Trying to follow the rules but what would you do here?

The ball doesn’t actually have to be in an unplayable lie. The ball can be sitting perfectly in the fairway or the green even and you can still deem it unplayable.

Then it is in an unplayable lie. Who are you to tell another competitor that their lie is playable? If you wanna drop it off hard pan dirt with pebbles around your ball to a spot in some lush grass, then should I be able to tell you that you can't because it's perfectly playable?
 
I would definitely move the ball, penalty or no penalty. I don't have OEM's falling over themselves to give me fresh equipment whenever I damage a club. And what the heck is gravel doing in bounds on a golf course unless its ground under repair or a cart path?
 
Only way I play it off the gravel is if I'm in a tournament...otherwise I move it and continue on.
 
I would definitely move the ball, penalty or no penalty. I don't have OEM's falling over themselves to give me fresh equipment whenever I damage a club. And what the heck is gravel doing in bounds on a golf course unless its ground under repair or a cart path?

Well, we're learning elsewhere on THP that boundaries are ridiculous. As far as needing new equipment when a club gets "damaged", that's going a little overboard with this scenario. I mean, we're talking about a couple of small nicks on the bottom of the clubhead. It'd not like the shaft was broken or there was a huge gouge in the face that would affect ball flight. The club is fine.
 
Then it is in an unplayable lie. Who are you to tell another competitor that their lie is playable? If you wanna drop it off hard pan dirt with pebbles around your ball to a spot in some lush grass, then should I be able to tell you that you can't because it's perfectly playable?
I’m the one playing against you. If your ball is sitting fine and you say it is unplayable, you are being dishonest and the USGA rule allows for this. If it’s in hard pan dirt and pebbles and you want to take a stroke penalty to move it, that sounds fine to me. If it is on grass with nothing around it but you have trees blocking your preferred line, you shouldn’t be allowed to call it unplayable and move it. If you want it back from its spot, chip it back to where you want it, or take stroke and distance penalties and go back to your original spot. It’s a bad rule as applied.
 
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100% I am moving it w/out penalty
 
Speaking of hitting the shot, since you did decide to hit the shot and use the wedge and receive the damage..........What was the result?
I hit it into a bunker, then muffed that shot. Ended up with a triple, I think

Anyhoo I’m at least glad this thread stoked some discussion, it’s been really interesting to read...
 
Interesting arguments here. I was thinking of the few times my ball has come to rest in an area that I would not hit it for fear of possible causing damage to the club or maybe myself. If I think the ball is hittable but I refuse to hit it, then I simply tell my buddy to take the stroke and I move the ball. Sitting on a tree root comes to mind as well.
 
Would you have dropped it on grass and played it with no penalty, or dropped on the grass and penalized yourself a stroke?
Not sure of the exact rule, but yes, I have dropped further away from the hole without assessing a penalty to avoid hitting off gravel or an asphalt cart path.

My clubs are pretty beat up at this point, so if in a competition I might just take the shot if I can't take relief. New clubs, I'd probably take an unplayable lie penalty and drop.
 
hitting off gravel or an asphalt cart path.

Cart path is allowed. Random gravel is a loose impediment... just move it, not the ball. It's such a simple situation. Not sure why it's so difficult for some to follow.
 
I’m the one playing against you. If your ball is sitting fine and you say it is unplayable, you are being dishonest and the USGA rule allows for this. If it’s in hard pan dirt and pebbles and you want to take a stroke penalty to move it, that sounds fine to me. If it is on grass with nothing around it but you have trees blocking your preferred line, you shouldn’t be allowed to call it unplayable and move it. If you want it back from its spot, chip it back to where you want it, or take stroke and distance penalties and go back to your original spot. It’s a bad rule as applied.

Well, the USGA allows you to declare it unplayable on hard pan with pebbles around even when it's not unplayable. You shouldn't be able to do that, but it's an option. If you want, you could take stroke and distance, too, but I'm sure you wouldn't because that doesn't make sense.
 
I can't understand those of you who deem it unreasonable for the course to have boundaries. I mean, the object of a game of football is to get the ball across the goal line, too, but it would be stupid if someone decided they were going to run the ball up into the stands and come around the other side of the field, run back down out of the stands, and cross the goal line, right? All games have a set play area. It's obvious that the game does not extend outside that area.

I do not disagree with one single letter of your statement.

That does not the change the fact that I consider this rule BAD. Which was my response to your initial question. Bad Rules? Like what?

I never asked for a playing field without boundaries.

I simply take issue with how those boundaries are addressed. More importantly the penalties applied when those boundaries are breached.

The penalty is far too inequitable to the other infractions in golf. As LICC has stated better than I with the pond.

#3 Inequitable penalty.

Drive missing to the left lands in Mrs. Johnson's backyard. Marked, and clearly O.B. Mrs. Johnson prizes her backyard and has it manicured better that any of the holes on the course. You could not find a better lie on any spot of The Augusta National Golf Club.
I can not put a club on it. I have one option. Hit another shot from the previous spot with the penatly of one stroke. (I don't want to hear about any 2019 local rule speed up play ********. I'm talking about the spirit of the rules and this bad one in particular.)

Drive missing to the right lands in what can best best described and Yoda's backyard where Luke landed the X-Wing fighter on Dagoba. Hitting it out of there is impossible. NO! Only Impossible in your mind! For my ally is The Force and a powerful ally it is. Why did yoda talk mostly in sentences in ESB, but in all the other movies backwards he spoke? But I digress.
I have at least 2 options. The first of course: Addressing it and hitting it!

Missing a fairway should not allow for a score to swing by 3 strokes. By Rule! Not by skill.

It's a rule. It's there. Some of us know it, understand it, play by it, win, or lose because of it. Some play the game and have no idea it exists. Some play the game and choose to ignore it. The governing bodies have even made an attempt to remedy it on a local recreational level.

For all of the reason I have laid out(Contradictory, Arbitrary, Over Penal, Inequitable) It's a BAD RULE.
 
I do not disagree with one single letter of your statement.

That does not the change the fact that I consider this rule BAD. Which was my response to your initial question. Bad Rules? Like what?

I never asked for a playing field without boundaries.

I simply take issue with how those boundaries are addressed. More importantly the penalties applied when those boundaries are breached.

The penalty is far too inequitable to the other infractions in golf. As LICC has stated better than I with the pond.

#3 Inequitable penalty.

Drive missing to the left lands in Mrs. Johnson's backyard. Marked, and clearly O.B. Mrs. Johnson prizes her backyard and has it manicured better that any of the holes on the course. You could not find a better lie on any spot of The Augusta National Golf Club.
I can not put a club on it. I have one option. Hit another shot from the previous spot with the penatly of one stroke. (I don't want to hear about any 2019 local rule speed up play ********. I'm talking about the spirit of the rules and this bad one in particular.)

Drive missing to the right lands in what can best best described and Yoda's backyard where Luke landed the X-Wing fighter on Dagoba. Hitting it out of there is impossible. NO! Only Impossible in your mind! For my ally is The Force and a powerful ally it is. Why did yoda talk mostly in sentences in ESB, but in all the other movies backwards he spoke? But I digress.
I have at least 2 options. The first of course: Addressing it and hitting it!

Missing a fairway should not allow for a score to swing by 3 strokes. By Rule! Not by skill.

It's a rule. It's there. Some of us know it, understand it, play by it, win, or lose because of it. Some play the game and have no idea it exists. Some play the game and choose to ignore it. The governing bodies have even made an attempt to remedy it on a local recreational level.

For all of the reason I have laid out(Contradictory, Arbitrary, Over Penal, Inequitable) It's a BAD RULE.

Excellent post. I guess that's one of the things that makes me different. I see rules I'm games as neither good nor bad. They're just rules. If you strive to be good at whatever particular game it is, then follow them. If that's not your goal, then don't worry about them.
 
No, it’s not. Give me two examples of ponds on golf courses where a player can hit a ball out of the bottom of the pond.

Well, if the part of the pond the ball is in is not very deep and you can get a club on it, then you could it out if the shot is in your bag.
 
Assuming it's not out of bounds, it seems like rule that applies depends on why the gravel is there. In a casual round where I didn't know I would assume it's one of the reasons that allows a free drop. Only times I've ever seen gravel in bounds on a course is as part of some kind of temporary repair, part of a drain, or an older course with gravel cart paths.
 
Excellent post. I guess that's one of the things that makes me different. I see rules I'm games as neither good nor bad. They're just rules. If you strive to be good at whatever particular game it is, then follow them. If that's not your goal, then don't worry about them.

Thank you. I do appreciate your points.

I just get really tired of making sixes.
 
Excellent post. I guess that's one of the things that makes me different. I see rules I'm games as neither good nor bad. They're just rules. If you strive to be good at whatever particular game it is, then follow them. If that's not your goal, then don't worry about them.
If two rules are illogical or overly harsh, those are bad rules.
 
Well, if the part of the pond the ball is in is not very deep and you can get a club on it, then you could it out if the shot is in your bag.
Nope. Sorry, if the ball is at the bottom of a pond, you physically are not hitting it out. The rules are illogical.
 
Nope. Sorry, if the ball is at the bottom of a pond, you physically are not hitting it out. The rules are illogical.

Don't presume to tell me what I will or will not do or be able to do. If the pond is shallow enough and I can get a clib on it, then I will certainly entertain the option of hitting it.
 
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