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Short game: Roll it or hole it?

Tadashi70

Tadashi70

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What do you do more of? Roll it in, as in putting or hole out with your wedges and irons. It's a rhetorical question because I know the anwer. We roll in more putts then we hole out.

If this is the case why are you putting so much air under your short shots around the green. If more balls roll into the hole then get those chip shots rolling like putts sooner.

I see more players carrying their pitches, chips and flops to far into the flag. And this is causing them to score higher. It shouldn't be dumb luck that gets you up and down. The right **** should be played.

Walk up to the green and find your spot that you want to land the ball so it releases to the hole. Choose a club that will give you the trajectory to hit your spot and release toward the hole. I think you'll find your scores are lower and over time confidence will be higher.
 
some solid advice right there
 
I'm starting to learn. Leaving the 58* in the bag in favor of the 54*. I get more of a quick stop and roll than I do with the 58. I'd like to get more comfortable with the 50 and PW and see what results I get from them as well.
 
I go with the "Get the ball on the green and let it roll to the hole"
Getting the ball on the green has less chance of something going wrong.

Damage control, playing the safe shot...
Whatever! As long as it minimizes mistakes I'm all for it!
 
Does anyone go up to a chip shot with the thought they will just straight hole out from say 10 yards? That's an honest question because I've never heard of that mindset.
 
cbaker2882 said:
Does anyone go up to a chip shot with the thought they will just straight hole out from say 10 yards? That's an honest question because I've never heard of that mindset.
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Yup #MatchPlay
 
ddec said:
Yup #MatchPlay
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I took it as hole out like mid air dunk it. I go up to every chip shot I have with the mentality that it has a chance to go in. "Hole it or roll it" to me both sound like they are going into the cup at the end, just the hole it sounds to me like the person is planning on dunking it instead of letting it roll in.
 
cbaker2882 said:
Does anyone go up to a chip shot with the thought they will just straight hole out from say 10 yards? That's an honest question because I've never heard of that mindset.
Click to expand...

If its a good lie I know I have rolled them in before and I at least try and chase it by the hole to give it a chance.
 
cbaker2882 said:
I took it as hole out like mid air dunk it. I go up to every chip shot I have with the mentality that it has a chance to go in. "Hole it or roll it" to me both sound like they are going into the cup at the end, just the hole it sounds to me like the person is planning on dunking it instead of letting it roll in.
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mid air dunk. No, that mindset never for me.
 
Absolutely agree Freddie.

A wise man with the initials "JB" once told me that a good short game wasn't about being able to hit the Phil Mickelson flop. It was about getting the ball to the hole on the most direct path possible. Ever since then, if I can putt it, I putt it. If I can chip with a low lofted club and let it roll, I do so. And my short game has benefited from it.
 
ddec said:
mid air dunk. No, that mindset never for me.
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haha, right. That's what I was saying. Maybe that's not what Freddie means but that's how I read it.
 
over the last several months i have been working on the roll it vs hole it. My short game was very inconsistent with trying to fly the ball to the hole. after a lesson with my instructor he pointed out this flaw to me and proceeded to demonstrate by seeing who could get closer to a pin 25' away. he holed his with an 8i and mine came up short with a 48*.

since switching to the roll it method i have had better scores and have been getting closer to the hole more consistently.
 
I don't think its the idea of a "slam dunk" from 10 yards. I think people really do not know what the best option is for short shots. They play with one club, a 58* or 60* and that really only leaves you one option. A high lofted pitch toward the hole. I think the idea that it will land soft and stay close in the backs of their minds.
cbaker2882 said:
Does anyone go up to a chip shot with the thought they will just straight hole out from say 10 yards? That's an honest question because I've never heard of that mindset.
Click to expand...
 
emart2173 said:
over the last several months i have been working on the roll it vs hole it. My short game was very inconsistent with trying to fly the ball to the hole. after a lesson with my instructor he pointed out this flaw to me and proceeded to demonstrate by seeing who could get closer to a pin 25' away. he holed his with an 8i and mine came up short with a 48*.

since switching to the roll it method i have had better scores and have been getting closer to the hole more consistently.
Click to expand...

IMO, there's a reason almost every pro on the planet advocates this approach. Even the few tour pros I've seen who say "I fly everything to the hole with my 60," are quick to point out that's not what the average golfer should be doing, and they themselves wouldn't be doing it that way if they weren't tour pros who practice short game 4 hours a day.
 
Tadashi70 said:
I don't think its the idea of a "slam dunk" from 10 yards. I think people really do not know what the best option is for short shots. They play with one club, a 58* or 60* and that really only leaves you one option. A high lofted pitch toward the hole. I think the idea that it will land soft and stay close in the backs of their minds.
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I gotcha. That makes sense. Sometimes the 58* is the play, but I agree that far too many people use it for everything
 
JB is rare breed when it comes to short game. He has great hand/eye coordination and can really spin it. If he played more his short game would be even better. It's already solid but more reps means better play. He is one of the few guys I polay with that I have no questions about his shot selection or club of choice. I see others I play with struggle with straight forward chips and pitches. These are guys that can play but never work on the short game or try to understand the best way to score.
wadesworld said:
Absolutely agree Freddie.

A wise man with the initials "JB" once told me that a good short game wasn't about being able to hit the Phil Mickelson flop. It was about getting the ball to the hole on the most direct path possible. Ever since then, if I can putt it, I putt it. If I can chip with a low lofted club and let it roll, I do so. And my short game has benefited from it.
Click to expand...
 
I agree with this, and my preferred shot is to get it rolling quickly, but that's only really good when you can land it on the green and have it roll from there. What about extending it back to 30-50y? This is my trouble spot in terms of getting it close. I find the makeup of the fairways makes it unpredictable to determine how it will react. Here is an example.

We play bent grass up here almost exclusively. I can be sure that if I land a low trajectory shot on the fairway I will get bounce and roll. The only variable would be undulations in the fairway but I know how the shot should roll out. In Branson, it was zoysia grass. I had a shot about 40y out and I thought I would land it about 10y short and have it bounce onto the green. I hit a chip with my 9i and it was looking to be almost perfect. Then once it landed it bounced straight up and died right there. About the last thing I expected that to do. When I got to the ball, the ground felt very springy, like the grass would absorb the impact and kill the shot (which it did). I tried that shot 3 more times on three different holes and got the same result. With the greens being really quick I was effectively screwed out of my best short game shot. I had to try flying it closer and pray that it wouldn't roll off the opposite side of the green. I had almost no luck in that.

So yes getting it on the ground is a good rule of thumb, as long as the course supports it.
 
For most the 58* is never the play. These high lofted clubs are made to carry objects and land softly due the loft and spin the impart on the ball. I know a few will dispute this and say they are good with their 58*. I ll be honest I can count on one hand the number of guys I have seen that are proficient with the lob wedges of the world. I know tour pros that screw up when they grab their lob.

I realize I have played with a very small percentage of golfers but the story always seem to be the same, I see more shots spilled around the green then I do off the tee and 2nd shots.
cbaker2882 said:
I gotcha. That makes sense. Sometimes the 58* is the play, but I agree that far too many people use it for everything
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Freddie - I've been trying to do this a bit more, but can you elaborate a bit more? I've been using my PW and GW a bit more around the green, after realizing I was doing myself no favors with the 58. This year, I've even started chipping a bit more with my 7/8/9 when I'm on/near the fringe and there's a bit of space between me and the hole but it's not a situation where putting is conducive - fringe is really bumpy, there's a sprinkler head, or something like that. Is this something you'd suggest?
 
This is a good one. I definitely used to try and get too much air under it to limit the roll out, but I've learned reading the green quickly like a putt and letting it roll longer is much better.
 
After taking the Pelz class a couple months ago, my short game is SO much better and he teaches exactly the same thing. Get the ball rolling asap in most cases. I've never been more confident around the greens.
 
Tadashi70 said:
What do you do more of? Roll it in, as in putting or hole out with your wedges and irons. It's a rhetorical question because I know the anwer. We roll in more putts then we hole out.

If this is the case why are you putting so much air under your short shots around the green. If more balls roll into the hole then get those chip shots rolling like putts sooner.

I see more players carrying their pitches, chips and flops to far into the flag. And this is causing them to score higher. It shouldn't be dumb luck that gets you up and down. The right **** should be played.

Walk up to the green and find your spot that you want to land the ball so it releases to the hole. Choose a club that will give you the trajectory to hit your spot and release toward the hole. I think you'll find your scores are lower and over time confidence will be higher.
Click to expand...
I struggle with being 5 to 10 yards off the side near the front (usually) of the green with a short pin placement (leaving only 10 to 20 feet of green before pin). Usually it is not flat, mounds are usually in the way for me, preventing a simple bump chip. The shot usually requires to land a little blooper off the backside of the mound and hope you get near pin. Usually I actually land it too far in and roll off to the fringe on otherside.

Another issue is finding g myself just off fringe looking at a downhill facing green and a fairly close pin placement. What then? Try to putt out of rough? Almost always requires too much power...this is my most yippable chipping scenario as well.

I should just be happy I got my approach near the green, but you know ow always something to stress on!

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk
 
I coach high school golf and this is the hardest thing to convince them of. I love in practice when they all try green side shots with a 60 and I pull out the 52 and put it two feet from the hole. So much easier to pick a spot and hit it
 
I have to agree on a personal level. I was using my sand and lob wedge a lot abound the green and constantly putting it way to short or to far. Now I use my Gap wedge and just try to get close so i can putt easier. I have holed out from chipping 3 times in my life, and I seem to get a lot luckier with 30 foot putts than 30 ft chips.
 
wadesworld said:
Absolutely agree Freddie.

A wise man with the initials "JB" once told me that a good short game wasn't about being able to hit the Phil Mickelson flop. It was about getting the ball to the hole on the most direct path possible. Ever since then, if I can putt it, I putt it. If I can chip with a low lofted club and let it roll, I do so. And my short game has benefited from it.
Click to expand...

Well said! JB is so right. This is me as well. Inside of 75 yards, I have been know to use every club in my bag, just depending on the situation. Nothing is cut and dried.
 
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