Jmilla
Member
Sorry couldn't resist that song popped into my head when reading this thread lol
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I think of shaft testing in the same sense as wine tasting. If I go wine tasting I will of course tell the difference between white, red, producers, etc but there will be subtle differences that an amateur taster like me won't be able to distinguish. When testing shafts there will be differences between manufacturers, weights, etc but the differences between a oem made for shaft and tour shaft won't be noticed by 95% of the population.
Here is a review of the OEM Fubuki and ZT. Doesn't really tackle the "made for" vs aftermarket controversy but it establishes that the "made for" are still high quality products.
http://www.golfshaftreviews.info/index.php/mitsubishi-fubuki-z-and-fubuki-zt-golf-shaft-review/
For me the key part is this:
"The Fubuki Z is indeed a quality shaft, it is just not made in the Mitsubishi Japanese facility. While many of the great shafts of the highest quality are made in Japan, other production facilities around the world are capable of the same level of quality. And many have put in place stringent quality control standards that assure only quality products go out the door. What I have measured in the review samples of the Fubuki Z and ZT indicate this is certainly true on this line of shafts. Radial consistency of the Fubuki Z was 98.8% with a 0.7% standard deviation and 99.4% with a 0.4% standard deviation for the Fubuki ZT. These are outstanding numbers as they should be for a shaft offered in a driver with a rotating hosel. Shaft alignment is not a concern with these shafts. Shaft to shaft consistency is not the same as the awesome quality seen in the Mitsubishi Japan productions, but it is respectable."
I have no problem whatsoever with "made for" shafts, but there really should be some visible differentiation in naming convention from "real deal" shafts. I can't think of any other industry off hand where this is practiced intentionally
The intention is to make the buyer feel like he has what the pro's play, as it looks the same as the real deal. Many call non golf items like these: fake, counter fit, watered down, made for, not real, replicas.. This needs to change and industry leaders need to voice the concern
Yes, because you are thinking you are getting the exact same club that the Pros play. The OEMs, Dan! The OEMs are deceiving you! They are decepticons!Is an off the shelf driver 'watered down' because it's not tour issue?
The intention is to make the buyer feel like he has what the pro's play, as it looks the same as the real deal. Many call non golf items like these: fake, counter fit, watered down, made for, not real, replicas.. This needs to change and industry leaders need to voice the concern. OEM's rant about knock off' clubs from China yet they are knocking off their own shafts...
I can't handle it anymore. This is too funny.
How is a stock shaft "watered down", as you say? Is it of lesser quality? Does it not perform as well? Does it physically make the golfer worse? Do they cost as much as the real stuff?
Is this really even relevant now, or is the Aldila Rogue I/O I got in my Callaway 816 "fake" or "counterfeit"?
Seems like a LOT of companies, as in almost all, are ditching this practice and putting in great stock shafts, and a great number of no-upcharge shaft options for the consumer.
If it's not Tour Issue, then you are being duped in to thinking you are getting the same club the pros play. I mean, by all means, we KNOW a consumer never does their research prior to making a purchase to see if the shaft offering is suitable to what they want in a shaft.
Here is a made for OEM shaft. 2015 Aldila Rogue i/o 70x. Do you think a real deal one would do this?...no they would have a lot better radial consistency. This is why your shaft flex and flights change by rotating the shaft in the sleeve. This is a type 1 shaft or 1 spine, and its very dominant. Real deal shafts have more layers of material and are made with higher quality materials, all layered better to make a shaft that is round, or radial consistent. About a month ago my buddy snapped his made for shaft Rogue/Cally 816 4w at the tip just by a divot...they replaced it. Many OEM made for shaft I cant even test in my roller bearing spine finder as they crack then snap, its the flex pressure right on the roller bearing contact, never happens with real deal shafts
I agree with some if it works don't mess with it, if it does not, perhaps you should upgrade to the real deal while you can, and still have the receipt handy
If it's not Tour Issue, then you are being duped in to thinking you are getting the same club the pros play. I mean, by all means, we KNOW a consumer never does their research prior to making a purchase to see if the shaft offering is suitable to what they want in a shaft.
I was going to ask the same thing. He is obviously pushing his agenda by not testing a real deal shaft.Just wondering if you have the real deal, same spec'd shaft, to show in the same test?
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A high ranking and well respected golf instructor and club fitter once told me that some club manufacturers do a very good job of building clubs to the exact specs they are given, while others do notoriously sloppy work. So part of the deal when getting custom fit is on the fitter and part is on whoever builds the clubs. If the shaft isn't right, they don't have to use it.Isn't this the point of getting fit and having fitting carts. Also by name isn't the 661 and 665 you mentioned different shafts. Couldn't the shaft companies view an club manufacturer using a "made for" rouge stamped on the shaft as a marketing tool to sell the aftermarket shaft.
The amateur golf consumer who expects to get "tour issue" equipment.Who is the finger being pointed at, by the way. Is it the shaft companies or the club manufacturers?
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Why not sign up for a THP event with a shaft manufacturer and get the answer straight from them (like THP prides itself on)? There's quite a few this year. Maybe then this can be settled instead of constantly slinging mud around?Anyone who supports that look a like made for shafts are just as good quality as the real deal...are in the pocket of OEM's...
IMO: Anyone who supports that look a like made for shafts are just as good quality as the real deal...perhaps are in the pocket of OEM's...
Any Golf leaders working with OEM's in any way shape or form, need to apply pressure that made for shafts are are not disguised as real deal. You can have both, but don't try and fool the buyer he has what the pro's play by making the shaft look identical. Like that VW is a Porsche, regardless of how you drive it...
What leaders from THP are going to voice this concern...any?...were are you?...start a petition please
Again, are you blaming this on the club manufacturers or the shaft manufacturers?
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This is an interesting thread. For one most oems now offer the real deal off the rack and also have no upcharge real deal options so lets not apply logic from 5-10 years ago again. Things change people evolve and adapt to that change at their own pace.
Having a discussion about something is fine but the way this is being handled and the subtle shots nothing productive will come out of the discussion.
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