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- #151
The Euro tour owns the rights to the Ryder Cup when it's on their soil. The profits are put right back into their tour and development tour.
I have no idea where the profits go for the PGA when on US soil.
Mickelson vs Watson
The Euro tour owns the rights to the Ryder Cup when it's on their soil. The profits are put right back into their tour and development tour.
I have no idea where the profits go for the PGA when on US soil.
jhstew1
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I believe he wanted $$ to go to charity not in his pocket
deuce
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Bad spots as "bad spots for their particular partner" or just bad spots in general? If the former, I think giving players a year to get to know their partners weaknesses and strengths would help tremendously.
On your first two points, again I would think more time to gel together would be beneficial no? Olympic athletes don't train with their partners for a couple of weeks. Yes, they are world class athletes, just like golfers, but that team work takes time to develop. Europe seems to have it in spades, we don't ... maybe one way to foster that is to come out with potential pairings (pods) earlier and let the players take it upon themselves to work out a schedule.
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- #154
I don't buy the giving them a year to know each other's games. Ask them straight up, "what do you want for a second shot?" and go from there. Don't have unreasonable expectations from your partner either. Ask for a yardage you like, then have a couple fall back yardages in case the other can't confidently give you the first. It's not really rocket science, it's playing with a teammate. You just have to actually play as a team instead of whatever garbage they put out there this year in the foursomes.
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Do tell?
Tadashi70
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I'm not sold on the pod theory at all. It seems to be the way they will go but I'm not sold.
I think players that think they might make the team should reach out to one another and play more. Learn each other's games. Push away from the weekly routine a few times a year and pair up in practice rounds.
Tour stops should pair RC hopefuls together so they can see how each other plays in real time. See where they hit it and how they get out.
On off Ryder cup years US hopefully should play more golf overseas. I know the PGA tour might have issue with this but something has to give.
At the end of the day, the best in the world should just flat out play. Zinger and others like to say the pod style worked. When the U.S. won they just flat out hammered those boys with better play. They had fun and made miles of putts.
cpljohnst
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The two main goals of The Pod system were to
1. group players by similar personality.
2. Invest and empower the players in the decision making progress.
I believe Phil thinks those two things will help the US team play better golf. I agree.
Tadashi70
Well-known member
It remains to be seen because I'm sure no matter who the next cap will be, pods will be in place.
I can see the ads now. Three guys climb out of POD that has been forklifted to the first tee, holding hands.
cpljohnst
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Azinger used 4 person pods. He thought about 3 person pods but 4 makes more sense in the RC format. I think it's a sound system. And compared to our rate of success before and since, what the heck does it hurt to try it again.
Harvmp28
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I met a guy who used to party with him, Dustin Johnson style
ryebread
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+1 to EVERY single one of these points individually. I was literally about to write the exact same things.
Pick the team a year in advance, and start pairing them up in tournaments. Make them play practice rounds together every week. Let some of those practice rounds be some of the other formats. Heck, hold some tournaments in those other formats.
Get the captain picked early and make him show up at the events to get to know the players. He needs to ride along (if he's too old to walk) on some of these practice pairings to see how the players work together. He needs to be in the clubhouse to observe dynamics himself. We've been treating the captaincy like an honor and not a job.
There's a lot of ways to improve our performance without hurting these poor "individual contractors" who make millions but would object if anything impacted their pocketbook. I'm letting that one go, but I don't agree with it at all.
ryebread
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Yep, Azinger's going to get book royalties from everyone on both sides. One clear winner will be Azinger.
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- #163
Are you kidding me? Telling independent contractors their travel schedule for an exhibition?
Cmon. Guys go on streaks both good and bad.
Cmon. Guys go on streaks both good and bad.
jhstew1
Idiot Free
on off Ryder Cup years I believe they play the Presidents Cup
Tadashi70
Well-known member
I don't think it will hurt to try it either Barry. my point is nobody talked about the pod system until after the fact and now everybody's bought into it. what if somebody come out and said Lee Trevino's way of doing it was the best way to do it, everybody would be on the Lee Trevino and I just think that it some point time we got to stop looking to gimmicks and get these guys play hard
The RC goes way beyond an exhibition. The big break is an exhibition. They are asked to do team things for week every two years. That is not too much to expect from these guys
We speak of role models and setting good examples. what is the example that these guys are setting when they can't even come together as a team or travel together.
deuce
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The message, I think ... is that they don't care enough. Though I don't think the PGA is doing much to foster an attitude that would lend itself to caring. I admit, I'm an outsider being relatively new to golf ... but if you told me I had to select a team to play for a prestigious trophy, I know for a fact that I wouldn't use the system they currently have in place.
Yeah the old way of doing things worked when we had all the best players in the world and were playing one country across the drink that didn't. Times have changed.
Tadashi70
Well-known member
And smoke those guys bad while having a blast
MOST of those players already know each others games. Rickie has played with Phil before in practice rounds. Keegan plays with Phil during practice rounds. Bubba and Rickie. Furyk and everybody alive. They are supposed to be the cream of the crop, meaning they have probably paired with each other at one time or another on Tour during the weekends. I understand the concept of playing together to learn each others games, but I suspect they already have sufficient knowledge of each others games and personalities long before they get to the Ryder Cup.
~Rock
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- #169
In my opinion you are overthinking it right now. They simply have better players which has been the case for a number of years now. There are ebbs and flows in all competitions. Drastically asking for more out of each is too much
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- #170
I'm not going to dispute they had better players this year. But do you think they have had better players for 8 of the last 10? I used to think it was all just because they had better guys, but I'm starting to think that by saying that I am underthinking the process. I don't know what the answer is. Azingers Pod system worked. But if it didn't we would be talking about it? It worked once, maybe it can again. I think the point process is better now that it used to be, I'd rather have the 4 picks instead of 3. I think there is something to the captaincy about having a plan and having the team on board(which I'm not sure that was there this time).
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I respectfully disagree. Europe has won 8 out of 10 and every one of those that was on European soil. That's beyond just a statistical outlier. That's a clear trend.
Now look at the number of pros, the earnings of the pros, the wins of the pros, and even the rankings of the individual players on the teams. I don't think the European players are clearly better. Our own THP poll here had a significant number of people thinking the US would win based on a lot of these arguments. Our record in singles typically doesn't suggest Europe is clearly better either.
There's something we're not doing right here. Europe seemingly takes it far more seriously than we do, and the results seem to reflect that.
If we're serious about winning, we'll make changes. Many will have to make individual sacrifices, including in their precious pocketbooks and travel schedules. That's what playing a team sport is about -- sacrificing for the self for the benefit of the larger goal of the group. People do this in team sports all the time. They'll move families, take less money, train in the offseason, etc. to be part of a winning organization, or to put their organization in a better position to succeed.
US Golfers need to do the same if we're serious about the Ryder Cup. If we're serious about the Ryder Cup, they'll get on board and make that commitment.
I suspect we aren't serious though and all of this will go away in a month or two. Azinger will probably be the next captain, and we may or may not win it. If Europe is still actually trying as they seemingly have been recently, my money would again be on them.
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Erky
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If I play match play against someone with a 5 handicap, math says I am going to lose most of the time. That doesn't mean I can't win, it just means that it's not very likely. I thought the US could catch lightning in a bottle and win with a slightly weaker team, but they couldn't. This was a weakened US team, missing 3 solid players that could have helped (Woods, DJ, Dufner). At the end of the day, it's the inches and centimeters that add up to victory, and part of that is the team concept, how you buy into it and how you manage it. The captain shares some of the blame, and the players need to shoulder some of the blame. However, as JB pointed out, it's probably simpler than that. For the US team to win, they needed to be greater than the sum of their parts and they weren't.
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- #174
Its a very simple answer that us as fans dont want to hear.
It matters far more to them than it does to us until the very time of the tournament. I have said that many times. You can talk to the players and hear it. A year out, their guys are talking about it and our guys are not.
Forcing the matter to "get a win" does very little other than alienation. If they had won this year with Tiger, DJ and Dufner, its all of the sudden no talk at all about any of the process.
The captain picked the wrong two guys. He had two of the hottest players in the world in front of him, and he chose to go in a different direction for whatever reason. Maybe they had naked pictures of him.
