Is this a penalty?

TripleF

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Today, my golfing buddy was clearly taking a practice swing on the tee . . . but his club slightly clipped his teed up ball which went about 3 feet directly to the right!! We knew it was clearly a practice swing and ignored the error sort of like knocking the ball off a tee while addressing the ball. But we wondered if this would "officially" be a penalty or not. We believe "not!"
 
Today, my golfing buddy was clearly taking a practice swing on the tee . . . but his club slightly clipped his teed up ball which went about 3 feet directly to the right!! We knew it was clearly a practice swing and ignored the error sort of like knocking the ball off a tee while addressing the ball. But we wondered if this would "officially" be a penalty or not. We believe "not!"

I don't think it's a penalty, but I do believe it's a stroke. Play the 2nd shot from where it lies.
 
Since it is on the tee, it is not considered "in play" so that might help him. Maybe it's treated more like the ball just falling off of the tee while grounding the driver since it was not his intent to put it in play.

But that makes too much sense, so it must be wrong.

Or it might not.


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Not a penalty on the teebox, as clearly no stroke was intended, and the ball is not yet in play


see USGA Rule 11
 
Yah I thought that "intent" was needed on the teebox... even for the pros.
 
This came to mind. In this case, he took a penalty and replaced the ball.

i'm no rules expert, but wouldn't this situation be a penalty because the ball was in play? i didn't think the ball was in play on the tee box until a swing is made with the intention of making a stroke.
 
i'm no rules expert, but wouldn't this situation be a penalty because the ball was in play? i didn't think the ball was in play on the tee box until a swing is made with the intention of making a stroke.

That's why I don't think it's a penalty but a stroke. In the OP the club came in contact with the ball.

I can't find the video, but there was another situation the PGA tour where someone took a practice swing ON THE TEEBOX and their divot hit the ball. They were penalized.
 
yeah, I bumped my ball on a tee in a tournament and replaced it and proceeded to play the ball without penalty. The head of the rules committee for our club was there and saw it.

For those curious I made a legit snowman (on par 4) on that hole anyway.
 
This doesn't necessarily apply to a practice swing, but:

"A player makes a stroke at his teed ball and his clubhead just touches it knocking it off the tee. The player picks-up the ball and re-tees it."

Ruling: The stroke counted and the ball was in play when it was picked-up, so the player should have played the ball where it lay. When he lifted the ball, he incurred a penalty of one stroke under Rule 18-2a and was required to replace it. However, when the player made a stroke at the re-teed ball, he effectively played a ball under penalty of stroke and distance (Rule 27-1a) overriding the penalty under Rule 18-2a.
 
This doesn't necessarily apply to a practice swing, but:

"A player makes a stroke at his teed ball and his clubhead just touches it knocking it off the tee. The player picks-up the ball and re-tees it."

Ruling: The stroke counted and the ball was in play when it was picked-up, so the player should have played the ball where it lay. When he lifted the ball, he incurred a penalty of one stroke under Rule 18-2a and was required to replace it. However, when the player made a stroke at the re-teed ball, he effectively played a ball under penalty of stroke and distance (Rule 27-1a) overriding the penalty under Rule 18-2a.

I believe you are correct, if there was no intent i.e. was a practice swing therefore no penalty, then go ahead and re-tee. If there was intention to strike the ball and ball was struck even so slightly or even if ball is missed, it is a stroke and ball is played from where it lies. Rules experts....is this correct assumption?
 
I believe you are correct, if there was no intent i.e. was a practice swing therefore no penalty, then go ahead and re-tee. If there was intention to strike the ball and ball was struck even so slightly or even if ball is missed, it is a stroke and ball is played from where it lies. Rules experts....is this correct assumption?

this is correct, in the teeing area
 
That's why I don't think it's a penalty but a stroke. In the OP the club came in contact with the ball.

I can't find the video, but there was another situation the PGA tour where someone took a practice swing ON THE TEEBOX and their divot hit the ball. They were penalized.

i don't think swafford needed to replace his ball, just play it as it lay and count the stroke with unintentional contact.

but to op's question, no i don't think it's a penalty because there was no intent to strike the ball. under the rule quoted above, there was intent, just like if you whiff it's still a stroke but a practice swing is not.

again, i'm no rules expert and could be 100% wrong!
 
I always thought this was a stroke even as a practice swing.
 
No penalty!! I think!!
 
Is this a penalty?

No penalty unless there was intent to put the ball in play. If however it happened in the fairway or on the green then it would be a penalty. This happened to Bobby Jones who called a penalty on himself during one of his amateur tournament runs (can’t remember if US am or British Am) causing him to lose by one stroke. Intent does not have to be established if the ball is already in play


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Interesting opinions. They all seem correct to me . . . but they can't all be right!! This is a complicated game we play!!
 
No penalty unless there was intent to put the ball in play. If however it happened in the fairway or on the green then it would be a penalty. Bobby Jones called a penalty on himself during one of his amateur tournament runs (can’t remember if US am or British Am) causing him to lose by one stroke. Intent does not have to be established if the ball is already in play


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This is the correct answer.
 
Per USGA site:

Rule 18-2
Practice Swing Accidentally Moves Ball before Stroke on Teeing Ground
Q. Before making a stroke on the teeing ground, a player makes a practice swing and accidentally knocks the ball off the tee with the club. Is there a penalty?

A. There is no penalty as the ball was not in play. Additionally, the player has not made a stroke - see Definition of "Stroke." The player must put a ball into play from the teeing ground. (Decision 18-2a/19)
 
Interesting opinions. They all seem correct to me . . . but they can't all be right!! This is a complicated game we play!!

Opinions? I only see answers! :)

yeah, I bumped my ball on a tee in a tournament and replaced it and proceeded to play the ball without penalty. The head of the rules committee for our club was there and saw it.

For those curious I made a legit snowman (on par 4) on that hole anyway.

You got shafted.

That's why I don't think it's a penalty but a stroke. In the OP the club came in contact with the ball.

I can't find the video, but there was another situation the PGA tour where someone took a practice swing ON THE TEEBOX and their divot hit the ball. They were penalized.

Doubtful. You'd think the rules officials at the Tour events would know the rules well enough not to screw up something that simple.


i'm no rules expert, but wouldn't this situation be a penalty because the ball was in play? i didn't think the ball was in play on the tee box until a swing is made with the intention of making a stroke.

Correct.

Not a penalty on the teebox, as clearly no stroke was intended, and the ball is not yet in play


see USGA Rule 11

This.
 
Opinions? I only see answers! :)



You got shafted.



Doubtful. You'd think the rules officials at the Tour events would know the rules well enough not to screw up something that simple.




Correct.



This.
Boy you've sure contributed to this conversation

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Per USGA site:

Rule 18-2
Practice Swing Accidentally Moves Ball before Stroke on Teeing Ground
Q. Before making a stroke on the teeing ground, a player makes a practice swing and accidentally knocks the ball off the tee with the club. Is there a penalty?

A. There is no penalty as the ball was not in play. Additionally, the player has not made a stroke - see Definition of "Stroke." The player must put a ball into play from the teeing ground. (Decision 18-2a/19)

Sounds like using "good ol'" logic and common sense we came up with the right answer! Imagine that!!
 
To the OP. Not a penalty.


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i'm no rules expert, but wouldn't this situation be a penalty because the ball was in play? i didn't think the ball was in play on the tee box until a swing is made with the intention of making a stroke.

I think the key is the intention here


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It’s based on intent with this one


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