Wedge Grooves - We've come full circle...

[-CRW-]

There's been tons of discussion on wedge grooves over the past few years were some thought that wedge grooves were only to channel debris and didn't actually bite into the golf ball cover. Largely this opinion came from Callaway and comments made by "F'n" Roger Cleveland. I guess we've come full circle because now Cleveland and the JAWS wedge is designed to have the "most aggressive" wedge grooves in golf with extremely shape edges on the wedge groove edges designed to bite into the ball and impart more spin.

From Callaway:

New JAWS Groove Design with Groove-In-Groove Technology for Exceptional Spin
Innovative JAWS groove design with extremely sharp edge radius works with our proven Groove-in-Groove technology to impart more spin for precise control.

I guess now that Callaway says it we can all get on the same page...even though many of us have known this for years.

 

[Canadan]

It's kind of wild, although i've never been a guy who needs spin support on anything minus maybe my 58 degree.

J15 wedges from bridgestone are still one of my favourite things on the planet due to their mid range spin profile.

 

[Gyro25]

All hail RfC

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[-CRW-]

It's kind of wild, although i've never been a guy who needs spin support on anything minus maybe my 58 degree.

J15 wedges from bridgestone are still one of my favourite things on the planet due to their mid range spin profile.

Me neither, and I wonder if these will eat into the cover of golf balls too quickly for the higher club head speed players.

On the other hand, there is some good testing/info coming out of wet/dry wedge testing so these may really shine in wet conditions. I hope the OEM's are keeping an eye on all of this and maybe more come up with hydrophobic finishes. And why stop at the wedges, put the finishes on irons too in an attempt to keep the spin consistent with the irons as well.

 

[Canadan]

Me neither, and I wonder if these will eat into the cover of golf balls too quickly for the higher club head speed players.

On the other hand, there is some good testing/info coming out of wet/dry wedge testing so these may really shine in wet conditions. I hope the OEM's are keeping an eye on all of this and maybe more come up with hydrophobic finishes. And why stop at the wedges, put the finishes on irons too in an attempt to keep the spin consistent with the irons as well.

Good opportunity for ball companies to sort it out haha

My RTX4 aren't chewing on my Tour B RX which is awesome.

 

[JB]

Me neither, and I wonder if these will eat into the cover of golf balls too quickly for the higher club head speed players.

On the other hand, there is some good testing/info coming out of wet/dry wedge testing so these may really shine in wet conditions. I hope the OEM's are keeping an eye on all of this and maybe more come up with hydrophobic finishes. And why stop at the wedges, put the finishes on irons too in an attempt to keep the spin consistent with the irons as well.

Of course they do. Grooves channel away debris and moisture to create clean contact.
And companies haven't stopped on wedges. Read the article on the home page yesterday regarding the new Cleveland release.

 

[-CRW-]

Of course they do. Grooves channel away debris and moisture to create clean contact.
And companies haven't stopped on wedges. Read the article on the home page yesterday regarding the new Cleveland release.

Right, but there is only so much the grooves can do when it comes to water. Testing from 3 different big testing sources have proven this now. Hydrophobic coating is the next big thing in spin consistency. I can't see any reason why you wouldn't want that tech on irons and wedges to promote as much spin consistency and as a result, distance control, as possible.

 

[McLovin]

There's been tons of discussion on wedge grooves over the past few years were some thought that wedge grooves were only to channel debris and didn't actually bite into the golf ball cover. Largely this opinion came from Callaway and comments made by "F'n" Roger Cleveland. I guess we've come full circle because now Cleveland and the JAWS wedge is designed to have the "most aggressive" wedge grooves in golf with extremely shape edges on the wedge groove edges designed to bite into the ball and impart more spin.

From Callaway:


I guess now that Callaway says it we can all get on the same page...even though many of us have known this for years.

where do you read in that excerpt from callaway that they are backing off anything they've said in the past? where does the copy on the site or what you quoted say that the grooves are designed to "bite into the ball?"

 

[-CRW-]

where do you read in that excerpt from callaway that they are backing off anything they've said in the past? where does the copy on the site or what you quoted say that the grooves are designed to "bite into the ball?"

No homerism please. There is more at the site, like making contact with the ball at 84 points. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the grooves are contacting the cover and that they are making them sharper to improve friction against the ball/cover.

As for things said in the past, I'm pretty sure you've posted in some of the ridiculous past threads. So no need for me to post links for you. Callaway is backing away from a lot of things they've said/done in the past, and in a good way. Seems like the ship is being righted from a path that was headed along the line TM took a few years back. But that's my viewpoint, from a non fanboy point of reference. And I like some of what Callaway does/has done, my son has Apex CF 19's in the bag. They've just made a lot of decisions that are head scratchers to a lot of people, but so do other brands so it's not unique to them.

 

[McLovin]

No homerism please. There is more at the site, like making contact with the ball at 84 points. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the grooves are contacting the cover and that they are making them sharper to improve friction against the ball/cover.

As for things said in the past, I'm pretty sure you've posted in some of the ridiculous past threads. So no need for me to post links for you. Callaway is backing away from a lot of things they've said/done in the past, and in a good way. Seems like the ship is being righted from a path that was headed along the line TM took a few years back. But that's my viewpoint, from a non fanboy point of reference. And I like some of what Callaway does/has done, my son has Apex CF 19's in the bag. They've just made a lot of decisions that are head scratchers to a lot of people, but so do other brands so it's not unique to them.

not sure how me asking you to clarify your hot take is tantamount to homerism. as to the attacks against me or this site, that's just not worth my time.

i've watched some of the recent tests as well. ping's coating has done well against some other oems in most tests. a test i saw from someone who i don't particularly care for had jaws with the best numbers.

spin has been such a focus, but if i understand the physics (which i don't haha) then a strike with a wet ball/face actually produces higher launch. so how much total performance are we losing if the launch and descent angles are steeper?

 

[PowerThrust]

Hydrophobic coating is the next big thing in spin consistency.

Hmmm, got me thinking about this...there are some really effective hydrophobic coatings you can apply to really anything.
I know that applying anything like one of them to a clubface would not last that long, but I think I might have to try/test something like this. Most of my weekend golf is played as early as possible and it's always wet, which makes spin control on short pitches/chips literally impossible...but may with a hydrophobic coating....

Would treating the face of a club prior to the start of a round be "legal"? I'm pretty sure treating a clubface during a round isn't (think Freddy Couples wiping his driver face on his own face)

 

[-CRW-]

Hmmm, got me thinking about this...there are some really effective hydrophobic coatings you can apply to really anything.
I know that applying anything like one of them to a clubface would not last that long, but I think I might have to try/test something like this. Most of my weekend golf is played as early as possible and it's always wet, which makes spin control on short pitches/chips literally impossible...but may with a hydrophobic coating....

Would treating the face of a club prior to the start of a round be "legal"? I'm pretty sure treating a clubface during a round isn't (think Freddy Couples wiping his driver face on his own face)

I've thought the same thing, but I doubt it since it alters the original design characteristics. But it would be fun to test.