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Thread: What are your thoughts on using AI in the golf world?

  1. #16
    Major Champion fuffle master's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckNasty View Post
    What other investments would Callaway need to make in AI? They already purchased the $5 million super computer required to perform such tasks, I’d imagine the only other investment/cost would be headcount-related with regards to engineers needed to develop simulation parameters.


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    There would be A LOT more into the costs than just the super computer. I would say the hard and soft costs to fully bring the product from R and D to consumer is much higher. Besides the additional engineering and software coding, you would need additional legal, additional prototype testing (due to the changing face for each club from the standard norm), additional feasibility studies, design planning, and many other factors while still using AI in its beginning stages of golf manufacturing. Eventually, like many costs, some of these items will decrease. However, since the technology is so new you have much higher costs involved that you would not have if you remove the AI concept from the manufacturing procedures.


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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuffle master View Post
    There would be A LOT more into the costs than just the super computer. I would say the hard and soft costs to fully bring the product from R and D to consumer is much higher. Besides the additional engineering and software coding, you would need additional legal, additional prototype testing (due to the changing face for each club from the standard norm), additional feasibility studies, design planning, and many other factors while still using AI in its beginning stages of golf manufacturing. Eventually, like many costs, some of these items will decrease. However, since the technology is so new you have much higher costs involved that you would not have if you remove the AI concept from the manufacturing procedures.


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    Would they not incur those type of costs using the traditional club-development techniques that other OEMs use and what they used prior to going the AI route? Wouldn’t prototype testing be cheaper than the historic approach as it is mostly being completely artificially now?


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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckNasty View Post
    Would they not incur those type of costs using the traditional club-development techniques that other OEMs use and what they used prior to going the AI route? Wouldn’t prototype testing be cheaper than the historic approach as it is mostly being completely artificially now?


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    Absolutely, would have similar costs. Just since the technology is new and moving from just a wood would have additional costs. Sure, if they did change anything and went with the same product if Epic Flash next year, then the additional cost would be minimal.

    Trying the new technology into other products, some successful and others maybe not yet would incur additional costs.


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    AI is the wave of the future and it’s not going away. I think it will be used in the development of all hard goods.
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    AI or not there are limits on what the manufacturers can currently do in regards to what is and is not conforming, I just don't see there being much actual improvement in tech for quite a while. That's not to say that adjusability, and being able to get fit better for a club can't happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alexped2393 View Post
    AI or not there are limits on what the manufacturers can currently do in regards to what is and is not conforming, I just don't see there being much actual improvement in tech for quite a while. That's not to say that adjusability, and being able to get fit better for a club can't happen.
    The same thing has been said for the 11 years of THP Existence yet we continue to see major strides.
    We even saw a change in actual testing from COR to CT, which yet again changed what could be done.

    And when we move past drivers, which is what most focus on, the materials and manufacturing of irons has seen such staggering improvements in forgiveness. From hollow body irons with proper CG, to weight shifting capabilities by using heavier materials such as tungsten more commonly to actual irons that are merely a shell to create weight in only certain spots.

    We are far from done in evolving process of design and each year we continue to see strides.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    The same thing has been said for the 11 years of THP Existence yet we continue to see major strides.
    We even saw a change in actual testing from COR to CT, which yet again changed what could be done.

    And when we move past drivers, which is what most focus on, the materials and manufacturing of irons has seen such staggering improvements in forgiveness. From hollow body irons with proper CG, to weight shifting capabilities by using heavier materials such as tungsten more commonly to actual irons that are merely a shell to create weight in only certain spots.

    We are far from done in evolving process of design and each year we continue to see strides.
    Totally get that designs still may have a way to go and the process in coming up with said designs may change, but I haven't seen a big jump in driver performance for 4-5 years, for me that is. I think the new drivers make it easier to get fit into something that may work for you but if you are already maxed out with 4-5 year old gear then that's it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alexped2393 View Post
    Totally get that designs still may have a way to go and the process in coming up with said designs may change, but I haven't seen a big jump in driver performance for 4-5 years, for me that is. I think the new drivers make it easier to get fit into something that may work for you but if you are already maxed out with 4-5 year old gear then that's it.
    Why would someone be maxed out?
    The only Max that currently exists is CT. Yet as we demonstrated in the THP Feature yesterday, speed at center impact is merely one aspect of distance. Distance is a combination of a number of things, with speed only being one of those numbers. While ball speed is still the king of those perimeters, it is still only one aspect. And I say this speaking only to drivers, where people seem to focus.

    Yet in the last few years, there is zero doubt that technology has assisted more distance with both spin design and aerodynamics. Now heading down the path is CT and how its measured, here is equipment expert Michael Vrska explaining that.



    That leaves so many other ways products can get better is impact locations for golfers are all different. Its why we struggle so much with the idea of telling someone Ball ABC is fastest, when that is only one part of the equation for distance (goes back to our feature yesterday on low compression helping a golfer). Just as telling someone Driver ABC is fastest, because that could be merely a product of length and weight.

    AI or no AI, there are still many areas of development that exist. We have seen irons come so far in terms of distance and forgiveness without any sacrifice in size. A great example of that is hollow body, and frankly its only the beginning on those designs. The future is so bright in weight manipulation across the board as golfers embrace the new technologies that allow engineers to shave here, add here, etc. Here is another great video with one of the smartest men in golf, Mike Yagley, talking with @ddec about driver design and how it compares to his time designing aircrafts with Boeing.

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    i think ai will definitely become the norm and impact all product lines, including soft goods.

    the ability to work through so many more iterations in a rapid fashion will lead to better performance. i think the tech can be furthered by ongoing testing of real world golfers to better understand swing faults, as well as continuing to improve the software.

    i really feel we are in the golden age of equipment designs. and i’m very grateful for companies who are willing to take these chances for the benefit of average joes like we are.


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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    Why would someone be maxed out?
    The only Max that currently exists is CT. Yet as we demonstrated in the THP Feature yesterday, speed at center impact is merely one aspect of distance. Distance is a combination of a number of things, with speed only being one of those numbers. While ball speed is still the king of those perimeters, it is still only one aspect. And I say this speaking only to drivers, where people seem to focus.

    Yet in the last few years, there is zero doubt that technology has assisted more distance with both spin design and aerodynamics. Now heading down the path is CT and how its measured, here is equipment expert Michael Vrska explaining that.



    That leaves so many other ways products can get better is impact locations for golfers are all different. Its why we struggle so much with the idea of telling someone Ball ABC is fastest, when that is only one part of the equation for distance (goes back to our feature yesterday on low compression helping a golfer). Just as telling someone Driver ABC is fastest, because that could be merely a product of length and weight.

    AI or no AI, there are still many areas of development that exist. We have seen irons come so far in terms of distance and forgiveness without any sacrifice in size. A great example of that is hollow body, and frankly its only the beginning on those designs. The future is so bright in weight manipulation across the board as golfers embrace the new technologies that allow engineers to shave here, add here, etc. Here is another great video with one of the smartest men in golf, Mike Yagley, talking with @ddec about driver design and how it compares to his time designing aircrafts with Boeing.

    I'll give the videos a watch tonight :), my views are only really from what I see when I go for a driver fitting. I haven't seen anything beat my X2 hot for me

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    I can't wait to see how AI changes the industry going forward. I really think it could be one of the most revolutionary additions the industry has ever seen. Think about how many models a computer can produce vs. the traditionally strategy. Callaway AI produce over 15,000 models/designs for Flash. That's crazy and it was for only one club. I can't wait to see what it brings to irons in the future, especially considering what advances have been made recently without it.

    Part of me believes that in the near future if your company doesn't have access to something like Callaway's super computer you're going to be left in the dust.
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    Major Champion wubears71's Avatar
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    It's a timely question for me. I actually have an IBM presentation pulled up "IoT Market Outlook and Insights."
    IMG_1337.jpg

    I started my new company all around Industry 4.0 and the Digital Transformation. A.I. is a major part of it. What we will start seeing is more technology like Arccos, where each and every golf swing on the course is recorded and processed in the cloud - in Arccos' case Microsoft Azure. These sensors will get smarter and not just utilize GPS - accelerator and gyroscope info will be introduced and pushed to the cloud. Before we know it, that data will be processed, analyzed and correlated and that data will be used to build a better golf club, help us with our big miss or help us get virtually fitted to a new set of golf clubs.

    There is so much cool stuff going on right now.
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  16. #28
    Major Champion fuffle master's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wubears71 View Post
    It's a timely question for me. I actually have an IBM presentation pulled up "IoT Market Outlook and Insights."
    IMG_1337.jpg

    I started my new company all around Industry 4.0 and the Digital Transformation. A.I. is a major part of it. What we will start seeing is more technology like Arccos, where each and every golf swing on the course is recorded and processed in the cloud - in Arccos' case Microsoft Azure. These sensors will get smarter and not just utilize GPS - accelerator and gyroscope info will be introduced and pushed to the cloud. Before we know it, that data will be processed, analyzed and correlated and that data will be used to build a better golf club, help us with our big miss or help us get virtually fitted to a new set of golf clubs.

    There is so much cool stuff going on right now.
    In terms of data being used for golf swings, the Callaway people were not on board yet. They didn't believe the AI incorporation of products like Arccos would be mainstream to most golfers for some time. I directly asked about Callaway and Arccos and they asked back how many actually use that type of software? I believe more golfers will incorporate the swing analytics in time, but I also think it will be some time before products like Arccos are mainstream in every golfer's hands.

    I do think AI is the way of the future, and will be surprised if we don't see the other OEM companies not incorporating the use of AI in club manufacturing over the next year or two.

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