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Want To Be A Pilot?

dhartmann34

dhartmann34

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An interesting new pilot training program being put together....

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/jetblue-wants-train-become-pilot-193254773.html

I find it interesting because I was just speaking with a pilot friend of mine that was telling me there is a
shortage of pilots due to many different factors, but most of them being it's expensive and difficult for the
trainees to get the required flight hours. This is an interesting way to go for airlines....

What do you think?
 
That's still a hefty investment by the applicant to become a pilot.
 
Pilots unions will never go for this. At first i thought it was some kind of reality tv setup... $125,000 to get into it... ouch.
 
Well when you look at something like Embry Riddle... It's actually not badly priced.
 
True, but i bet it would take a long time to pay that back, unless you go mainline, which it sounds like you'd go straight to JetBlue.... I think many struggle to make ends meet at a regional airline, so i think that would be a pretty tough pill to swallow.
 
Yeah, it was interesting to see this article after a pretty lengthy conversation about the whole industry with a pilot friend of mine on Saturday.
Very intriguing to hear some of the inside stories and the struggles of flight hours and such while training.

Girardcorp said:
True, but i bet it would take a long time to pay that back, unless you go mainline, which it sounds like you'd go straight to JetBlue.... I think many struggle to make ends meet at a regional airline, so i think that would be a pretty tough pill to swallow.
Click to expand...
 
If I was younger I would be very interested in this.
 
It's interesting that it's Jet Blue offering something like this. Jet Blue is a desirable airline and I don't think it has ANY problem filling its vacancies. It's the regional's that don't pay crap that are struggling to stay staffed. My gut is they are hoping to start a movement within the industry, because they can see that if things continue as they are no one will be entering. If you try to get into the industry right now, without military training you are likely to spend several years at or below the poverty line before you ever start making enough money to make it worthwhile. And that is after you pay the astronomical fees associated with getting your license.
 
dhartmann34 said:
Well when you look at something like Embry Riddle... It's actually not badly priced.
Click to expand...
Actually it's more expensive than riddle.. I went to Daniel Webster (same thing as riddle but New Hampshire... and better hockey) and for all the requisite clearances and licenses it was an extra $80,000 on top of your tuition (10k/semester)
 
dwchockey13 said:
Actually it's more expensive than riddle.. I went to Daniel Webster (same thing as riddle but New Hampshire... and better hockey) and for all the requisite clearances and licenses it was an extra $80,000 on top of your tuition (10k/semester)
Click to expand...

Yeah but you would go immediately into a reasonable paying job upon finishing, compared to years of struggling as a flight instructor then regional pilot.
 
Wake said:
Yeah but you would go immediately into a reasonable paying job upon finishing, compared to years of struggling as a flight instructor then regional pilot.
Click to expand...
ah, then that's not bad, didn't read the article as yahoo is blocked at work (stupid IT people) was just saying that $125k is not reasonably priced compared to riddle... but if that includes a guaranteed straight to regional pilot position, than it might be worth it...
 
Oh, when I looked on Embry's website it says Tuition is $33,826 per year for the 3 years and then $60k-$80k for flight costs/ratings/licenses.

dwchockey13 said:
Actually it's more expensive than riddle.. I went to Daniel Webster (same thing as riddle but New Hampshire... and better hockey) and for all the requisite clearances and licenses it was an extra $80,000 on top of your tuition (10k/semester)
Click to expand...
 
dwchockey13 said:
ah, then that's not bad, didn't read the article as yahoo is blocked at work (stupid IT people) was just saying that $125k is not reasonably priced compared to riddle... but if that includes a guaranteed straight to regional pilot position, than it might be worth it...
Click to expand...

Straight to JetBlue I'm guessing. Yknow if your an Airbus kinda guy. I'm going to stick with "if it ain't Boeing I ain't going.


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dhartmann34 said:
Oh, when I looked on Embry's website it says Tuition is $33,826 per year for the 3 years and then $60k-$80k for flight costs/ratings/licenses.
Click to expand...
yeah, but the actual flight costs/ratings/licenses is 80K, the other 33k/year (my school was 40k/year) is what is actually paying for your 4 year degree in flight operations
 
dwchockey13 said:
ah, then that's not bad, didn't read the article as yahoo is blocked at work (stupid IT people) was just saying that $125k is not reasonably priced compared to riddle... but if that includes a guaranteed straight to regional pilot position, than it might be worth it...
Click to expand...
I think it's straight to Jet Blue, not straight to regional. That is a huge deal
 
Wake said:
I think it's straight to Jet Blue, not straight to regional. That is a huge deal
Click to expand...
yeah, that's worth the extra $45k IMO... all day long, will make that back over the struggle of the years it takes to get there very quickly
 
Being a Pilot isn't what it used to be. My father-in-law and brother-in-law were both Marine pilots and then commercial pilots. My brother-in-law would pick a different career if he could do it over again but he's 50 now and will stick it out for another 10 years.
 
It's tough to become a pilot for two reasons: (1) FAA regulations make all parts on aircraft really expensive (and restrict innovation so most technology used is decades old...just compare experimental prices to TSO prices); and (2) cost of fuel.

To get your ATP you need 1,500 hours, that gets you to co-pilot. It's another 1,000 hours of co-pilot to get to sit in the captain's chair.

You can get 100 hours of sim time credited. Assume sim time is free (it's not) that gets you to 1,400 hours flight time.

If you want to fly multi-engine planes (and which commercial planes aren't multi engine) you need a minimum of 50 hours of multi-time.

That leaves 1,350 hours of single engine time and 50 hours of multi time.

For single time, assume you are super fuel efficient and burn 9GPH, that's 12,150 gallons of 100LL fuel at $4.65 (average price down here) = $56,497.50 in fuel.

For the multi, assume super efficient and burn 18GPH, that's 900 gallons of 100LL fuel = another $4,185 in fuel.

Total fuel bill is $60,682.50.

That's before you factor in the cost of the airplane (or the depreciation cost), oil, wear and tear, replacement parts, plus the 14 100-hour inspections required by FAA that you'll go through. If you fly all of the single engine time in a Cessna 172 that's $11,475 as a percentage of the overhaul costs of the engine.

So if it costs, conservatively, $72,157.50 just in fuel and engine alone, $125k is pretty good.
 
Yes. Used to be you only needed 250 flight hours to qualify for a position with a regional (or major) airline and now it is 1,500 hours. That is a lot of time towing banners or teaching students for $20-25/hour (and single engine prop time isn't really preparing you to fly for a commercial airline). If you get to a regional airline the pay is still pretty poor as well, you might make $30K per year. While I do believe there should be at least one pilot in the cockpit with a minimum of 2,500 hours in a regional airline I do think you can put someone in the RH seat with 500 hours without compromising safety - such as the captain must be in the cockpit throughout the flight.
 
HBirdman80 said:
It's tough to become a pilot for two reasons: (1) FAA regulations make all parts on aircraft really expensive (and restrict innovation so most technology used is decades old...just compare experimental prices to TSO prices); and (2) cost of fuel.

To get your ATP you need 1,500 hours, that gets you to co-pilot. It's another 1,000 hours of co-pilot to get to sit in the captain's chair.

You can get 100 hours of sim time credited. Assume sim time is free (it's not) that gets you to 1,400 hours flight time.

If you want to fly multi-engine planes (and which commercial planes aren't multi engine) you need a minimum of 50 hours of multi-time.

That leaves 1,350 hours of single engine time and 50 hours of multi time.

For single time, assume you are super fuel efficient and burn 9GPH, that's 12,150 gallons of 100LL fuel at $4.65 (average price down here) = $56,497.50 in fuel.

For the multi, assume super efficient and burn 18GPH, that's 900 gallons of 100LL fuel = another $4,185 in fuel.

Total fuel bill is $60,682.50.

That's before you factor in the cost of the airplane (or the depreciation cost), oil, wear and tear, replacement parts, plus the 14 100-hour inspections required by FAA that you'll go through. If you fly all of the single engine time in a Cessna 172 that's $11,475 as a percentage of the overhaul costs of the engine.

So if it costs, conservatively, $72,157.50 just in fuel and engine alone, $125k is pretty good.
Click to expand...

Well, it isn't just the FAA that is making parts expensive. I am often shocked at what Cessna charges for parts. I had a customer tell me that he had a pneumatic lift on his luggage door go bad. Called Cessna and they wanted $3,500 for it. He went to a local auto store and bought one for $40. He told me that at his age he didn't give a crap what the FAA would say about it. One of the reasons Cessna charges so much is that they don't want to support legacy aircraft, they want to sell new ones. Tank to someone who owns a 210 about some of the inspections they are now requiring for that airframe.
 
Won't work, I'm afraid of heights!
 
Many Asian Carriers do this already. Some of the regionals have started doing this up here in Canada. It's JetBlues prediction of pilot shortages. It is expensive however if you figure in its probably close to 80k just to get all your required ratings and licenses, it's not that outrageous. 80k usually only gets you a few hundred hours (with a commercial, multi- IFR rating) so if you get the required 1500 with this program it's not a bad deal. Most pilots get a starter job to get the required 1500 hours required for the Airline Transport License (ATPL).

JetBlue figures it can shape these young pilots into their structure from the beginning and get 40 years from them. They would then step into their Embraer jets when they get their ATPL.

I'm personally a fan of hiring from the regionals. I came from the regionals. It's an invaluable way to gain experience.

However, the regional system in the states is messed up. They need to start paying these guys more. I don't see this problem being solved any time soon.


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Mizunofan99 said:
Won't work, I'm afraid of heights!
Click to expand...

Funny, I won't go near a window in a highrise but I have no issues looking out of a window of a plane. I hate roller coasters but when I was learning to fly my instructor included spin training.
 
Chatting to some of our base customers that used to be commercial airline pilots, it seems these days, the money and fun is in flying the larger GA stuff.
 
Damn.

Too bad I'm old blind and have anxiety.

Otherwise I'd be all over this !

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