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The Scratch Golfer Awakens

ShotScope
cbaker2882 said:
I hope you understand how you just showed there is 0 correlation between height and swing speed. Too many other factors in play means there is no correlation. Again, to have a correlation means it's correct in an if-then statement. If you are taller, then you swing faster. It's just not true. We're not robots.
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I am guessing that the rub is a language issue. Syntax. There may be a true correlation. But there may not be a true causation relationship.

For example. Every time I get out of bed the sun rises. But my getting out of bed doesn't cause the sun to rise.

Finding correlations is easier than proving causation.

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Johan185 said:
I would be within 10 yards of the pin on most shots from 150 yards. But I have been walking away with a 6 80 % of the time.

Chip and putt. New years resolution. Been hitting the practice green daily.

But it's too early to see any clear cut results.

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Keep it up on those practice greens, hope you find the right stroke for you. For me playing around the greens is one of the hardest shots in golf, being able to play all the situations you run into is a daunting task. Between club choice, where to play the ball in your stance, play an open club face or square. It can make a huge difference on your scorecard, just have to find the stroke first and work your way into the rest. Keep putting in work and good luck Johan!
 
cbaker2882 said:
I hope you understand how you just showed there is 0 correlation between height and swing speed. Too many other factors in play means there is no correlation. Again, to have a correlation means it's correct in an if-then statement. If you are taller, then you swing faster. It's just not true. We're not robots.
Click to expand...


Zero Correlation? Here's the longest driverson tour and their height/weight/distance
Bubba Watson: 6'3"180lbs 314yds
Dustin Johnson 6'4"190lbs 311yds
Rory McIlroy 5'10"160lbs 310yds
Andrew Loupe 6'1" 175lbs 308yds
Brooks Koepka 6'0"186lbs 307yds
Robert Garrigus 5'11"190lbs 306yds
Johnattan Vegas 6'2" 230 lbs 305yds
Charles Howell III 5'11"155lbs 304yds
Gary Woodland 6'1"200lbs 304yds


Only 3 of them are under 6foot, and they are only off by one or two inches at most.


Here's theshortest/smallest guys on tour (height&weight). You will notice a MARKED differencein their distance. The longest of this group is 5'10".


Jbe Kruger 5'5" 292yds
Brian Kortan 5'3"284yds
Mark Wilson 5'8"145lbs 258 yards
Richard Johnson 5'7"145lbs 267 yds
Mark Brooks 5'9"150lbs 255yds
Heath Slocum 5'8"150lbs 260yds
Kent Jones 5'8"150lbs 282yds
Ryuji Imada 5'8"150lbs 269yds
Nick Flanagan 5'10"145lbs 295yds


And yes, there's even anarticle in Golf Magazine on the subject, which charts out the players by height and distance, and comes to the sameconclusion.
http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/how-does-golfers-height-influence-driving-distance

The point of all this? IF you increase your swingspeed and distance, then it allows you to back off, swing with control, and have MORE ACCURACY - all while being longer. This will lower your score. A guy with a weaker swing that swings out of his shoes will be FAR LESS ACCURATE than a faster guy swinging with control. And there is plenty of information out there about how proper release increases BOTH accuracy and distance.

My point about swingspeed and distance, though was LAST on my list of things he should think about, and was begun with a "may" need to look at. Not first and not "definitely". His first priority is to take note of exactly where he misses his putts, to identify if it is misreads, aggressiveness, poor distance control, etc. that is affecting his putts. If he knocks every putt 8 foot past the hole, there's a pattern that he can work on addressing. If every lag putt comes up way short, there's a pattern he can work on. But he won't know until he makes note of it.
 
BluesManDan said:
Zero Correlation? Here's the longest driverson tour and their height/weight/distance
Bubba Watson: 6'3"180lbs 314yds
Dustin Johnson 6'4"190lbs 311yds
Rory McIlroy 5'10"160lbs 310yds
Andrew Loupe 6'1" 175lbs 308yds
Brooks Koepka 6'0"186lbs 307yds
Robert Garrigus 5'11"190lbs 306yds
Johnattan Vegas 6'2" 230 lbs 305yds
Charles Howell III 5'11"155lbs 304yds
Gary Woodland 6'1"200lbs 304yds


Only 3 of them are under 6foot, and they are only off by one or two inches at most.


Here's theshortest/smallest guys on tour (height&weight). You will notice a MARKED differencein their distance. The longest of this group is 5'10".


Jbe Kruger 5'5" 292yds
Brian Kortan 5'3"284yds
Mark Wilson 5'8"145lbs 258 yards
Richard Johnson 5'7"145lbs 267 yds
Mark Brooks 5'9"150lbs 255yds
Heath Slocum 5'8"150lbs 260yds
Kent Jones 5'8"150lbs 282yds
Ryuji Imada 5'8"150lbs 269yds
Nick Flanagan 5'10"145lbs 295yds


And yes, there's even anarticle in Golf Magazine on the subject, which charts out the players by height and distance, and comes to the sameconclusion.
http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/how-does-golfers-height-influence-driving-distance

The point of all this? IF you increase your swingspeed and distance, then it allows you to back off, swing with control, and have MORE ACCURACY - all while being longer. This will lower your score. A guy with a weaker swing that swings out of his shoes will be FAR LESS ACCURATE than a faster guy swinging with control. And there is plenty of information out there about how proper release increases BOTH accuracy and distance.

My point about swingspeed and distance, though was LAST on my list of things he should think about, and was begun with a "may" need to look at. Not first and not "definitely". His first priority is to take note of exactly where he misses his putts, to identify if it is misreads, aggressiveness, poor distance control, etc. that is affecting his putts. If he knocks every putt 8 foot past the hole, there's a pattern that he can work on addressing. If every lag putt comes up way short, there's a pattern he can work on. But he won't know until he makes note of it.
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Lag putts way short.

Short putts 6 feet or less way far.

Even sometimes 8' past the hole.

Lol

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BluesManDan said:
Zero Correlation? Here's the longest driverson tour and their height/weight/distance
Bubba Watson: 6'3"180lbs 314yds
Dustin Johnson 6'4"190lbs 311yds
Rory McIlroy 5'10"160lbs 310yds
Andrew Loupe 6'1" 175lbs 308yds
Brooks Koepka 6'0"186lbs 307yds
Robert Garrigus 5'11"190lbs 306yds
Johnattan Vegas 6'2" 230 lbs 305yds
Charles Howell III 5'11"155lbs 304yds
Gary Woodland 6'1"200lbs 304yds
Click to expand...

This is getting off topic, so we're going to have to agree to disagree on translating that information. The biggest thing here is that Johan has stated multiple times that his issue is putting and chipping around the greens. I don't think his SS should even be in his thoughts right now.
 
Please dont take this the wring way but is there anyway we could get a slight smaller font @BlueMansDave? Makes it kind of hard to THP at work when you can read it from 30 ft away and you have to scroll like three times to read one of your posts. Only a request.

Back on topic though. Johan how is the putting and chipping coming man. Get any short game lessons yet? We need to get out for another round soon as well, I need to see these MP-5s in action.
 
For distance control on putts, when you practice your putting, don't putt to a hole. Instead, find a level putting line, and drop a coin or stick a tee in the ground, and roll it as close to the object as possible.
When you've got that down fairly well at 2, 5, 7, and 10 paces (learn to pace off your putts to help judge distance) then, take a tee and place it 8 inches behind a hole, along the breakline if there is one. Now putt to the tee. Ball goes in with right speed.
This will help you get in the frame of mind that instead of the hole being a target to HIT, it is a spot your ball rolls through as you try to die it 8" past the hole.

With uphill putts, move the tee/coin further away from the hole. On downhill putts, move it closer to you.

I practice with Remo Tone Control Rings (I play drums some). $10 for 4 thin plastic rings, 10, 12, 14, 16 inches in diameter - you can get different mixed packs.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Remo-RemOs-...491553?hash=item54286d19e1:g:roYAAOSweuxWTypH
or here:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/drums-percussion/remo-remos-tone-control-rings/448912?cntry=us&source=3WWRWXGP&gclid=Cj0KEQiAtri0BRDLoaCF95e7o_sBEiQA_pgRQ6lHqvFRB6WP7_HBbFsT4y42Qi-IJLlzeCAjb1ZjfP4aAtgN8P8HAQ&kwid=productads-plaid^143146015722-sku^448912000000000@ADL4MF-adType^PLA-device^c-adid^91758813627

Place them various distances away and try to stop the ball IN the ring. They're very thin, so the ball rolls over the ring without changing direction or jumping. Better than a coin or tee.
 
Awkward silence said:
Please dont take this the wring way but is there anyway we could get a slight smaller font @BlueMansDave? Makes it kind of hard to THP at work when you can read it from 30 ft away and you have to scroll like three times to read one of your posts. Only a request.

Back on topic though. Johan how is the putting and chipping coming man. Get any short game lessons yet? We need to get out for another round soon as well, I need to see these MP-5s in action.
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Yes I am taking weekly lessons, but since we are mainly focusing on the major swing change, we have agreed to place the other parts of the game, which are very important on the back burner.

But with all the advice here I have been working on chipping and putting daily. So when we do get around to the short game I should be in a better place.

After my recent 133 score highlights. I have kind of put the MP5'S back in the closet. We are only dating on rare midnight rondevous.

But any time you like we can hook up for a game. I call her make sure she's out of the closet in time for our game.

But seriously you are more than welcome to take a few swings any time

But be careful if you Ponder you will buy. Don't get yourself caught in her Web. Like I did. Lol.

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Awkward silence said:
Please dont take this the wring way but is there anyway we could get a slight smaller font @BlueMansDave? Makes it kind of hard to THP at work when you can read it from 30 ft away and you have to scroll like three times to read one of your posts. Only a request.

Back on topic though. Johan how is the putting and chipping coming man. Get any short game lessons yet? We need to get out for another round soon as well, I need to see these MP-5s in action.
Click to expand...

Sorry about the big font. Sometimes I type a response in a Word program, and cut and paste it into the forum. For some reason it's popping up big on the forum. It's not like that in the Word program. It's not even the same style font that I type in. Weird. I'll figure it out.
 
96 today. Putting was the highlight again

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Have been putting in some serious work on my putting and have been pleasantly surprised by how quickly a hacker like me can improve.

I suspect that all my putting issues were secondary to neglect and inattention.

Mind you I haven't because a Sniediker yet. But since I was mostly hitting 3 and four putts per hole I'm very pleased to get off the green with only 2 putts and sinking a couple from outside 10 feet.

Now of course the big question how to keep your putter, driver, long irons, shirt irons, wedges and mental game sharp while you continue to develop your weak areas. Chipping and pitching from inside 50 yards, for example

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If I've read your posts correctly, your ball striking is a strength, and short game stinks, and you have ample power.

If you are playing whites or blues, you will be hitting no more than an 8 or 9 iron on your approach shot, right (maybe occasionally a 7), unless you are screwing up your tee shot (which your FIR indicates is rare for you).

Your practice routine should be mainly wedge/short iron work, just a few minutes on tee shots, and then finish with putting.

I'd suggest spending a bunch of time practicing with irons you rarely hit during a round could be time way better spent on putting/wedges.

I'm guessing with your power and FIR, you virtually never have to hit an iron longer than a 7 or 8 (unless it's a tee shot on a par 3, or you start playing the tips).

Lets say you have a typical 400 yard hole (I'm pretty sure you don't play from the tips).
265 off the tee leaves you 135 in. I presume, based on your description of your ball striking, that means anywhere from PW-9iron in.

If you play smart golf...the same would work on your par 5's:
Assume 500 yard par 5.
260 off the tee.
Lets say you hit your 8-iron 150.
Now you're sitting 90 yard out on your approach shot.

Playing whites or blues, at most courses, I don't think you ever need to hit a 3,4,5,6 and maybe even a 7-iron (although a lot of people like hitting a 7-iron and play it anyways).

Your practice routine should be really simple. Stop practicing clubs that don't contribute to your score.
 
UglySwing said:
If I've read your posts correctly, your ball striking is a strength, and short game stinks, and you have ample power.

If you are playing whites or blues, you will be hitting no more than an 8 or 9 iron on your approach shot, right (maybe occasionally a 7), unless you are screwing up your tee shot (which your FIR indicates is rare for you).

Your practice routine should be mainly wedge/short iron work, just a few minutes on tee shots, and then finish with putting.

I'd suggest spending a bunch of time practicing with irons you rarely hit during a round could be time way better spent on putting/wedges.

I'm guessing with your power and FIR, you virtually never have to hit an iron longer than a 7 or 8 (unless it's a tee shot on a par 3, or you start playing the tips).

Lets say you have a typical 400 yard hole (I'm pretty sure you don't play from the tips).
265 off the tee leaves you 135 in. I presume, based on your description of your ball striking, that means anywhere from PW-9iron in.

If you play smart golf...the same would work on your par 5's:
Assume 500 yard par 5.
260 off the tee.
Lets say you hit your 8-iron 150.
Now you're sitting 90 yard out on your approach shot.

Playing whites or blues, at most courses, I don't think you ever need to hit a 3,4,5,6 and maybe even a 7-iron (although a lot of people like hitting a 7-iron and play it anyways).

Your practice routine should be really simple. Stop practicing clubs that don't contribute to your score.
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Yes. Great assessment. You sure we haven't played a round together.

Do carry 3 iron or 4 iron. Only hitting 6 irons on the long par three's from the whites or Blues.

Mainly PW or 9 iron approach shots.

Seldom if ever even hit a 3w. Unless it's a really short par 4's.

80% of the time I'm hitting wedges 7, 8, 9 iron plus driver and putter. I hit a hybrid only if I screwed up my drive and need to lay up close to the hole.

So I only need to have 8 clubs plus the putter sharp to score based on your assessment. And the chipping and pitching could be played 80% of the time with a SW or LW.

This focus until I'm consistently in the 80' s should allow me to lower my handicap by more than a few strokes.

Thanks.

Again this advice can easily be applied by many other Hacker's. Figure out your 6 or 7 clubs you play 80 % of the time and focus on those and your putting and short game. If you're getting to the low 80' s. Then a different plan can be enlisted.



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Hey, I'd like to recommend a book that will help you with your putting. "Expert Putting: The Science Behind the Stroke" by Chris Riddoch. He has another book I recommend also, "The Golf Swing: It's Easier Than You Think". I read both this past week, and put what he says into practice. Shot a 75 in the cold and the mud. 71% FIR, 61% GIR, 1.83 putts per hole. Did poorly on my scrambling, though... it's hard to pitch out of the mud. Whatever the case, he explains everything so clearly, especially the mental aspect of the game - especially the mental aspect of PUTTING - and it made so much difference for me. I was doing a lot of things wrong that I didn't know or understand! And I've been playing golf for 30 years. Anyway, I've been shooting in the low to mid 80's lately, and have especially been struggling with my lag putting. Walked away with a 75 today and lagged really well. His books were good medicine for me. Started off the day by dropping a 23 foot birdie. My longest putt was 54 foot, and though I misread it, my speed was dead on, so I was able to two putt it.

They took about 3 hours a piece to read. Got them FREE on Amazon with a free trial of Kindle Unlimited. The best liitle books on golf I've read, and I've read a LOT of golf books.
 
BluesManDan said:
Hey, I'd like to recommend a book that will help you with your putting. "Expert Putting: The Science Behind the Stroke" by Chris Riddoch. He has another book I recommend also, "The Golf Swing: It's Easier Than You Think". I read both this past week, and put what he says into practice. Shot a 75 in the cold and the mud. 71% FIR, 61% GIR, 1.83 putts per hole. Did poorly on my scrambling, though... it's hard to pitch out of the mud. Whatever the case, he explains everything so clearly, especially the mental aspect of the game - especially the mental aspect of PUTTING - and it made so much difference for me. I was doing a lot of things wrong that I didn't know or understand! And I've been playing golf for 30 years. Anyway, I've been shooting in the low to mid 80's lately, and have especially been struggling with my lag putting. Walked away with a 75 today and lagged really well. His books were good medicine for me. Started off the day by dropping a 23 foot birdie. My longest putt was 54 foot, and though I misread it, my speed was dead on, so I was able to two putt it.

They took about 3 hours a piece to read. Got them FREE on Amazon with a free trial of Kindle Unlimited. The best liitle books on golf I've read, and I've read a LOT of golf books.
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Will definitely follow your advice

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Johan185 said:
Yes I am taking weekly lessons, but since we are mainly focusing on the major swing change, we have agreed to place the other parts of the game, which are very important on the back burner.

But with all the advice here I have been working on chipping and putting daily. So when we do get around to the short game I should be in a better place.

After my recent 133 score highlights. I have kind of put the MP5'S back in the closet. We are only dating on rare midnight rondevous.

But any time you like we can hook up for a game. I call her make sure she's out of the closet in time for our game.

But seriously you are more than welcome to take a few swings any time

But be careful if you Ponder you will buy. Don't get yourself caught in her Web. Like I did. Lol.

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Click to expand...

Did you actually shot a 133 ?!
 
Johan185 said:
Yes sir. Lol. And I counted every shot.

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Sorry to hear that... Was there a domestic between you and the mp-5s after the round?


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Lol. She filed for a restraining order. Lol

But the blame rest on the Indian not the Bow or the Arrow

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BluesManDan said:
Hey, I'd like to recommend a book that will help you with your putting. "Expert Putting: The Science Behind the Stroke" by Chris Riddoch. He has another book I recommend also, "The Golf Swing: It's Easier Than You Think". I read both this past week, and put what he says into practice. Shot a 75 in the cold and the mud. 71% FIR, 61% GIR, 1.83 putts per hole. Did poorly on my scrambling, though... it's hard to pitch out of the mud. Whatever the case, he explains everything so clearly, especially the mental aspect of the game - especially the mental aspect of PUTTING - and it made so much difference for me. I was doing a lot of things wrong that I didn't know or understand! And I've been playing golf for 30 years. Anyway, I've been shooting in the low to mid 80's lately, and have especially been struggling with my lag putting. Walked away with a 75 today and lagged really well. His books were good medicine for me. Started off the day by dropping a 23 foot birdie. My longest putt was 54 foot, and though I misread it, my speed was dead on, so I was able to two putt it.

They took about 3 hours a piece to read. Got them FREE on Amazon with a free trial of Kindle Unlimited. The best liitle books on golf I've read, and I've read a LOT of golf books.
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Just finished the putting book. Thanks. Great read and putting advice.

Can't wait to put it in play

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Johan185 said:
Just finished the putting book. Thanks. Great read and putting advice.

Can't wait to put it in play

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Glad you liked it. Just so you know, I spent about 3 hours working on the techniques he proposed... visualizing the putt, letting the right brain takeover. When I went out and played, I had a lot of putts that once I hit them, I thought, "Oh no, it's gonna be way short!" but nope, they rolled the right distance. I'm so used to ramming them at the hole.
 
BluesManDan said:
Glad you liked it. Just so you know, I spent about 3 hours working on the techniques he proposed... visualizing the putt, letting the right brain takeover. When I went out and played, I had a lot of putts that once I hit them, I thought, "Oh no, it's gonna be way short!" but nope, they rolled the right distance. I'm so used to ramming them at the hole.
Click to expand...
Is his full swing book on amazon also

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Johan185 said:
Is his full swing book on amazon also

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Click to expand...

Yep. And free with kindle unlimited.


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BluesManDan said:
Yep. And free with kindle unlimited.


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Will be busy reading tonight. Thanks

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