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What is it about handicaps?

PhillyV

PhillyV

Original Ass-Cap : G15' & G18'
Albatross 2024 Club
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Why is it every time a discussion (and most of the time it starts civil) about handicaps starts its not long before the fire starts? We are all amateur golfers, weekend warriors for the most part. Many of us have full time jobs and families that pull us away from giving all we can to the game. So why is it a stupid number that rarely comes into play has so much power when it comes to talking golf?
 
because sandbaggers
 
I think it is one of the only ways to measure yourself against others that you have never played against (not that it does not have its faults)
 
I think it becomes a sour issue because a lot of people take advantage of it. And it comes back to kind of the cartoon Dan posted. You don't hear about the story about the guy shooting one or two under his cap and winning. You hear about the guy who regularly shoots 8, 9, even 10 under his cap and wins things. As a low capper it's incredibly frustrating going up against something like that knowing damn well the guy who beat you deserves to have a much lower cap than he's holding. Do great days happen? Sure they do but they seem to happen a lot against low handicaps.
 
PhillyV said:
Why is it every time a discussion (and most of the time it starts civil) about handicaps starts its not long before the fire starts? We are all amateur golfers, weekend warriors for the most part. Many of us have full time jobs and families that pull us away from giving all we can to the game. So why is it a stupid number that rarely comes into play has so much power when it comes to talking golf?
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Ego. It's a supposedly objective measure of how skilled we are. It's an unavoidable reality that we suck to varying degrees.
 
PhillyV said:
Ok, sure. But in the end, what do they gain?
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A lot (to them). But I don't think my angst towards the handicap system is rooted in dudes lying to get ahead.. For the most part those guys are weeded out and alienated where I golf most of my rounds.. And I like that.

I'll expand shortly on my problems with the handicap system.
 
PhillyV said:
Ok, sure. But in the end, what do they gain?
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they wont gain anything from me, since I am not a betting man, but some people sandbag their ways into winning some money games and club championships.

I can see how some would be offended by that.
 
I think its weird to have a stranger ask you what your handicap is (outside of planning a tournament). Its like asking how much money you make or your religious preference. Some people like to feel like they are better than others and a glamour cap allows them to judge. If anyone ever asks me what my cap is I always respond with a "oh I just like to get out there and have some fun".
 
PhillyV said:
Ok, sure. But in the end, what do they gain?
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Trophies. Cash in some instances. Bragging rights. And a Bad Reputation.
 
tequila4kapp said:
Ego. It's a supposedly objective measure of how skilled we are. It's an unavoidable reality that we suck to varying degrees.
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I agree with you here. Ego is a big part of it.

If you got advice from someone that you never saw play and they gave you good tips or advice but then found out they are a higher cap than you would that change your thoughts about the advice you received?

Ego is a powerful thing and it can make rational people do irrational things.
 
it is tough for low caps i feel like a or 3 handicap is more likely to shoot high 70's rather then par and a 13 handicap is more likely to shoot low 80s rather then high 80s. so in a competitive setting the high cap seems to have the benefit.
 
people don't like to lose
 
I've been on both sides of it. I've played my ass off when getting strokes and I've played well only to get my teeth kicked in because I'm not a very good negotiator. Is what it is. That's also why I don't gamble large amounts of money on the golf course.
 
Great topic....

I think everyone wants an even playing field.
I am not happy with my handicap in the slightest, but it is a reflection where my game is currently.
All anyone can ask is to bring an honest handicap to the match.
 
Well from my experience people want to use them to brag on one hand and then take advantage of you if they play against you. There is just no consistency! Slope adjustments are supposed to help but my club doesn't even ask that question at our member guest tournament.
 
I think my biggest beef with handicaps (beyond dishonesty), are two man team matches. I don't really have a history of gaining strokes.. For an awful long time, my hard work nets me at most two strokes, but more often than not one or zero strokes against my opposition.. Which would be awesome if I was a birdie machine, but I mostly go out to make pars and let the balls roll in here and there for a bird.

What that essentially becomes, is a situation where my typical game (one or two strokes on either side of my handicap) is not have a genuine impact on the result of a match, especially when I am playing against multiple people. I like to call the harder holes 'spectator' holes if my partner is playing decent, because it usually means my par amounts to losing to net birds.

I've met a ton of golfers who are in between 8-18 handicaps who can par or birdie any hole out there... it's just that every few holes or so, they go wayward and blow it with a double or triple. When I play against two guys like that, with a partner who's playing marginally well, it seems like they dictate the match more than I ever can. Ham + egging 5 and 4 victories while I'm under par, despite them both still shooting above their handicaps. It has always left me feeling a bit like the experience is pointless because no matter what I do, they decide the match.
 
Sandbaggers get to feel good about themselves, all the while pissing everyone off that trys hard to be the best they can be. I have never seen the point of trying to be something your not, I for one would rather be the guy who is a 3 hdcp that has a bad day and shoots 85 than the 20 hdcp that shoots 76 and is called a cheater.
 
PhillyV said:
Ok, sure. But in the end, what do they gain?
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Money money money, although not much unless you sucker some skins game to give you a bunch of strokes
 
RNG said:
Well from my experience people want to use them to brag on one hand and then take advantage of you if they play against you. There is just no consistency! Slope adjustments are supposed to help but my club doesn't even ask that question at our member guest tournament.
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Ouch. They need to fix that. For ours, not only does each person/guest have to submit their index and 10 most recent scores, our club also keeps a spreadsheet of each person's scores for their rounds during the actual event going back several years. You might get away with it once, but that will be it.
 
For the most part I hate handicaps but that is the nature of the game to make 2 people of different skill levels to compete and give the player who isn't as good any chance. That said paying money to enter a handicap tournament is something that I avoid. (not counting thp stuff, that is different)
 
If someone wants to sandbag their way to win by all means they can have them. For me they get no respect and in my mind respect means far more than anything material or self ego.
Handicaps are a touchy subject partially because of how some get to the cap as well. In match play two 12s that play each other are not always equal. One may par and birdie 60% of his holes and Blow up the other few holes. The other 12 may not blow up but also won't par or birdie as much thus resulting in a loss. In their mind they played their normal game at their cap and the other guy was lying because depending on how the holes worked out they may have gotten blown away. In reality they are truly the same cap but in match play not all 12s are equal IMO.



Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 
PhillyV said:
Ok, sure. But in the end, what do they gain?
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They actually could gain a decent amount unfortunately. If cheating never got you anywhere, people wouldn't do it.

Money, trophies, sometimes equipment in certain outings. People cheat because it's the low hanging fruit that can win things for you. The people that do it also probably see nothing wrong with it, or at least don't feel bad, which will say a lot about them as people. However they still end up with the prizes and victories over others who were honest and worked hard.
 
Let me add onto my comments about handicaps in saying that I do not think team matchplay should ever be played at 100% handicap, or even 90% for that matter, and here's why:

If both players are playing to their handicaps, realistically they are only contributing to 50% of the scores for that match. I think a reasonable compromise is to play at around 75-80% of the individual handicap, because many of their 'throwaway' holes are handled by their partner in any given match. I still think it favours the higher handicap team, however it does require them to play bad separately to be successful which I like a lot.
 
why should a low capper be punished? it is easier for a 10 to get hot and shoot 75 than it is a 2 or 3 to shoot 67.

I like the idea of flights, play with in ranges with no strokes, then you see who the honest players are.
 
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