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Why are benchmarks done at 105 mph?

obedt

obedt

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Have seen that magical 105 mph used by multiple companies.

I remember during our NDA'd talk on the F7/F7+ line, that was the number Cobra used (and has historically used) for club testing.

Bridgestone has been pointing at that particular swing speed for their cut-off for the B330 balls forever.

It's weird for me because most amateurs/consumers don't swing that fast. Is there a scientific reason for having this as the cut-off? I can understand companies wanting to make sure how their product reacts to high SS players, as their tour pros will need to be sure it has been tested for them before gaming the product. Don't understand why a lower SS isn't used for secondary testing.



I saw this on https://www.srixon.com and found it to be very refreshing:
WHAT DIFFERENTIATES Q-STAR TOUR
FROM THE COMPETITION?



LONG, ACCURATE DRIVER DISTANCE

WITH VERY LOW DRIVER SPIN, AND LOW SIDESPIN,
THE Q-STAR TOUR MINIMIZES THE EFFECTS OF HOOKS AND SLICES
SO GOLFERS CAN DRIVE THE BALL WITH MORE ACCURACY.
DRIVER DISPERSION 85 MPH SWING SPEED​
 
It would be pretty cool if they used testing data (that they actually put out there to the public), that referenced even 2 or 3 difference speeds.

Even a 90 & 105 comparison could open things up to comparable results for a lot of different speed players.
 
That's a good question. I hope someone with some knowledge chimes in.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
I believe it's because above that is the avg ss on tour soma thumb below would be the majority of amateurs.
 
obedt said:
Don't understand why a lower SS isn't used for secondary testing.
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Woah woah, are you saying us internet golfers don't all have swing speeds of atleast 105, figure we're all around 118
 
Thank you for calling my swing speed magical :alien:
 
I thought for golf balls the 105 is used to properly compress that type of ball?
 
I will be at Bridgestone HQ next week and will try to get an answer from them.
 
Howzat said:
I will be at Bridgestone HQ next week and will try to get an answer from them.
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Look forward to following along. That's gonna be a ridiculously good trip. I'm sure your head will be spinning but if you get a chance I'd be very interested in their answer.

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
 
obedt said:
Look forward to following along. That's gonna be a ridiculously good trip. I'm sure your head will be spinning but if you get a chance I'd be very interested in their answer.

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Just try to remind me right in that thread on Wednesday. I am sure they will have no problem answering. My guess is that they need to make a distinction somewhere and data/marketing gave them 105. Will be interesting to hear what they say.
 
myndcraft said:
Woah woah, are you saying us internet golfers don't all have swing speeds of atleast 105, figure we're all around 118
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119 since I started Turtle Waxing my shafts.
 
I can't tell you why all companies do it, but I can tell you why a couple of them do.

1. It is only a threshold and benchmark to certain equipment. Meaning internal testing that is done at many different speeds, but more importantly it is done at a higher speed than most amateurs, because it will exaggerate any flaws.

2. It is very close to the number that is average for scratch golfers. Some places say 110 is scratch or better and 100 is at a 5, but internally companies view 105 as the scratch golfer and testing would be done based on that.

3. It is close to the number that the old USGA tested at, which I believe was 105.5 -109 when they tested equipment.
 
The Callaway X2 Hot balls were marketed as designed for swings 90mph and under. The Hot + were 90moh & over...

And many others have different marketing targets...
 
That's great insight JB. Pretty much answered the question.
 
JB said:
I can't tell you why all companies do it, but I can tell you why a couple of them do.

1. It is only a threshold and benchmark to certain equipment. Meaning internal testing that is done at many different speeds, but more importantly it is done at a higher speed than most amateurs, because it will exaggerate any flaws.
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this makes sense to me. faster swing will exaggerate the miss and give more measurable results. and quite honestly maybe even inflate some of those results (e.g. "10 yards longer").

JB said:
2. It is very close to the number that is average for scratch golfers. Some places say 110 is scratch or better and 100 is at a 5, but internally companies view 105 as the scratch golfer and testing would be done based on that.
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this doesn't make sense to me. why focus your testing on less than 1% of the golfing population?

JB said:
3. It is close to the number that the old USGA tested at, which I believe was 105.5 -109 when they tested equipment.
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i guess that's ok. if it ain't broke... or maybe it is broke? i don't know.
 
Thats some good insight JB! I have wondered this myself and never knew why.
 
c.a.eleric said:
this makes sense to me. faster swing will exaggerate the miss and give more measurable results. and quite honestly maybe even inflate some of those results (e.g. "10 yards longer").



this doesn't make sense to me. why focus your testing on less than 1% of the golfing population?



i guess that's ok. if it ain't broke... or maybe it is broke? i don't know.
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If you view it as that is all it is tested at, then the question would make a lot of sense, of course that is not the case though. It is tested at so many different speeds with so many different players. This was about a bench mark number and why so many companies use the 105 as a cut off. The reason being that that is the number at which scratch is viewed actually has a lot of merit in that sense, right?
 
105 is a mythical number in my world
 
I got up to 102 mph once.... once.... on the sim when I was really warmed up and going after it just to see how hard I could swing. I think I normally am between 86 and 94 depending upon how warm it is out.
 
JB said:
If you view it as that is all it is tested at, then the question would make a lot of sense, of course that is not the case though. It is tested at so many different speeds with so many different players. This was about a bench mark number and why so many companies use the 105 as a cut off. The reason being that that is the number at which scratch is viewed actually has a lot of merit in that sense, right?
Click to expand...

well if you define "benchmark" as cutoff, then i agree. i've never heard benchmark defined that way, so i was confused. i assumed benchmark meant, "a standard or point of reference against which things may be compared or assessed." but if that's the top end of how they test, and they test at speeds throughout the spectrum, then it makes a lot of sense.
 
Is it really a correct thing using that number because its where they feel its the dividing line between scratch or not?
I mean firstly there are very many (tons) non scratch players with higher ss's.
Shouldn't it /wouldn't it be more about being a place where as its just a happy medium or middle of the scale for where certain characteristics of club/shaft and/or ball technology is sitting. Perhaps better said, sort of the place where the curve of being advantageous (or not) begins to drop off or begins to pick up? Like for example a lower compression core ball vs a higher compression one such as Bridgestone implies? 105ish might be the point in a curve where it simply becomes more advantageous to go softer core if below and harder core if above only because we reach point of diminishing returns in the given curve for whatever the tech is that's being gauged.
 
Also the average male pro-golfer has a swing speed of 103 - 105 mph. Not touring pro. Pro golfer.
 
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