Loft/Lie Tolerances in Irons

tpluff

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Hey THP! Bear with me as this may just come out as a tangled mess of words of experiences mixed with a PSA.

I just had my irons, my beloved Apex that I was given as part of the original #Grandaddy back in 2013, measured for loft and lie at a local golf shop. It's been nearly 4 1/2 years since I was fit for a 2* upright lie in these irons and, surprisingly, my 7 iron that I tested with was spot on perfect on the lie board. I had not experienced any known gapping issues, but wanted to get them checked anyways as it appears they will be gamed for another season.

That being said, there appears to have been some consistent trends of movement the club heads have made in the length of time I have gamed them (please note, these came directly from Callaway so they could have come off spec, but I doubt it). For example, that 7 iron was only 1.5* upright and .5* strong loft. Nearly every single club measured 1.5* upright from standard (.5* short of what it should), while the 5 iron and AW measured a full 1* strong in loft, the rest less strong or on spec.

It got me thinking, with the loft jacking argument and everything surrounding that, are THPers getting lofts and lie checked on their irons? Are THPers aware that heads, especially forged iron heads, can experience movement through play or even come in off of specifications? If you do get them checked, or even if you don't, at what degree of difference from your specifications would you get the heads bent back correctly?

Curious to see everyone's thoughts.
 
Hey THP! Bear with me as this may just come out as a tangled mess of words of experiences mixed with a PSA.

I just had my irons, my beloved Apex that I was given as part of the original #Grandaddy back in 2013, measured for loft and lie at a local golf shop. It's been nearly 4 1/2 years since I was fit for a 2* upright lie in these irons and, surprisingly, my 7 iron that I tested with was spot on perfect on the lie board. I had not experienced any known gapping issues, but wanted to get them checked anyways as it appears they will be gamed for another season.

That being said, there appears to have been some consistent trends of movement the club heads have made in the length of time I have gamed them (please note, these came directly from Callaway so they could have come off spec, but I doubt it). For example, that 7 iron was only 1.5* upright and .5* strong loft. Nearly every single club measured 1.5* upright from standard (.5* short of what it should), while the 5 iron and AW measured a full 1* strong in loft, the rest less strong or on spec.

It got me thinking, with the loft jacking argument and everything surrounding that, are THPers getting lofts and lie checked on their irons? Are THPers aware that heads, especially forged iron heads, can experience movement through play or even come in off of specifications? If you do get them checked, or even if you don't, at what degree of difference from your specifications would you get the heads bent back correctly?

Curious to see everyone's thoughts.

I’ve never had mine checked, I haven’t noticed any huge gapping issues and honestly something like that is what it would probably take for me to even consider it.

I have heard that could happen with forged heads over time but it is Interesting that your clubs were all exactly 1.5* off.
 
Good point. No reason not to have your clubs checked for loft and lie. After all, it is the length, loft, and lie that matters...not what one or another manufacturer calls it. My 5 iron (27/60.5) could be strong, weak, upright, or flat, compared to someone else's. It is better to know what you've got than it is to rely on what it is called.
 
I’ve never had mine checked, I haven’t noticed any huge gapping issues and honestly something like that is what it would probably take for me to even consider it.

I have heard that could happen with forged heads over time but it is Interesting that your clubs were all exactly 1.5* off.

Let me clarify that they found that they were almost all 1.5* upright from standard, not 2* like I had ordered. Could be normal usage after 4+ seasons or could have been shipped wrong, I'm not sure. But found it interesting enough to share given the state of loft jacking arguments as some of them measured up to 1* strong from standard.

Also note, I didn't think that was enough to drop $5 a club to get bent back to normal so I am leaving it as I hit my irons really well.
 
I got a set from Srixon in December, when I had the shafts swapped out last month I had the guy check them for me and they where spot on. Stock loft, 1 flat.
 
I typically play forged irons and I get my loft/lie checked every 6 months.
 
Every set I've had checked has been 'off'. So, like Fupresti, I get mine checked every 6 months or so.
 
With the Apex irons being forged, the lies easily could have shifted a little over that time period.
 
Yes, that’s why I get checked and spec’ed every year


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I get my forged clubs re-bent after every season. They're usually .5* off in loft/lie.
 
Manufacturers use a tolerance of 1 degree plus or minus , which is you think about it could really be 2 degrees .

For your set to have been only 1/2 degrees off isn't bad after 4 years of use .
Something you should also think about is since it was two different people who checked loft and lies , you could get two different readings . It is all depending on if they are using same machine.

You could take your set to another place and see if two different people come up with the same results. What I'm saying is you could get two different folks check lofts and you might get two different readings . Some could be different specs on machines and some could be user?

Be glad it's only .5 off , hardly noticeable
 
Make sure your bender is giving the heads a good wack with a rubber mallet after bending so they stay in position. Here is a good video of a Ping tour. Watch at around or before 7:00 minutes where they show this when and explain loft and lie bending.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoH34rr9I8A
 
The tolerances are loose. I measure many of the sets I order for my members and customers, on a digital L&L machine. Doesn't matter whether it is a set of Callaway, TaylorMade, Titleist, or even PING(which used to really pride itself on accuracy). They are all often way off with little consistency. One head might be a degree weak, while the next is a degree strong. That can create huge gap issues....

It's really discouraging, but makes sense when you think about how many 100s of sets they build in Mexico every day just trying to pump them out as quickly as possible.

The forged irons are no worries as I just bend them to where they need to be, but bending a set of Steelhead pros or Rogue pros is extremely difficult.....

I used to believe that they actually tried to send clubs as ordered, but after measuring probably 100 sets now, I've lost all hope and pretty much have given up ordering forged sets "to spec" from the manufacturer and I just bend them to where they should be when they come in.
 
I had my Srixon's checked last fall when they were a year old and only the 8 iron was out of spec at 1* flat. All the others still measured 2* flat and lofts were spot on.
 
I always checked mine after buying. Bought two sets of TM irons back in the day with standard lofts and 2* upright. Not even close. Had to fix them.

The Srixon’s I bought about 1.5 years ago are the only ones I’ve seen come in the way they were supposed to.

Dax’s CF16s came in not correct too and had to be adjusted when he ordered those a couple years ago.

I think it’s fairly common and something that you should be double checking even though you shouldn’t have to.


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With the Apex irons being forged, the lies easily could have shifted a little over that time period.

I’ve actually found that forged irons are more likely to stay in place better than non forged sets. The non forged sets seem to want to move back to original settings and very often so it was around every couple months I’d have those fixed.


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I get my lie angles check once a season (every 6 months) and on average one might be off 1/2 degree from year earlier.
 
Loft/Lie Tolerances in Irons

Only set ive ever had checked was a set I bought off Rakuten from Japan - Srixon 945’s. They came in 100 % perfect to spec. That being said, I should have mine checked.


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I’ve actually found that forged irons are more likely to stay in place better than non forged sets. The non forged sets seem to want to move back to original settings and very often so it was around every couple months I’d have those fixed.


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Interesting. That is contrary to everything I have ever heard. So, from my last set, I should have been more worried about the RTX 2.0 wedges than the Z545 iron set. No local access to lie/loft machine so never had either checked.
 
Interesting. That is contrary to everything I have ever heard. So, from my last set, I should have been more worried about the RTX 2.0 wedges than the Z545 iron set. No local access to lie/loft machine so never had either checked.

Example for me, I had a set of TM Tour Preferred CBs (my favorite iron by them) and a set of the TM PSi’s. I had stock lofts and were 2* upright. Both sets would be all over the map after a couple of months.

Take my Srixon 565s, I’d check every couple of months and I might have a club or two that needed a little bump but nothing to the extent of what needed to be done with those non forged sets.


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I've only had the loft/lie checked on my irons once and it was a set of CF16's a couple years ago. Those were off quite a bit but I've never thought of it since. Even though my X Forged are new I should maybe get them checked.
 
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