You vs Tour Players - Scrambling #Own125

Interesting video and one I can relate to. I have not counted my own statistics, but I think it falls in my hcp level. Next season, lot´s of training time will be spent on short game!

Nate said:

I see your point however just in my last round I saw a player hit the fairway, hit about 10 yards from the green in some rough and proceed to take 4 chips and 2 putts for an even 8.

Did he have some holes where he got into some trouble off the tee, of course. But if one hits it into a hazard off the tee with an improved #UpAndDown they could save a high number and still get bogey.

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My last round out I had 6 OBs off the tee. I managed to keep it in the 90s mainly because I had 10 putts through the first 7 holes. But I also had a 30' (at least) putt that I drained for a 6 on a par 4. I felt like that was a wasted putt. I don't know why "saving" a double bogey feels different to me than saving par does, but it does.

JB said:

I read his post and dont see anywhere where he said that. In fact I dont see where he said anything of the sort.

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Your right, it was birdie. He said:

No one has ever birdied a hole because of a good drive.

-CRW- said:

I agree, I used that example since he said the driver doesn't set you up for par.

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-CRW- said:

Your right, it was birdie. He said:

No one has ever birdied a hole because of a good drive.

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These are two totally different things.
rtparty never said a good deive does not set you up...

JB said:

These are two totally different things.
rtparty never said a good deive does not set you up...

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When he says no one has ever birdied a hole because of a good drive, he is discounting the driver. Common sense dictates that a birdie is made by the totality of the shots played, I get that. However, it doesn't matter how good you are, but you are not making par on a hole if you hit your tee shot OB unless you are really good at holing out. You are going to struggle to make par if you hit a drive into any other hazard, and you will still have your work cut out for you if you hit a drive that puts you in a poor position.

like the video

LSMO said:

like the video

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Me too, that's why some of the hulabaloo confuses me.

Jman said:

Me too, that's why some of the hulabaloo confuses me.

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Why is discussion/debate hullabaloo here? I thought the sites motto was to get real information out to real amateur golfers? Not "blindly follow whatever is put out because someone says so".

-CRW- said:

When he says no one has ever birdied a hole because of a good drive, he is discounting the driver. Common sense dictates that a birdie is made by the totality of the shots played, I get that. However, it doesn't matter how good you are, but you are not making par on a hole if you hit your tee shot OB unless you are really good at holing out. You are going to struggle to make par if you hit a drive into any other hazard, and you will still have your work cut out for you if you hit a drive that puts you in a poor position.

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As I said earlier, you missed my point. I know I made it clear in my other posts. The driver is a crucial part of the game. Irons are a crucial part. Chipping and putting are crucial as well. I have made just as many bogies as birdies from great drives. A great drive is TOTALLY wasted with a crappy approach. I know that from experience. I actually wrote a book called How To Ruin a Great Drive.

But hey, continue to work on your game and get better. That's what all of us here are trying for! I know that for my game, 125&in is more important than my driver. That's me and my game.

-CRW- said:

When he says no one has ever birdied a hole because of a good drive, he is discounting the driver. Common sense dictates that a birdie is made by the totality of the shots played, I get that. However, it doesn't matter how good you are, but you are not making par on a hole if you hit your tee shot OB unless you are really good at holing out. You are going to struggle to make par if you hit a drive into any other hazard, and you will still have your work cut out for you if you hit a drive that puts you in a poor position.

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I think to a point, if you're focusing purely on extremes, learning how to drive the ball is very important.

But, take into consideration the margin of error allotted for each shot. Let's say for example I have a hole that has a fairway 50 yards wide, and a green that is 20 yards wide.

Driver: My miss with a driver can be more than 25 yards on either side and still be playable (assuming there's some rough before a hazard/OB/tree line. Let's say for the sake of argument anything better than 40 yards off the center line can be played to the green without anything being in my way.

Approach: Assuming there are hazards/bunkers etc around the green, the ideal miss is about 10 yards with room for a greenside recovery shot of around 15-20 yards. My margin of error by comparison to my tee shot is now cut by more than half (or 3/4 if you are a poor wedge player).

Scrambling: Based on some of the statistics provided, you'll need to get within about six feet for a legitimate chance of getting up and down. Once again my margin for error is fractured into a much smaller window.

Putting: There is no way about missing with a putter. I've heard of 'lagging for x score' but it still becomes a two stroke hole completion unless you're very proficient around the greens. Additionally, the quality of your approach will dictate fair opportunities to score (this is more geared towards the better player).

At the end of the day, if you're spraying the driver, you probably need a lesson (or the ability to pull a 3 wood off the tee to stay in play). For the rest of the golfing world, based on my above thoughts, I would imagine the goal would be to focus on where the most (actual) strokes are taken, which would be nearest the green and out. Again, it's a matter of opinion, but I think the video nails exactly how I tend to rate shot importance. I can't tell you how many times I've said "got away with that one" off the tee. That comment simply doesn't factor as I close in on the green.

-CRW- said:

Why is discussion/debate hullabaloo here? I thought the sites motto was to get real information out to real amateur golfers? Not "blindly follow whatever is put out because someone says so".

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Why do you always go back to the whole sheep thing man? Its kind of offensive to be honest. I completely understand your view point on this matter and we are obviously not going to "crown" a winner but I dont see why you always make it "us" against you the supposed voice of reason.

Awkward silence said:

Why do you always go back to the whole sheep thing man? Its kind of offensive to be honest. I completely understand your view point on this matter and we are obviously not going to "crown" a winner but I dont see why you always make it "us" against you the supposed voice of reason.

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Who crowned me the voice of reason? Not me. And I posted a comment for discussion and was attacked so it's hard not to say that. It's not just me and Arydolphin got some of the same treatment. He's been a member since 2009. If he sees it I think that's what some people would call "a clue".

And on that note, this thread has been officially closed.
Thought it could have been a good conversation, but for some reason the whole "us vs them" drama and played out garbage reared its ugly head.

Lets try to remember what THP is all about, civil, good conversation. If people cant be civil, then they will be asked to leave.