrists on most short game shots. The closer the landing target, the less the backswing. It's a feel, but sometimes it's almost like letting the club head drop with very slow hands/arms.

Yes on opening up the face, but I haven't had a lot of success using that with my 56° sand wedge - maybe because of the bounce???? When I carried the 60° lob wedge, I could occasionally pull off a flop - meaning I could get the height and distance I was looking for form an almost full swing. But even on many of those, there was often more roll out than I thought there should be.

Definitely have to swing the club...how far back you go in backswing and technique will keep distance in check. It took me a long time to get comfortable with my 58 degree...and now I love it. You just have to trust putting that acceleration into the swing...it won't fly on you (unless you skull one and shoot it across the green). I use it all the time now greenside...even knocked one in with the 58 last time I played nine.

 

[Hamfist]

So I have decided for now, since I'm coming off last year not playing much, and coming off the shoulder...I'm gonna keep swinging the sticks I currently have. I want to keep working on some things I think are definitely helping me improve contact and if I make it thru the summer with my shoulder intact and showing some steady improvement, I'll revisit club fitting.

In the meantime, I did make one investment in the bag. When I started playing again, the guy I took lessons from recommended a mallet type of putter for me, as I have a very straight putting stroke. I had never really used one, but at the time, found a used half mallet (the full mallet was too weird to my eyes) for a good deal and decided to give that spin. I definitely liked the heftier feel to it and soon fitted it with a new grip. It's been an okay putter....but I feel like I could get more of a putter (putting was something I'd always had a good feel for anyway). So...the investment I'll make this year heading into summer is on a new putter. I went last night and worked thru some putters with a local pro for about two hours before settling on THIS.

A full mallet. Love the weight to it, and man do I love the feel at impact. Everything about the setup...the lie of the putter, the grip, the way it sets me up over the putter with the angle of the shaft...all feels fantastic. And I was rolling it very nicely as well. I'll retire the old Odyssey Metal X Rossi to my "garage bag of misfit clubs"...it's always good to have a backup putter so the new putter has someone looking over his shoulder...a motivator to perform

Also talked at some length with him about my now infamous Rocketbladez (which many of you know I haven't hit well) - he disagreed with the pro who told me to dump them. He said to hang on to them and keep working on my swing with the Callaways since that's more comfortable to me (which he said there is a probably a mental aspect to that). He said keep hitting balls and playing with the Callaway and forcing my swing thoughts/improvements on myself...to fight thru anything that doesn't "feel right" even if it means I'm hitting some awful shots until some things are ingrained as habit. Then maybe in anywhere from 2-6 weeks (depending on how I'm feeling) bring the TM's back to the range and give em ago. He emphasized (this is a guy I've talked to and worked with at the range before) that I have a decent swing and coming back from a shoulder injury really sucks and makes it very hard to find the swing again for a while for several reasons (physical/mental).

So....short story long....new putter...good advice from a guy I trust...and I'm not giving up on the TM's just yet. That said...he said if I hit the Callaway better, I hit them better...and it could be the setup of the TM's aren't for me...but to give them a fair shake with a healthy shoulder once I'm sure I'm fully healthy and swinging like I used to. He said the technology is so much better currently and can offer me more than what I get out of my Callaways…(the TM's included) but that everyone is of course different and if I want some new irons at some point, it's just a matter of finding the right clubs, if the TM's don't pan out. He also reminded me (which I already knew) the TM's are delofted (as are most current irons) from what I have in Callaway...so hitting a 4 iron is more like a 3, and so on. He said the back end of the TM's are closer (the 8/9/PW) but that as the iron gets longer, the loft gets weaker...so there is a different feel to them for that reason as well. So he says if I groove my 7 nicely (which I do)...that would be more like the TM 8 iron.

Anyway...shutting up now! Another rainy day here...but I have a putting mat I'll be using later to play with my new toy.

Sounds like a prudent plan! And, nice putter, if I may say.

 

[bobellis75]

Just as an example of the difference in lofts between my Callaway and the TM's....I carry 4 thru PW in the iron sets. The Callaway 4 Iron has a 24 degree loft. In the TM's, the 5 iron is a 23* and 6 iron is a 26.5*...so that's kind of what I'm talking about in the variance. So the TM 4 iron which would be my longest iron, has less loft than the Callaway 3 iron (which I don't even carry). My 7 iron, which I love in Callaway, is 34* while in the TM set, the 7 iron is 30.5*….

Now all that is fine and dandy...but I think the Bladez can tout "hit it further" because they are very different from the old clubs (which I think most modern clubs are this way). Now...the TM's of course have more modern technology and are more forgiving (allegedly) and so on....so maybe as I get going...none of this will matter. And maybe just knowing these loft differences is just a big mental hurdle and a mindf**k

 

[Hamfist]

Just as an example of the difference in lofts between my Callaway and the TM's....I carry 4 thru PW in the iron sets. The Callaway 4 Iron has a 24 degree loft. In the TM's, the 5 iron is a 23* and 6 iron is a 26.5*...so that's kind of what I'm talking about in the variance. So the TM 4 iron which would be my longest iron, has less loft than the Callaway 3 iron (which I don't even carry). My 7 iron, which I love in Callaway, is 34* while in the TM set, the 7 iron is 30.5*….

Now all that is fine and dandy...but I think the Bladez can tout "hit it further" because they are very different from the old clubs (which I think most modern clubs are this way). Now...the TM's of course have more modern technology and are more forgiving (allegedly) and so on....so maybe as I get going...none of this will matter. And maybe just knowing these loft differences is just a big mental hurdle and a mindf**k

There's a lot online about modern irons and super strong lofts, but watching a few testers (like TXG on YouTube, they are getting just as much height on the shots as the older, more lofted clubs. Interesting science stuff.

 

[InTheRough]

Well, I shot +11 for 9 holes with 2 pars... almost 3, but my putt lipped out.

I'm wondering if I should just get a standard length F9 GW and call it a day rather than get an entire set because I hit the rest of the OL irons pretty well. It's the GW that I have problems with.

 

[tehuti]

Played a lackluster 9 today. I hit decent tee shots but not much else. Tried out the new Cut matte white balls that I just received today. They seem okay, but I felt off all day, so maybe the ball had something to do with it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[LLIB]

Playing with some single digit THPers Sunday. I haven’t broke 100 since late last year. No pressure

 

[dthrog00]

As I well know!!
Now, on to more detailed stuff. Wouldn't laying the face open and cutting across the ball at the 45 degree angle as I've been show impart a whole lot of spin? Also, how much grass between the face and the ball is needed to kill spin? I've heard it but never really put my tiny brain to thinking about it. Should one never try a high pop-up out of green side rough? Or should one just expect it to have roll?

If this was the breaking 80 thread I'd be on board, but not breaking 100. Breaking 100 on a par 72 (+28) means you get 9 bogeys and 9 doubles (+27) to play with. There's no way most of the folks here should be taking on full blown flop shots if they are playing for their best possible score.

My honest opinion is hit your best square or slightly open shot with a wedge you're comfortable with and just try to get the ball on the green. A wedge laid wide open is a skull and blow up hole waiting to happen. Take your medicine and go to the next hole.

Dave

 

[ntanygd760]

As I well know!!
Now, on to more detailed stuff. Wouldn't laying the face open and cutting across the ball at the 45 degree angle as I've been show impart a whole lot of spin? Also, how much grass between the face and the ball is needed to kill spin? I've heard it but never really put my tiny brain to thinking about it. Should one never try a high pop-up out of green side rough? Or should one just expect it to have roll?

I remember seeing a video which I could totally be way off but just grass on the club face takes it down from like 11k to 7k on a full shot. Yeah cutting across works on short ones side spin helps it check as well but that gets sketchy out past 30 yards I think. I always just play the greenside rough shot to run out a bit. Can't think of the last phil full swing flop I tried without a tree to get over. But yeah short sided sometimes it will be a 10 foot par attempt and not much better.

 

[LLIB]

If this was the breaking 80 thread I'd be on board, but not breaking 100. Breaking 100 on a par 72 (+28) means you get 9 bogeys and 9 doubles (+27) to play with. There's no way most of the folks here should be taking on full blown flop shots if they are playing for their best possible score.

My honest opinion is hit your best square or slightly open shot with a wedge you're comfortable with and just try to get the ball on the green. A wedge laid wide open is a skull and blow up hole waiting to happen. Take your medicine and go to the next hole.

Dave

There’s not a more satisfying shot for a high hc to pull off. There’s also not a faster way to kill a good round than not pulling it off

 

[jlaakso]

Flop shots for high cappers, no way. Most used shot in high cappers' toolbox is duff-n-run, learn that and you're golden

 

[BigMac]

If this was the breaking 80 thread I'd be on board, but not breaking 100. Breaking 100 on a par 72 (+28) means you get 9 bogeys and 9 doubles (+27) to play with. There's no way most of the folks here should be taking on full blown flop shots if they are playing for their best possible score.

My honest opinion is hit your best square or slightly open shot with a wedge you're comfortable with and just try to get the ball on the green. A wedge laid wide open is a skull and blow up hole waiting to happen. Take your medicine and go to the next hole.

Dave

^ I mean, he's not wrong. Hit the simplest shot you possibly can to get the ball anywhere on the green and get your putter in hand. Your worst simple chip shot is going to turn out far, far better than your worst flop shot. If you can putt, putt; if you can't putt, chip; if you can't chip, pitch. Attempting a flop should be your absolute last resort when no other shot is possibly going to work.

 

[Hamfist]

Well, I shot +11 for 9 holes with 2 pars... almost 3, but my putt lipped out.

I'm wondering if I should just get a standard length F9 GW and call it a day rather than get an entire set because I hit the rest of the OL irons pretty well. It's the GW that I have problems with.

Yes, always yes for new club(s).

 

[Hamfist]

Played a lackluster 9 today. I hit decent tee shots but not much else. Tried out the new Cut matte white balls that I just received today. They seem okay, but I felt off all day, so maybe the ball had something to do with it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

That's a big ol' logo, there.

 

[Hamfist]

If this was the breaking 80 thread I'd be on board, but not breaking 100. Breaking 100 on a par 72 (+28) means you get 9 bogeys and 9 doubles (+27) to play with. There's no way most of the folks here should be taking on full blown flop shots if they are playing for their best possible score.

My honest opinion is hit your best square or slightly open shot with a wedge you're comfortable with and just try to get the ball on the green. A wedge laid wide open is a skull and blow up hole waiting to happen. Take your medicine and go to the next hole.

Dave

Party-pooper!!

 

[Hamfist]

There’s not a more satisfying shot for a high hc to pull off. There’s also not a faster way to kill a good round than not pulling it off

What is this "good round" of which you speak?