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What is the future of the european tour

GlorifiedDonkey

GlorifiedDonkey

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I am a lifer caddie who started in 1995. I'm still walking in circles for a living but now ply my trade in California.

I spent a short time about 10 years ago caddying on the European Tour. It was a great experience, but as I watch the Irish Open this week, it leaves me with several questions. The Scottish Open is next week and the Open Championship the week after in Northern Ireland. Why are not more of the World's best players at Lahinch? Is it the money? The travel? The course?

South Africa, China, Australia and Saudi Arabia to name a few: European in name but not so much in nature.

What is the future of the European Tour?

Will it grow? Will it be taken over by the PGA Tour?

Thoughts please?:blob:
 
GlorifiedDonkey said:
I am a lifer caddie who started in 1995. I'm still walking in circles for a living but now ply my trade in California.

I spent a short time about 10 years ago caddying on the European Tour. It was a great experience, but as I watch the Irish Open this week, it leaves me with several questions. The Scottish Open is next week and the Open Championship the week after in Northern Ireland. Why are not more of the World's best players at Lahinch? Is it the money? The travel? The course?

South Africa, China, Australia and Saudi Arabia to name a few: European in name but not so much in nature.

What is the future of the European Tour?

Will it grow? Will it be taken over by the PGA Tour?

Thoughts please?:blob:
Click to expand...

The world's best players can financially afford to play a limited schedule, and the PGA Tour structure is set up to benefit the players who commit to it, so this has harmed the European Tour.
But I think the reality is that golf is not an especially popular spectator sport. Even some PGA Tour events suffer from lack of ticket sales and lack of tv ratings, especially when Tiger is not playing.
So the Eurpoean Tour, LPGA Tour, Korn-Ferry (formerly named web.com) Tour, Champions Tour etc... all suffer from lack of ticket sales and low tv ratings.
 
DG_1234 said:
The world's best players can financially afford to play a limited schedule, and the PGA Tour structure is set up to benefit the players who commit to it, so this has harmed the European Tour.
But I think the reality is that golf is not an especially popular spectator sport. Even some PGA Tour events suffer from lack of ticket sales and lack of tv ratings, especially when Tiger is not playing.
So the Eurpoean Tour, LPGA Tour, Korn-Ferry (formerly named web.com) Tour, Champions Tour etc... all suffer from lack of ticket sales and low tv ratings.
Click to expand...

I guess so. Its like a pyramid or even the shape on the Eiffel Tour! Money spiking to the top and the public only want to see the top top players.
 
GlorifiedDonkey said:
I guess so. Its like a pyramid or even the shape on the Eiffel Tour! Money spiking to the top and the public only want to see the top top players.
Click to expand...

In terms of ticket sales, t.v. ratings and more, Tiger was and is a game changer. After that, there is not significant fan interest or t.v. ratings for other top players such as DJ, Rory, Justin Thomas etc...
So really, the Euro Tour, LPGA, Champions Tour , Korn-Ferry have almost zero chance of big ticket sales or t.v. ratings.
I think the primary reason all these Tours stay in business is because there are enough corporate executives willing to have their company pay the $2 million to $8 million fee to sponsor a tournament (because those executives want to hang out with Tour pros for a week).
 
DG_1234 said:
In terms of ticket sales, t.v. ratings and more, Tiger was and is a game changer. After that, there is not significant fan interest or t.v. ratings for other top players such as DJ, Rory, Justin Thomas etc...
So really, the Euro Tour, LPGA, Champions Tour , Korn-Ferry have almost zero chance of big ticket sales or t.v. ratings.
I think the primary reason all these Tours stay in business is because there are enough corporate executives willing to have their company pay the $2 million to $8 million fee to sponsor a tournament (because those executives want to hang out with Tour pros for a week).
Click to expand...

True. I caddy for a lot of these corporates and it's a perfect tax break for the company, great exposure and like you say a chance to rub up next to the pros. I do think Tiger has created a false economy though and we must have seen the peak of the prize money. I can't see how it can keep rising!
 
I hope it never gets taken over by the PGA Tour. I enjoy the personalities on the Euro Tour much more than the PGA Tour and I probably watch more of it because it is more interesting to me. Not at all a fan of the PGA Tour stops that cater to egos and are set up to produce winning scores of 20 or more under par. Give me tall wispy or thick rough and gorse bushes to penalize wayward tee shots any day over the tame rough that is featured at Augusta National and many regular tour stops to challenge the pros and hold them accountable for wayward tee shots.
 
GlorifiedDonkey said:
True. I caddy for a lot of these corporates and it's a perfect tax break for the company, great exposure and like you say a chance to rub up next to the pros. I do think Tiger has created a false economy though and we must have seen the peak of the prize money. I can't see how it can keep rising!
Click to expand...

I have no connection to anything so my questions are totally agnostic (failure on my part to think of the right word).

Have the purses continued to rise over the past few years when Tiger didn't look like he was going to be a contender? Do they need to keep rising at this point or can they plateau to a point until there is a need to raise them?
 
I think it's great that the Euro Tour is becoming more of a World Tour. I believe the Euro Tour is doing just fine right now and will continue to do so for many years to come.
 
Sox_Fan said:
I hope it never gets taken over by the PGA Tour. I enjoy the personalities on the Euro Tour much more than the PGA Tour and I probably watch more of it because it is more interesting to me. Not at all a fan of the PGA Tour stops that cater to egos and are set up to produce winning scores of 20 or more under par. Give me tall wispy or thick rough and gorse bushes to penalize wayward tee shots any day over the tame rough that is featured at Augusta National and many regular tour stops to challenge the pros and hold them accountable for wayward tee shots.
Click to expand...

I can't stand the egos either. If you listen to our podcast you'll quickly get that! :bashful:
 
brianmk24 said:
I have no connection to anything so my questions are totally agnostic (failure on my part to think of the right word).

Have the purses continued to rise over the past few years when Tiger didn't look like he was going to be a contender? Do they need to keep rising at this point or can they plateau to a point until there is a need to raise them?
Click to expand...

I'm sure we will see a plateau soon!
 
This is a big question and one that does not bode well. As the LPGA are learning , golf is all about sponsors. Without them , you have nothing. In the last fifty years, the European Tour has been watching the US Tour and learning. Fifty years ago, club pros were playing tournaments, and only Jacklin and a couple of others were full time tournament pros in Europe. Slowly but surely, the European tour upped its game and the money and quality of golf rose. 95% of the way the European Tour is run is a straight copy of the US Tour ten years ago, sadly that includes the purses.

Meanwhile, the US Tour is not standing still and is happy to rip up the rule book to help the game in USA thrive. This year, they moved the Majors to accommodate the issues with the start of the NFL season. If that damages the European Tour, who cares? Their only objective is the growth and preservation of the US tour, no one else matters. And who can blame them. The modern golf pro will always be in debt to Arnie and the pioneers of the game in the 60's who made it possible to earn a living as a full time player. And that includes the guys who ran the US Tour.

The European Tour has a number of disadvantages over the US Tour which will always make it the second best.

1. Sponsors market - although the European Marketplace is the same size as USA, it has a number of currencies, TV channels ,languages and historic issues that make it impossible to get the same returns from sponsorship. Investing $5m in a golf tournament will hit a lot more customers in USA than Europe. And there are a lot more sponsors with $5m in USA than any one country in Europe.

2. Weather - nowhere in Europe can hold a golf tournament between November and March. Hence the need to go to the southern hemisphere or the less than stable Middle East/ Far East.

3.Golf World rankings - points mean entry to big events and Majors. Players like Molinari and Fleetwood find it easier to settle in USA and play there every week, making sure that they stay in the top 50 . Rose and Poulter showed them how and now they follow. Some like Beef do not settle, but a lot do. European sponsors moan that the top players are not playing Europe ,including the top Europeans. We know American players are not going to fly unless they need to, but the Europeans are just as bad.

There is a fall in prize money around the corner as the 2007 recession has not finished yet. When it does , purses will freeze, possibly drop. When that happens the European Tour will be in trouble...…...but not as much as the LPGA , which will need to go to Korea.

One thing that will help the European Tour will be the players . Every event on the European Tour has more players from overseas than the home country, unlike US Tour. Players go out for a meal in a strange country 100 nights a year, with other players. This is why they have such strong friendships compared to USA , where they in their own country and use room service. This is why the Ryder Cup raises their game more.

The European Tour will survive, but there are tough times ahead.
 
Great in depth answer!

I agree with most of what you say, but just a few things I don't.

I think there are issues for the European Tour with regards regular tv coverage (all the different time zones). People like consistency. I'm seeing that when it comes to our podcast.

The LPGA doesn't provide entertainment, so people don't want to watch. You never watch a tournament in the LPGA and think there are double and triple bogeys out there for the leaders on the back nine of a Sunday.

The golf fan in the US sees the same core golf courses year in and year out. The other tours move around too much.

I also don't think the Americans particularly care about the Ryder Cup. It's not a team sport! after all.

I think you pretty much answered the question though! Well done mate.
 
There are more time zones in USA than Europe, so the language is the bigger deal.

Americans only ever tell me the Ryder Cup is not important after they lose. After they win, it suddenly becomes A BIG DEAL.:friends:
 
I don't know. I don't think they're bothered about the Ryder Cup.

Europe doesn't have as many time zones, but the European Tour has a lot more!
 
Leftyuk said:
Americans only ever tell me the Ryder Cup is not important after they lose. After they win, it suddenly becomes A BIG DEAL.:friends:
Click to expand...

The Ryder Cup has always been an exhibition created to promote and create interest for the game of golf.
 
GlorifiedDonkey said:
I don't know. I don't think they're bothered about the Ryder Cup.

Europe doesn't have as many time zones, but the European Tour has a lot more!
Click to expand...

I agree with you. The Ryder Cup matters to US fans and players for about 2 weeks every 2 years. Win, lose or draw. For the Euro side it means so much more. We have talked to a number of players about that and whether that’s a good thing or bad thing, it’s definitely a “thing”.
 
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