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Playing with Slower Golfers

lightningbolt44 said:
O slow play haha. It gets me so hot when someone is super slow and Wont recognize it or insist they are not slow. Personally I think courses should monetarily fine a group causing rounds over a set time (five hours maybe) no one in that group wants to pay more and will be on their slow buddies. That said in order to do this courses would have to employ at least one if not more rangers that would TRULY monitor play not just ride around

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Mental note: take 30 practice swings and view every putt from 15 angles when playing lightningbolt.
 
I've been in situations where I was with a slow group and I have excused myself and moved on. Back in my college days I worked at a golf course and was an oncourse ranger. Usually when I saw slow play I would give a warning that they needed to keep up. If they didn't improve then I didn't ask them to skip a hole but I would pull them to the side and let the group behind them play through. Usually after making them let a group play through their pace would pick up.
 
I understand the course has the pace posted. Do they also have the diciplinary actions listed for breaking pace? Like speed limits. If you break the speed limit you know the consequences. I see a lot of course paces when I play but never something that says " two warnings then your gone with pro rated refund". I think if people know the consequences it makes situations that much easier to enforce..
 
You are on private property so they can ask you to leave, pretty simple. City owned courses the management can have the police or state park police remove you.
 
ntanygd760 said:
You are on private property so they can ask you to leave, pretty simple. City owned courses the management can have the police or state park police remove you.
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I like this idea. Probably would speed everyone up after the cops escort some slow folks off lol!
 
I think pace can be quite different depending on the course difficulty, distance between holes, hills etc. So I dotn know if 4hrs is so correct in many circumstances. I don't like long rounds as much as the next guy but to be honest I don't think 4:30 is exactly miserable. I wouldn't want it longer than that but when we finish in 3:45 I feel bummed my golf day is over. imo anything to 4:20 is not an issue to me.

I use to live in a place where weekend rounds were constantly 5-1/2 hrs and even at times more than that. If you finished under 5 you actually felt blessed that day. Just perhaps this is why I don't get so crazy annoyed at 4:30 and feel just fine with anything under 4:20. That being said I don't want to be and make sure I am not the one causing the 4:30 or even anything over 4 for that matter. My goal when I play is to have my 4some play in 4 if no one is in front. But have very many times played less even while golfing terrible and hacking it up all over. Which brings another point that poor play does not at all have to cause unreasonable pace so long as the person does whatever it takes to keep a respectable pace. Although, many times good players will always automatically blame the poor playing individual.

On the other hand I hate speed golf just as much as slow golf. I don't want to rush my golf enjoyment to be over.

But pace can be kind of funny in a way. there are days when it felt good and was slow and then days when it felt slow yet was very quick.
 
I love spending 6 hours on the golf course or more but I love golf. That said 6 hours better have been for 36 holes.
 
ntanygd760 said:
I love spending 6 hours on the golf course or more but I love golf. That said 6 hours better have been for 36 holes.
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Oh man, try arriving at every single tee box with a 4some still on it waiting for the fairway to clear and sometimes being the 3rd group waiting on several of the holes. been there, done that plenty times. This is what 7minute tee times can do not to mention a frost delay on top of it all and the starters squeezing in friends in between who had no tee times.
 
As many have said already.... would've politely suggested ready golf, done all I could do to speed things along and not cause any delay by my actions, then after the 2nd warning from the club I would've excused myself and moved ahead. Can't help some people.

EDITED TO ADD: while I respect attempt by the player in the OP's post to keep the group moving (rather than play ahead), I probably would've given up on that based on my "the only thing I can control is myself" general rule about life. If I've suggested politely a few times that we as a group need to pick it up and they refuse - at that point the best I can do is move on, make sure I don't slow anyone else down and let the club handle the slow players.
 
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It's a tough spot. I think if I was by myself I might have just pressed on. With guys in my league, I would try to get them going at a little faster pace. One thing that just frosts me is the guy who will walk to his shot while I get ready to hit. The problem is he just walks to his ball and takes nothing with him. I hit my shot and he is just standing there and waiting for me to drive his luggage to him. Take the cart dude! I can catch up while you are getting ready to hit etc.

If I am with strangers and we fall a hole behind, I start to get kind of introverted and walk ahead etc. It sort of ruins it for me. I do not want to be the reason someone (the group behind us) has a bad day on the course.

JM
 
tequila4kapp said:
He did everything he could do, but for leaving them. I think that's all he had left to do. I've left groups many times in situations like this.
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I have left groups as well before. It is the last result, but there are days when enough is enough. I have seen MANY slow players, but never one that would admit it, here at THP or in the real world.
 
More often than not, when I play with slower golfers it's because they are having a bad game rather than slow in the sense that their "routine" takes 2-3 minutes. If it's slow due to what seems like a half day deciding on a club and then fifty waggles, I will speak up.... and leave the group if it gets too bad.
 
I started golfing when Carter was President, and I was always told the norm for a round was 4:30.

The people I play with typically average around 100 for the foursome, and we almost always manage to play in the slower of 4.5 hours or the pace of the group in front of us. That said, there are days when we finish in 4:00 or 4:10 without compromising our game. I'm usually the guy who says, as we are walking off the first tee, "OK, so we teed off at XX:YY," which may or may not have been close to our tee time. We watch each other's shots, and if we can't find a ball in the woods or rough quickly (as in the group ahead is getting more than one open shot ahead of us), we drop one and count the stroke, to stay on pace. Every few holes, I'll say "Hey, we're a few minutes behind," or "Hey, we're a little ahead of pace. Good job." With strangers in our group, I keep the same approach, and not once has one of them complained. There have been a few times when two of us struggled, and a single or twosome said, " Hey, there's a little room ahead (not one hole) so I'm gonna go ahead." We understood and that was fine. The surprising thing is that if you start early in the round with the time check and saying "Ready golf" to strangers, there is surprisingly little pushback and more often than not, we stay on pace the entire round.

I can count on one hand the number of times a ranger has told my group to pick up the pace, and that includes times when I was golfing with my son when he was first learning the game.

If we're struggling to keep up with a faster group, and we see a group behind us waiting, we tee off on a par three, walk to the green (if we're lucky) and wave on through the group behind us.

I think rangers need better training and supervision. I see a lot of the buddy system at work ("My buddy's group is slow, but that's OK. He's my buddy.") I also remember waiting for the group ahead to clear after every shot from the third hole on. still finishing in 2:10, and being told by the ranger at the turn that we couldn't grab a hot dog and a drink because we played in 2:20 (and we teed off on time) and the group behind us had been waiting on every shot since the third hole. He said this with a straight face as we looked at the tenth tee, where two foursomes were waiting to be on the tee.

There's a point up to which deliberation speeds up my round, because I hit fewer and better shots. But don't look over a straight-in three-footer like it's a thirty-five footer over a buried dinosaur at Oakmont for the U.S. Open.
 
Tadashi70 said:
This hasn't been a rich mans game since TW came on the scene. The sport of golf is dying and the pace of play is going with it.
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Any chance you have this backwards? Maybe the pace of play is killing golf (among other things of course).

Aside from the obvious people that just take way too long to get ready, I honestly think that the pace of play would speed up considerably if 80% of the players moved up a set of tees. Playing a set of tees where players have a realistic chance of getting on the green in regulation every time will make a huge difference. That doesn't mean "If I blast a driver and step on a 3 iron, I should be on the green". I'm talking comfortable shots.

Just my two cents.
 
Reframmellator said:
I started golfing when Carter was President, and I was always told the norm for a round was 4:30.

The people I play with typically average around 100 for the foursome, and we almost always manage to play in the slower of 4.5 hours or the pace of the group in front of us. That said, there are days when we finish in 4:00 or 4:10 without compromising our game. I'm usually the guy who says, as we are walking off the first tee, "OK, so we teed off at XX:YY," which may or may not have been close to our tee time. We watch each other's shots, and if we can't find a ball in the woods or rough quickly (as in the group ahead is getting more than one open shot ahead of us), we drop one and count the stroke, to stay on pace. Every few holes, I'll say "Hey, we're a few minutes behind," or "Hey, we're a little ahead of pace. Good job." With strangers in our group, I keep the same approach, and not once has one of them complained. There have been a few times when two of us struggled, and a single or twosome said, " Hey, there's a little room ahead (not one hole) so I'm gonna go ahead." We understood and that was fine. The surprising thing is that if you start early in the round with the time check and saying "Ready golf" to strangers, there is surprisingly little pushback and more often than not, we stay on pace the entire round.

I can count on one hand the number of times a ranger has told my group to pick up the pace, and that includes times when I was golfing with my son when he was first learning the game.

If we're struggling to keep up with a faster group, and we see a group behind us waiting, we tee off on a par three, walk to the green (if we're lucky) and wave on through the group behind us.

I think rangers need better training and supervision. I see a lot of the buddy system at work ("My buddy's group is slow, but that's OK. He's my buddy.") I also remember waiting for the group ahead to clear after every shot from the third hole on. still finishing in 2:10, and being told by the ranger at the turn that we couldn't grab a hot dog and a drink because we played in 2:20 (and we teed off on time) and the group behind us had been waiting on every shot since the third hole. He said this with a straight face as we looked at the tenth tee, where two foursomes were waiting to be on the tee.

There's a point up to which deliberation speeds up my round, because I hit fewer and better shots. But don't look over a straight-in three-footer like it's a thirty-five footer over a buried dinosaur at Oakmont for the U.S. Open.
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I'm curious where it is you are from?
 
Wake said:
I'm curious where it is you are from?
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Started golfing in suburban Pittsburgh, but I've lived in the NY Capital Region (Albany-Saratoga) for 30+ years.
 
Reframmellator said:
Started golfing in suburban Pittsburgh, but I've lived in the NY Capital Region (Albany-Saratoga) for 30+ years.
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Interesting, I've never heard that 4:30 was the norm. I haven't been golfing near as long as you, but I do recall a rant from my old pro, who had been golfing since he came back from Korea, talking about how rounds keep getting longer. He recalled 3:30 being normal, and it kept getting longer NY decade.
 
Wake said:
Interesting, I've never heard that 4:30 was the norm. I haven't been golfing near as long as you, but I do recall a rant from my old pro, who had been golfing since he came back from Korea, talking about how rounds keep getting longer. He recalled 3:30 being normal, and it kept getting longer NY decade.
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Shows you what I know. I did a little Googling and four hours seems to be the "standard" pace of play, but there are a lot of qualifiers to that. This is an especially interesting article:

http://www.popeofslope.com/paceofplay/

There's a table in there that is priceless. Ever hear how 80% of motorists rate themselves as above average drivers?

How is your pace of play? Fast - 57.8%; Average - 37.4%; Slow - 4.8%
Most golfers' pace of play? Fast - 2.0%; Average - 41.8%; Slow - 56.2%

I guess I'm slow by the accepted norm, but I like to think I'm considerate enough to keep up with the flow and let others play through/pick up when I get in the way.
 
I feel that the proshop should be able to remove anyone and prorate their round for any behavior detrimental to the course which includes pace of play IMO. I feel as long as they are upfront about it in advance that no one would disagree. Maybe a reward system for acceptable pace could promote the other side as well, so the focus isn't entirely on the negative... something like a monthly drawing, for a lesson with the pro, or range tokens, for every round you keep at an appropriate pace
 
rallo said:
I feel that the proshop should be able to remove anyone and prorate their round for any behavior detrimental to the course which includes pace of play IMO. I feel as long as they are upfront about it in advance that no one would disagree. Maybe a reward system for acceptable pace could promote the other side as well, so the focus isn't entirely on the negative... something like a monthly drawing, for a lesson with the pro, or range tokens, for every round you keep at an appropriate pace
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Except if you are behind that slow group, you won't get to be in the monthly drawing.
 
I've been grouped up with slower golfers before. I won't lie, I've said, "Hey gents, mind if I strike out on my own? I need to get the back 9 done in about an hour and a half or my wife's gonna kill me." Which was true. I understand the sort of altruistic notion that if you leave the group they'll play even slower, but in my book if they're already not listening to the course marshal, odds are they're not going to heed the short guy 20+ years their junior in the bright pink polo.
 
rallo said:
I feel that the proshop should be able to remove anyone and prorate their round for any behavior detrimental to the course which includes pace of play IMO. I feel as long as they are upfront about it in advance that no one would disagree.
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This part I love. I dont think the reward system is even needed. Courses that are proactive about it would get more business from the people that are fed up with slow play (the majority of golfers) and they would know a course is serious. There is a course in Chicago area that we have hosted several events at and they are very serious about it. You get a long speech on the first tee from the marshall about how serious they are.
 
As a single that happens every once in a while. I just say something like "it was good playing with you but I need to catch an appointment so I'm going to see if I can get around a group or two in front of us."

Slow players suck.


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JB said:
This part I love. I dont think the reward system is even needed. Courses that are proactive about it would get more business from the people that are fed up with slow play (the majority of golfers) and they would know a course is serious. There is a course in Chicago area that we have hosted several events at and they are very serious about it. You get a long speech on the first tee from the marshall about how serious they are.
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I remember one time at Shingle Creek in Orlando, FL the group in front of us was pulled off the course due to slow play. It was great and they were so pissed bit was turning all the groups behind them into a 6 hour round.


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It's funny how the "norm" is established at 4 - 4:30 hr. round for a 4'some. However, If I got the right 4'some that knew what they were doing on the course (ie does not translate to low handicappers) and no one was in front of us, we would be done in 3:15 - 3:30 hrs.

Knowledge and awareness sadly everyone does not have.
 
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