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Stop the destruction of The Old Course. Please sign this petition

Dr. Teeth

Dr. Teeth

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As many of you know, the aspect of golf that I love the most is the course itself. Well the R&A announced that they are making some big changes of The Old Course, including changing the most famous bunker in golf, The Road Hole bunker and some big changes to the 11th green to name a few. These changes are the same as of someone looked at the Mona Lisa and decided they didn't like her smile an out comes the Sharpie. Here is an article by Golfweek's Brad Klein addressing it.

http://golfweek.us2.list-manage.com...f9dfb9d400e405c5c8&id=e4afd8fb11&e=04a273be32

Please sign this petition asking the bodies responsible for this to rethink this destruction of golds most sacred grounds.

http://www.change.org/petitions/st-...the-home-of-golf-the-old-course-at-st-andrews

Thanks!

Stephen
 
All done.
 
I signed it Doc, thats deplorable at best. Thats one course that should never be touched. Just my .02
 
I read that the road hole bunker has been changed in the past. (made smaller) And I've seen the rest of the proposed changes and they don't look that terrible. I guess it's just me and I don't see it being that big of a deal. Are the changes really warranted?? No not really, but they're not overly big.
 
I was wondering when someone would start a thread on this. I, too, think they should leave the course alone. Dial back the ball. They used to have a ball for Europe and one for the USA. Between 1931 and 1990, both organisations differed on the dimensions of the golf ball which meant that the game played on either side of the Atlantic was similar but different.

Then, they both agreed on one golf ball. They did it before, they can do it again.
 
Petition signed! No change desired by this hacker.
 
There is a thin line between losing the integrity of a classic vs updating a course and making improvements. Hope they don't hurt this gem.
 
Destruction is pretty harsh, IMO. It's not like they're going in and adding a bunch of yardage to the course like Augusta National has done over the past 10 years. There are tons of people that want to say "slow down the ball, don't change the courses" but that horse is out of the barn.

For what it's worth, the R&A has to come in every so often and work on the Road Hole bunker anyways, because so many people get in there during casual rounds and try to get out, even if their ball doesn't go there on a normal shot (aka drop a ball in there and try to get out). I read a story a few years ago that the bunker had naturally gotten deeper because of people doing that, so they had to do some work on the bottom of it. So it's not hearsay to have work done on that bunker.
 
Canio said:
I was wondering when someone would start a thread on this. I, too, think they should leave the course alone. Dial back the ball. They used to have a ball for Europe and one for the USA. Between 1931 and 1990, both organisations differed on the dimensions of the golf ball which meant that the game played on either side of the Atlantic was similar but different.

Then, they both agreed on one golf ball. They did it before, they can do it again.
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I remember as a kid and shagging golf balls downstream from the local muni and occasionally finding 'small' balls. I forgot about the Euro golf balls of the past.
 
arydolphin said:
Destruction is pretty harsh, IMO. It's not like they're going in and adding a bunch of yardage to the course like Augusta National has done over the past 10 years. There are tons of people that want to say "slow down the ball, don't change the courses" but that horse is out of the barn.

For what it's worth, the R&A has to come in every so often and work on the Road Hole bunker anyways, because so many people get in there during casual rounds and try to get out, even if their ball doesn't go there on a normal shot (aka drop a ball in there and try to get out). I read a story a few years ago that the bunker had naturally gotten deeper because of people doing that, so they had to do some work on the bottom of it. So it's not hearsay to have work done on that bunker.
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This is worse than adding length, which they already did. This is expanding the Road Hole bunker, adding new bunkers and completely changing the 11th green once you start messing with the greens, that is where destruction begins.
 
I've signed. Thanks for posting this.
 
I will get on this tomorrow
 
Dr. Teeth said:
This is worse than adding length, which they already did. This is expanding the Road Hole bunker, adding new bunkers and completely changing the 11th green once you start messing with the greens, that is where destruction begins.
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The Road Hole bunker is being expanded by half a meter, which is just under 20 inches. If you can tell the difference in that, you're much more perceptive than I am.

Also, they are only changing a part of the 11th green, not completely changing the entire surface. However, the changes in the greens are much more of an impact than moving bunkers or expanding them. The GCA crowd is all up in arms about this stuff, but I don't think it's as big of a deal as some other people.
 
arydolphin said:
The Road Hole bunker is being expanded by half a meter, which is just under 20 inches. If you can tell the difference in that, you're much more perceptive than I am.

Also, they are only changing a part of the 11th green, not completely changing the entire surface. However, the changes in the greens are much more of an impact than moving bunkers or expanding them. The GCA crowd is all up in arms about this stuff, but I don't think it's as big of a deal as some other people.
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Damn, thats all it is 20"? One would think the sides seep in that far anyway and they are just moving them back out.
 
arydolphin said:
The Road Hole bunker is being expanded by half a meter, which is just under 20 inches. If you can tell the difference in that, you're much more perceptive than I am.

Also, they are only changing a part of the 11th green, not completely changing the entire surface. However, the changes in the greens are much more of an impact than moving bunkers or expanding them. The GCA crowd is all up in arms about this stuff, but I don't think it's as big of a deal as some other people.
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I'm with you on this. At this point in time I don't see it as any big deal. I don't see any of the changes effecting the charm or feel of the old course.
 
Next thing you know, they won't let you play with hickory sticks and percha-gutta balls!
 
Done. What a shame
 
arydolphin said:
The Road Hole bunker is being expanded by half a meter, which is just under 20 inches. If you can tell the difference in that, you're much more perceptive than I am.

Also, they are only changing a part of the 11th green, not completely changing the entire surface. However, the changes in the greens are much more of an impact than moving bunkers or expanding them. The GCA crowd is all up in arms about this stuff, but I don't think it's as big of a deal as some other people.
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Sorry, I totally disagree with you here Amol. 20" is quite a bit for that specific bunker and the amount that the 11th green is going to be charged is going I be substantial because they have to blend the slopes into the rest of the green. Thu are also adding two bunkers to the right of the 2nd green. All of this being said, the part that really bothers me is that The Old Course was supposed to be the one course that was off limits. Historically many of the great architects have said that they would not change a thing about the course. The other thing that is frustration is the manor in which these changes were decided upon and announced without any consultation with many of the experts. I suggest you read Spirit of St. Andrews by Allister MacKenzie and you will come away with a different appreciation for The Old Course.
 
Dr. Teeth said:
Sorry, I totally disagree with you here Amol. 20" is quite a bit for that specific bunker and the amount that the 11th green is going to be charged is going I be substantial because they have to blend the slopes into the rest of the green. Thu are also adding two bunkers to the right of the 2nd green. All of this being said, the part that really bothers me is that The Old Course was supposed to be the one course that was off limits. Historically many of the great architects have said that they would not change a thing about the course. The other thing that is frustration is the manor in which these changes were decided upon and announced without any consultation with many of the experts. I suggest you read Spirit of St. Andrews by Allister MacKenzie and you will come away with a different appreciation for The Old Course.
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I will look up that book, sounds like a good winter read.

However, Old Course is "off limits"? Doesn't sound like that was the case in 2004 with regards to the Road Hole bunker, as a quick Google search turned up this article: http://www.standrews.org.uk/News/News-Archive/2004/PREPARING-THE-ROAD-HOLE-BUNKER.aspx

In readiness for the Open Championship 2005, the Road Hole Bunker, the notorious bunker on the most famous hole in world golf, the 17th hole of the Old Course, is being made more difficult for golfers to avoid.

Following discussion with The Royal and Ancient Golf Club of St Andrews (R&A), it has been agreed that there will be no change to the height or steepness of the bunker face. The key change requested by the R&A is to extend the bunker to the west into a more oval shape so that it will gather golf balls landing nearby more effectively.

"We rebuild most of the Old Course bunkers before an Open Championship as a matter of routine. The Road Hole Bunker will retain its fearsome reputation and prove even more of a challenge to the world's best golfers," said Gordon Moir, Links Superintendent, St Andrews Links Trust.

Around 90 bunkers on the 600-year-old course are being rebuilt for the Open Championship, which is returning to St Andrews for the 27th time. Work is starting on the Road Hole Bunker immediately after the Dunhill Links Championship and it will be out of play until Spring 2005.
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I just hate to see iconic, historical courses be changed for the purpose of providing a different challenge for a specific group of people, (Professionals), during a few days a year. If they shred the course, (which they wouldn't do without the changes), so be it.

That said I understand that someone owns the course, (St Andrews Links Trust), and they can do whatever they want. If I owned a course and wanted to make a change I wouldn't really care what others thought.
 
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