Page 25 of 25 FirstFirst ... 1519202122232425
Results 361 to 375 of 375

Thread: Is pace of play *actually* hurting the game?

  1. #361
    @shaneb0t shanewu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    7,703
    Member
    38120
    Handicap
    13.8
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    26,177
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    6,679
    Thanked in
    3,165 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Molten View Post
    Support group started! I dig it
    haha yes!

    Quote Originally Posted by kevin81002 View Post
    I agree. I play with my older brother almost every Saturday. He's soooooooo slooooooow! Him and his regular partner are slower than molasses. But, it's either don't let it bother me and enjoy some time spent with my brother, or don't play. I choose time spent with my brother. It's an extra half an hour spent with people you enjoy being around. Not a big deal, and they're too old and set in their ways to change anyway. Hell they don't even think they're slow.

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    I think that choosing to spend time with our loved ones is the right choice for sure. And it's funny how many slow people don't think they're slow. I'm deliberate but I don't think I'm slow overall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tee/Ski View Post
    I'm with y'all on this. #3!
    Yes! When is the first meeting?!
    The #SweaterWar got me into The 2018 Grandaddy!!!

    #100Birdies10kLaughs #TheGrandaddy

    Driver: Epic Flash 10.5* w/ EF Green 55 S flex
    3-wood:
    Epic Flash w/ EF Green 65 S flex
    Hybrids / Irons:
    Apex 19
    3h/4h w/ Catalyst 70 S flex and 5i-AW w/ Catalyst 80 S flex graphite
    Wedges:
    54* MD4, 58* PM Grind 2.0
    Putter:
    Stroke Lab Three
    Ball: Chrome Soft Truvis (y&b)


  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to shanewu For This Useful Post:

    Molten (07-12-2019), PatsFan (07-12-2019), Tee/Ski (07-14-2019)

  3. #362
    Sultan of Santa Monica

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The City of Our Lady the Queen of the Angels
    Posts
    4,782
    Member
    20069
    Handicap
    a toddler
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    628
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3,039
    Thanked in
    1,440 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    I think cost is a major factor as well. Up until 3 years ago, people (everybody with jobs) lost a tax credit.
    But I think if we are going to take their word that its financial, its hard to ignore and not take the same word, that its less fun for people when sitting around waiting.
    I think cost has to be the #1 factor by quite a margin. The cost of EVERYTHING has gone up, yet everyone seems to be bringing in the same amount of cash as when things cost less. Less room in the personal budget for an expensive hobby, and you're going to play less. That applies to the casual player more than it ever will to anyone in this thread.

    It reminds me of 2008, the first thing to be liquidated in just about every family in my circles was the beach house (2nd home, summer house, whatever you want to call it.) These things are great, but when you need to trim the fat, they're pretty easy to put at the top of the list.
    ~Peter

  4. #363
    SoCal KiteSurfer Johan185's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    1,218
    Member
    24715
    Handicap
    20
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    3,168
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    469
    Thanked in
    287 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by tbanks5 View Post
    What course?

    Looks like admiral baker in San Diego

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    Camarillo Springs

    Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk
    Driver: M1 9.5* set to 7.5* VooDoo SVS 7 X Shaft 45.5" X-Stiff
    Fairway Woods:
    Hybrids: X2 Hot 22* Tour Green Graphite shafts Stiff
    Irons: XR Pro 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, PW, AW Tour V-90 Steel shafts Stiff
    Wedges: MP-T5 60*, 56*, 49* Dynamic Gold S300 Stiff
    Putter: White Hot Steel 2-Ball Putter
    Laser:
    Ball: Pro V1x

  5. #364
    Man Down
    Molten's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    7,218
    Member
    22040
    Handicap
    11.6
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    3,690
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    7,298
    Thanked in
    3,217 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by shanewu View Post
    Yes! When is the first meeting?!
    I think I’m going to have a test meeting tomorrow - playing a public course that might be CPO. I will have a real test.
    Whole new bag of clubs incoming. Hello and

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to Molten For This Useful Post:

    shanewu (07-14-2019)

  7. #365
    Major Champion Bucketsofjoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    North Arkansas
    Posts
    3,354
    Member
    18848
    Handicap
    7.2 USGA
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,850
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,486
    Thanked in
    898 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    Golf hasn't had constant growth discussions though. Up until this year, golf has been on a decline for years. Multiple places track number of rounds played. Courses opening and closing. Etc ETc. When those same places ask why these people are exiting, cost and pace are the two biggest factors.

    It's like asking someone what they had for dinner. They tell you I just ate a hamburger. Then someone else from across the room, screaming, no you didn't, you ate a salad. Then someone else saying "in my area, we don't have have hamburgers, only fast cars, taxes and elephant meat".
    I get it, and certainly after my partial round today I’m more inclined to side with the “slow play is killing golf” crowd.

    I just think slow play is the low hanging fruit in the “grow the game” discussions because no one will admit that they are the problem. If I blame it on that, I don’t have to address any of my own shortcomings - it’s literally everyone else’s fault but mine.

    It is a concern, for sure, but I don’t think it is really hurting the game to the extent that we are lead to believe.
    Bucketsofjoy
    WITB
    In my bag
    KING LTD 9° w/ V2
    KING LTD 13°
    Fly-Z Hybrid w/ VTS Silver
    Rocketbladez Tour 4-AW
    J15 54* & 58*
    Abbie
    Tour B XS

  8. #366
    Major Champion DG_1234's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Posts
    2,154
    Member
    38620
    Handicap
    2
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    836
    Thanked in
    611 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by pmm21 View Post
    I think cost has to be the #1 factor by quite a margin. .
    I don't think so. Greens fees at my home area courses are less now than they were 25 years ago.
    I think the "#1 factor" harming golf's popularity is that people find the game more frustrating than fun, and for that reason they are reluctant to go to the golf course.
    Last edited by DG_1234; 07-12-2019 at 11:41 PM.
    Driver: Ping G400 LST Graphite Design Tour AD IZ 6S
    Fairway metals: Cleveland Launcher HB 15* Miyazaki C.Kua 5S
    Hybrid: Cleveland Launcher HB 19* Miyazaki C.Kua 6S
    Irons: Ping G700 4-SW Project X LZ 5.5
    Wedge: Ping G400 58* LW Project X LZ 5.5
    Putter: Byron Morgan DH89 w/ putter grip

  9. #367
    In Search of a Dang Swing kevin81002's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    The IE, SoCal
    Posts
    8,375
    Member
    39197
    Handicap
    8.2
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    9,590
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    6,514
    Thanked in
    3,692 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by DG_1234 View Post
    I don't think so. Greens fees at my home area courses are less now than they were 25 years ago.
    I think the "#1 factor" harming golf's popularity is that people find the game more frustrating than fun, and for that reason they are reluctant to go to the golf course.
    And the other side of this statement, green fees where I live have tripled over the last 25 years. Courses that used to be affordable have long been plowed down to make room for tract homes. Equipment has gone up about 30% in the last 10 years.

    I understand what you're saying that more people would enjoy the game if they would learn to play the correct way. But therein lies another huge cost. What's instruction cost these days... 150+ an hour? And how many lessons would you say it would take for someone to be proficient in your eyes... say 20-30 minimum? So there's another 4500 bucks stacked on top of the 3 or 4 g's it costs to build a bag. The point I think you're missing is that most people on the course could care less about their score. They're there to socialize, entertain clients, or get some time away from day to day life. You, and the rest of us that take the game somewhat seriously are in the minority my friend. And I'm ok with that. I'll deal with some slow ass people no problem if it keeps my favorite golf courses open.


    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    Last edited by kevin81002; 07-13-2019 at 01:14 AM.
    TS2 8.5*, HZRDUS Smoke 60g 6.5 shaft
    Speedback 3w 14.5, GD Tour AD BB 7X shaft
    915F 5W, Matrix 70Q4 X shaft
    U85 23*, GD Tour AD UT 95X shaft
    Z565 5-PW, PX LZ 6.5 Shafts
    RTX3 Tour Raw 50, 56, 60, Tour 130x
    Fastback, SuperStroke pistol 2.0
    Handcrafted Experience 2016 with
    and THP
    THP Regional Rivalry: SoCal vs Norcal 2017
    2018 with THP,
    and Jamie Sadlowski

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to kevin81002 For This Useful Post:

    Johan185 (07-13-2019), pmm21 (07-13-2019)

  11. #368
    Major Champion chpar4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Southern New Jersey
    Posts
    4,487
    Member
    16520
    Handicap
    7.1
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    3,654
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,799
    Thanked in
    1,505 Posts
    Good arguments on both sides of the conversation. We have courses in our are that have a “slow play” rep and get avoided by serious players. Not sure how much that hurts the course but has to have some affect. They don’t get any $ from me. Anything over 4-1/2 starts to bother me. Our average at home course is 3:45 to 4 tops. Anything over that and I start to lose focus.
    On the other side, if a course has a strict pace of play policy it gets avoided by the casual golfers losing that revenue stream.
    Side note: below is a note from our men’s league Prez from Thursday. Half kidding, half brutal truth. We were try to beat the incoming weather due around 7 ish.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Rogue SZ 9* Synergy R FLEX
    Rogue 3+ Synergy S FLEX
    Rogue 4 HY
    Synergy S FLEX,
    Rogue Pro 5-AW C-Taper
    , MD3 52, 56 (BY ANTHONY TARANTO) 60 MD4
    7s #7 Oworks Red or Toulon Rochester MR or Toulon Garage Long Island

    Chrome Soft 18
    A15 Bag Tag from Callaway
    #IWEARCALLAWAY

    Rangefinder Compliments of

    All in a Fusion 14 Stand Bag

  12. #369
    Club Pro analyticandrew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    413
    Member
    40683
    Handicap
    13
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    220
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    131
    Thanked in
    86 Posts
    Haven’t been able to read this ENTIRE thread but I take it into account (pace of play) because of how I want to spend my day. I’ve got a wife and two kids, none of which play golf or want to learn. So when I take away time from them, it better be worth it.

    This is why I try and play the very first tee time out. No waiting for anyone, and I’m done by 10am at the LATEST.

    I also think the pace of play would be vastly improved by
    1: Marshalls - I cant remember the last time I saw on actually out on the course pushing people when there’s an entire hole open ahead of them.
    2: Education - things like “enter scores from the previous hole on the next tee box as opposed to at the green of the hole you just finished” or “put your cart near the back part of the green towards the next hole so when you clear the green, the groups behind you can start their routine to hit up” or “help your playing partners locate their ball before going to yours”




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    WITB
    Bag:
    Nexus II Cart Bag
    Driver: F6+ w/ Vista Pro 75g
    Hybrid: XR Pro 18* w/ 5.5
    Irons: J15 Dual Pocket Forged w/ DG S300
    Putter: RX-6
    Wedges: J15 Black Oxide 50*, 54*, 58* w/ DG Spinner
    Ball: Chrome Soft Truvis



  13. #370
    Amateur
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Cincy Metro
    Posts
    233
    Member
    47816
    Handicap
    15
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    55
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    70
    Thanked in
    58 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Bernoulli View Post
    I think the discussion does need to change course to be "what can golf offer someone who doesn't have time to play an 18 hole round?"
    That's an interesting change to the discussion. An obvious answer would be to play 9 holes.[/QUOTE]

    I think this is the question. A round of golf takes 4 hours to 4:15 with foursomes as the standard and 4 is the most common pairing that I see by far. Add the drive to the course, warmup and a drive home. 1 round is a good part of a day. Most millennials don't want to spend a day playing golf. That some groups can't get around the course in 4:15 just is the straw that might break the camels back.

    The issue with 9 holes is very few places are setup for it. In fact, most green fees are about the same.

  14. #371
    Sultan of Santa Monica

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The City of Our Lady the Queen of the Angels
    Posts
    4,782
    Member
    20069
    Handicap
    a toddler
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    628
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3,039
    Thanked in
    1,440 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Acesteve View Post
    That's an interesting change to the discussion. An obvious answer would be to play 9 holes.
    I think this is the question. A round of golf takes 4 hours to 4:15 with foursomes as the standard and 4 is the most common pairing that I see by far. Add the drive to the course, warmup and a drive home. 1 round is a good part of a day. Most millennials don't want to spend a day playing golf. That some groups can't get around the course in 4:15 just is the straw that might break the camels back.

    The issue with 9 holes is very few places are setup for it. In fact, most green fees are about the same.
    This is spot on. Pushing 9 hole rounds only works in some places. Perhaps the world needs more pitch n putts, and par 3 courses. I fell in love with the game on a par 3 where I was asked to play for a friends birthday. Had he asked me to play a full size 18 hole course, I would have declined. Not because of how long it takes, but because I didn't know what I was doing.
    ~Peter

  15. #372
    Major Champion Maric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    1,085
    Member
    47281
    Handicap
    100
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    865
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,387
    Thanked in
    566 Posts
    [QUOTE=
    2: Education - things like “enter scores from the previous hole on the next tee box as opposed to at the green of the hole you just finished” or “put your cart near the back part of the green towards the next hole so when you clear the green, the groups behind you can start their routine to hit up” or “help your playing partners locate their ball before going to yours”
    [/QUOTE]

    So how does this education take place? Where do golfers (especially new golfers) learn these things? Should all instructors include a pace of play "tip of the day", should courses hand out ready play tips when you pay your greens fees, should golf stores display how to speed up the game placards? I have been lucky to attend clinics on the course that include these tips, but how do you educate players?
    WITB
    All Women's Clubs
    Driver - Epic Flash
    5 Wood Rogue
    7 Wood - custom made Classic Swing
    4 - 6 Hybrid M4
    7-9, PW AW SW M4
    Putter - Red Ball
    Ball - Duo Soft OptiX, ERC

  16. #373
    Club Pro analyticandrew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    413
    Member
    40683
    Handicap
    13
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    220
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    131
    Thanked in
    86 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Maric View Post
    So how does this education take place? Where do golfers (especially new golfers) learn these things? Should all instructors include a pace of play "tip of the day", should courses hand out ready play tips when you pay your greens fees, should golf stores display how to speed up the game placards? I have been lucky to attend clinics on the course that include these tips, but how do you educate players?
    I think it’s the responsibility of the courses to do this. It makes the most sense. Print a quarter sheet of paper with tips. Hand out and say “we’ve got some tips to help with slow play we’ve been experiencing that helps everyone”.

    AND if you play with a group of friends, it’s also OUR responsibility to hold them accountable for slow play.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    WITB
    Bag:
    Nexus II Cart Bag
    Driver: F6+ w/ Vista Pro 75g
    Hybrid: XR Pro 18* w/ 5.5
    Irons: J15 Dual Pocket Forged w/ DG S300
    Putter: RX-6
    Wedges: J15 Black Oxide 50*, 54*, 58* w/ DG Spinner
    Ball: Chrome Soft Truvis



  17. #374
    Club Pro Chisag's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Chicago suburbs
    Posts
    366
    Member
    9562
    Handicap
    +0.7
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    105
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    418
    Thanked in
    188 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    Golf hasn't had constant growth discussions though. Up until this year, golf has been on a decline for years. Multiple places track number of rounds played. Courses opening and closing. Etc ETc. When those same places ask why these people are exiting, cost and pace are the two biggest factors.

    ... I remember a time not too long ago that booking weekend twilite was difficult at best and you had to book early or the times were you could finish ere long gone. Now, quite a few of my favorite courses to play here in the Chicago suburbs always have twilite openings on weekends and during the week you can just walk up and play with a foursome at twilite.
    F9 10.5*... Atmos TS Blue Blue 65s
    F9 15.5* ... Atmos TS Blue Blue 75s
    18* UDi 2 iron ... HZRDUS Black 85 Hys
    5-pw P760/4 iron P790 ... Recoil Prototype 95's
    SM6 52* F Grind /SM7 D Grind-SM5 M grind 58* ... Recoil 110s
    ... 6330 at 33"
    TP5x

  18. #375
    Major Champion malemotives's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Puyallup, WA., Spring Hill, FL
    Posts
    1,350
    Member
    20002
    Handicap
    GHIN 17.4
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    82
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    691
    Thanked in
    277 Posts
    Since ALVGC is pretty much a semi-private Golf Club, for Veterans and their guests, we take pace of play seriously but with a grain of salt. To start with, we don't have Tee Times. It is basically first come, first serve. However, I say "basically, because we train our starters to get to know the golfers and send them off in the most efficient groups. On crowed mornings I will alternates starts on Tee 1 and Tee 10. No twosomes or Singles before 12 noon. While we try hard to avoid slow play, we don't think it is fair to "RUSH" players beyond their ability. So.. we also train our volunteer Marshalls to know players and watch for potential bottlenecks. Few things irritate a golfer more than being on a good pace and scoring well and then having to WAIT. Our Marshalls look out for this and will pull a group aside to let faster players play through. On average our 5 1/2 mile course takes 3 1/2 hours... some finish faster.










Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •