Do you want the Masters to allow the Flagstick to be left in during putting?

Do you want the Masters to allow the Flagstick to be left in during putting?

  • Allow players to leave flagstick in

    Votes: 54 54.5%
  • Scrap the rule during the Masters tournament

    Votes: 16 16.2%
  • I don't care

    Votes: 29 29.3%

  • Total voters
    99
  • Poll closed .
I voted "I Don't Care", because I'll be watching either way.
 
Play by the current rules. Let the player putting decide.


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It’s in the rule book that you can leave the pin in. Why change a rule for a week.
 
I agree with many on here. It's the current rule so it should be the players choice.
 
I vote stick with the current program.

Changing will be just one more instance where “the game” sends the message that golf is still stuck in the past, inflexible, rigid etc.


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I love the rule of leaving the flag in simply because of how much it seemingly bothers other people.

I wonder how pissed off some people are that there will be a women’s event there too.
 
I love the rule of leaving the flag in simply because of how much it seemingly bothers other people.

I wonder how pissed off some people are that there will be a women’s event there too.

I love that they are having a women’s event at AG, but unfortunately you are right, it bothers a lot of people. My wife grew up in southern Alabama and still has many relatives in Alabama and things are still very different in the Deep South. Things improve with each generation but women are far from having equality whether it’s AG or at the top of the corporate world.
 
Augusta gonna do what they gonna do. I say take the pins out, no other venue places a premium on putting like Augusta, nada, zilch, zero......love it.
 
Local rules imposed by tournament organizers happen all the time.

I think you are a little confused. The Rules of Golf give permission for specific types of local rules. Courses or Rules Committees are not permitted to do just anything they want. Where the flexibility is authorized by the Rules of Golf it is typically to account for local conditions that are unusual. Keep in mind that handicapping, course ratings and the Rules of Golf themselves are all designed to normalize things so that we have some basis for comparison and equal treatment.
 
This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Why do they think they are above everyone else?? So the rules should be changed just for them? They shouldn't abide by the rules of golf? Let's just make a set of rules for the snobs at the Masters.

Ehh. To each there own. My house my rules. Ask my kids:)

Their house, their rules.

I’m ok either way.

I doubt you’ll see anyone not play if they were to make a local rule to remove the flagstick. I don’t really care either way but it’s their tournament. If they make it a requirement that everyone has to play buck naked and only use a 2i, hey... It’s their house. I WILL NOT tune in if that’s the case but that’s because the rules of my house do not allow for naked 2i only golf watching on TV.
 
Ehh. To each there own. My house my rules. Ask my kids:)

Their house, their rules.

I’m ok either way.

I doubt you’ll see anyone not play if they were to make a local rule to remove the flagstick. I don’t really care either way but it’s their tournament. If they make it a requirement that everyone has to play buck naked and only use a 2i, hey... It’s their house. I WILL NOT tune in if that’s the case but that’s because the rules of my house do not allow for naked 2i only golf watching on TV.

My thoughts as well, AG runs that tournament & can do as they well please.

To the above comment about the women’s tournament there, I think it’s awesome.


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From a TV standpoint YES!...from a putting...ahhh that's up to the player...IMO downhill putts YES, Flag blowers at me, with the pin leaning...or closing the hole NO. I think looking at a pin interferes with my read of a breaking putt more than a straight putt.
 
Is there a rule that governs local rules; in terms of what rules can be modified by the course, for the course? Asking because I have no idea.

Regardless, I'm not a fan of 'local rules', though I understand they are in place to improve the pace of play. And, I do not believe modifying the flagstick option rule will have anything to do with the pace of play at the Masters.

https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/committee-procedures/rule-8.html

Specifically, there is a bullet point listed. "In order to ensure that play is conducted in accordance with the Rules of Golf, a Committee must not use a Local Rule to waive or modify the Rules of Golf simply because it might prefer a Rule to be different."

I'm no rules expert by any means but it seems to me like this applies in this circumstance.
 
I don't care, it doesn't matter to me, because I'm not a pro, and I will never play Augusta National. I'm sure that they (PGA and Augusta) will come to an understanding that works. That's their business.
 
https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/committee-procedures/rule-8.html

Specifically, there is a bullet point listed. "In order to ensure that play is conducted in accordance with the Rules of Golf, a Committee must not use a Local Rule to waive or modify the Rules of Golf simply because it might prefer a Rule to be different."

I'm no rules expert by any means but it seems to me like this applies in this circumstance.

I’m not trying to be contrary. I’m not a rules expert either. I try to know the ones that apply to me. But I’m still of the opinion of the “my house, my rules” applies-even if it flies in the face of the rules of golf. Like I so eloquently stated ( ?) they could make it a buck naked 2i only tournament if they wanted.

Another example, we play “around the house” golf at my house. We start at the junction box in the north corner of my property. I only have one hole and the par is 6. It’s probably only 200 yards long but the goal is to end up back at the junction box. Score is recorded when you either hit it with the ball or it goes between and under two pipes that form an “x” there. With floor to ceiling windows I adopted a very firm “no corner cutting” rule. So no flopping it over the house. Ever. Corner cutting might not only get you DQ’d but may have the lady Smiter chasing you with bad intentions, lol. A bladed wedge would be no bueno. My house, my rules, enforced by the Misses if there would be a horrible miss.
 
I’m not trying to be contrary. I’m not a rules expert either. I try to know the ones that apply to me. But I’m still of the opinion of the “my house, my rules” applies-even if it flies in the face of the rules of golf. Like I so eloquently stated ( ) they could make it a buck naked 2i only tournament if they wanted.

Another example, we play “around the house” golf at my house. We start at the junction box in the north corner of my property. I only have one hole and the par is 6. It’s probably only 200 yards long but the goal is to end up back at the junction box. Score is recorded when you either hit it with the ball or it goes between and under two pipes that form an “x” there. With floor to ceiling windows I adopted a very firm “no corner cutting” rule. So no flopping it over the house. Ever. Corner cutting might not only get you DQ’d but may have the lady Smiter chasing you with bad intentions, lol. A bladed wedge would be no bueno. My house, my rules, enforced by the Misses if there would be a horrible miss.

I think respecting the rules of the game generally means following the standards set forth by the R&A and the USGA as the governing bodies of the rules of golf.

The PGA could certainly decide they want to create their own rules on their tour events. A course like Augusta could be snooty enough to create their own rules for tournament play but then we verge on anarchy of the rules of the game.

If Fenway Park decided they wanted to change the rules for games played there that allowed a strikeout to only be 5 balls and 2 strikes that just wouldn’t fly.


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I think respecting the rules of the game generally means following the standards set forth by the R&A and the USGA as the governing bodies of the rules of golf.

The PGA could certainly decide they want to create their own rules on their tour events. A course like Augusta could be snooty enough to create their own rules for tournament play but then we verge on anarchy of the rules of the game.

If Fenway Park decided they wanted to change the rules for games played there that allowed a strikeout to only be 5 balls and 2 strikes that just wouldn’t fly.


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Yes but Fenway park is a park that is home for a team of MLB. Augusta National doing whatever suits them best, it’s not really a fair comparison. They could take a vote next year amongst their members that says “we’re not hosting The Masters anymore”. Or in my completely contrary post, “The Masters will be played with 2i’s only and buck-ass naked”. None of us want either of those things but it’s up to them.

Just like for Casa a-la- Smiter. Flop shots are allowed in golf. They are not allowed on my course. Sure, a skilled golfer could pull the shot off
99% of the time. But if you’re going to play the easy course, you’d just turn around and hit it into the junction box and get a hole in one every time.

If they mess with the rules too much (such as my 2i only buck-naked scenrio) no one will show for it. Well maybe Koepka, probably DJ too-he’d likely not know the difference, lol. I’m going to take a wild stab and say that if they say “flags will be pulled on the green at Augusta” they’ll have the exact same field as if they just go with the ROG.

I’m not saying I advocate them going against the ROG. I’m just saying that if they want to, it’s their house and they can make the rules whatever the heck they want them to be. They’ve made Caddies wear white bibs for as long as I can recall. That’s not a ROG, but caddies are going to wear them there or they’re not going to be there. If they want their flags pulled while on their greens, it ain’t that big of a deal.
 
Do you want the Masters to allow the Flagstick to be left in during putting?

Local rules imposed by tournament organizers happen all the time.

True. But there is a big difference between adding a local rule to the full USGA rulebook and selectively ignoring certain USGA rules. Moot point since Augusta announced long ago they would abide by all USGA rules.
 
Yes but Fenway park is a park that is home for a team of MLB. Augusta National doing whatever suits them best, it’s not really a fair comparison. They could take a vote next year amongst their members that says “we’re not hosting The Masters anymore”. Or in my completely contrary post, “The Masters will be played with 2i’s only and buck-ass naked”. None of us want either of those things but it’s up to them.

Just like for Casa a-la- Smiter. Flop shots are allowed in golf. They are not allowed on my course. Sure, a skilled golfer could pull the shot off
99% of the time. But if you’re going to play the easy course, you’d just turn around and hit it into the junction box and get a hole in one every time.

If they mess with the rules too much (such as my 2i only buck-naked scenrio) no one will show for it. Well maybe Koepka, probably DJ too-he’d likely not know the difference, lol. I’m going to take a wild stab and say that if they say “flags will be pulled on the green at Augusta” they’ll have the exact same field as if they just go with the ROG.

I’m not saying I advocate them going against the ROG. I’m just saying that if they want to, it’s their house and they can make the rules whatever the heck they want them to be. They’ve made Caddies wear white bibs for as long as I can recall. That’s not a ROG, but caddies are going to wear them there or they’re not going to be there. If they want their flags pulled while on their greens, it ain’t that big of a deal.

If MLB chooses to hold an event at a facility, let's use the recent games in Japan as an example, they will be played under the rules of MLB, not the rules of the Japanese league that is traditionally hosted in that stadium. If Augusta doesn't want to let their members putt with the flag in on their own private time that is their business but there is a general expectation that the USGA rules will be abided by when they host a PGA tour event.

What caddies wear at Augusta means just as much to the tournament as what ushers wear at Yankee stadium. They have no impact on the play of the game. They also have ridiculous spectator rules too that have no impact on the actual play of the tournament.
 
If MLB chooses to hold an event at a facility, let's use the recent games in Japan as an example, they will be played under the rules of MLB, not the rules of the Japanese league that is traditionally hosted in that stadium. If Augusta doesn't want to let their members putt with the flag in on their own private time that is their business but there is a general expectation that the USGA rules will be abided by when they host a PGA tour event.

What caddies wear at Augusta means just as much to the tournament as what ushers wear at Yankee stadium. They have no impact on the play of the game. They also have ridiculous spectator rules too that have no impact on the actual play of the tournament.

Patrons, good sir, patrons.

Silly arument(ish) that we’re having based on what Kay-Dee posted above. It’s already been decided.

And my point still is valid. If a facility in Japan wants to host a MLB event, of course they’ll play by MLB rules. This would be more like MLB approaching NASA and asking if they could play an event on the moon. If so, what does NASA want from it? If they want to invoke a “no called 3rd strike” rule, then that’s the price of admission. The USGA needs Augusta more than Augusta needs the USGA. If the Masters ceased to be tomorrow, Augusta would still be an absolute hallowed ground of golf. If the USGA ceased to exist tomorrow, Augusta National would still be the same and something else would step into the place of the USGA.

Japan baseball needs the MLB WAY more than Augusta needs the USGA. Would Augusta still be the same holy grail of golf without the USGA? Yup. Would MLB still be the same without going to Japan? Yup!

My main point is if Augusta were to decide that they want to bend a rule a little bit because, hey... they’re Augusta.... they have every right to do so. Their house, their rules. If the USGA were to draw a line in the sand, and say “ you can’t do that!” and Augusta drew a line and said we are because “ it’s our house, our rules.... “ Who comes out on top? We both know the answer to that.
 
Patrons, good sir, patrons.

Silly arument(ish) that we’re having based on what Kay-Dee posted above. It’s already been decided.

And my point still is valid. If a facility in Japan wants to host a MLB event, of course they’ll play by MLB rules. This would be more like MLB approaching NASA and asking if they could play an event on the moon. If so, what does NASA want from it? If they want to invoke a “no called 3rd strike” rule, then that’s the price of admission. The USGA needs Augusta more than Augusta needs the USGA. If the Masters ceased to be tomorrow, Augusta would still be an absolute hallowed ground of golf. If the USGA ceased to exist tomorrow, Augusta National would still be the same and something else would step into the place of the USGA.

Japan baseball needs the MLB WAY more than Augusta needs the USGA. Would Augusta still be the same holy grail of golf without the USGA? Yup. Would MLB still be the same without going to Japan? Yup!

My main point is if Augusta were to decide that they want to bend a rule a little bit because, hey... they’re Augusta.... they have every right to do so. Their house, their rules. If the USGA were to draw a line in the sand, and say “ you can’t do that!” and Augusta drew a line and said we are because “ it’s our house, our rules.... “ Who comes out on top? We both know the answer to that.

The closest parallel to what you are saying is when the owner of the Indianapolis Motor Speedway created the Indy Racing League split off from CART in 1996. 12 years later they eventually merged back together. Their split wasn't really good for the sport of open wheel racing in the USA and led to a big decline in attendance, tv ratings and interest. The south also thought they were better without the north in the civil war too. The correct answer is that they are good for each other and both sides are weaker without each other. Without a uniform set of rules for the PGA to follow, it would weaken the sport as a whole and in turn the prestige of the Masters would weaken over time.

The excuse for local rules should only apply for applications of unique hazards and conditions of the specific course in the same manner as certain MLB stadiums have specific rules that apply to ground rule doubles due to their unique layouts.
 
I don't have a want or desire either way, much like how I play wrt the new flag rule.

Whatever they decide, I'm sure to completely indulge, as usual, and greatly enjoy The Masters.
 
if they make up their own rules, is it still Golf?
 
Is there a rule that governs local rules; in terms of what rules can be modified by the course, for the course? Asking because I have no idea.

Regardless, I'm not a fan of 'local rules', though I understand they are in place to improve the pace of play. And, I do not believe modifying the flagstick option rule will have anything to do with the pace of play at the Masters.
That's my thought as well.

I will take the side of letting them do as they wish. I mean, there are many stupid local rules... why should anyone be able to stop ANGC from making a local rule in their tournament?

For the record, if I were running the tournament, I'd play the rules as they are and let the players choose.

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