And so...what is the state of golf at this past end of 2015??

All aspects of golf. Interest in the sport, rounds played, equipment purchased as well as courses closed (or opened). Do you think it declines, did it stay status quo, or did it pick up a little??

I really don't know the answer to this question. I tried searching for some info but failed to come up with any real sound info worth much.

As for closings, I think its fair to say the big decline (or exodus) which forced closings would by simple default level off some. That doesn't have to mean things got better but just that the biggest clump of course closings has already taken place so with fewer courses remaining obviously fewer closures would take place. Just that imo one cant view fewer closings (If there were fewer closing) as a sign that golf is increasing because it may only been by default and relative to only the exodus period.

But have more than normal opened? and at what levels? public, privates, high end , whatever.
Equipment and all related golf attire, accessories, everything. Where did (does) golf stand as a whole in 2015 vs 2014?

we've seen negative things like Dicks and sport authority dwindle sections and efforts and other golf specific stores close locally. But all of this kind of business is caused from results of the years prior. So even that stuff is not always a very current tell tail sign of the state of things.

If things are somewhat better is it due to popularity of the current/next generation of tour players grabbing the interest of the masses? Is it the economy mildly improved over last couple years? And I'm not sure it even is.
If things are somewhat status quo or worse, is that still economy driven or lack of interest at the tour level?

So just where/what is the state of golf at end of 2015 vs past couple years? and while we begin another new year?

Your opinions, facts, info, or just good conversation about it is all is encouraged.

We had a 30 year old course close about 12 miles from my home in 2014. Now a farm field. We have another course that opened 50 years ago (Arbor Trace) that is for sale. If a buyer is not found this year, it will go to auction and it is in an area of BIG farmers, so it is possible it could return to farm land.

My home course has seen play drop 10 to 15 percent over the past 3 to 4 years. The club house is stocking less and less goods thanks to the internet and discount golf shop sites. I know the course's are hurting in our area.

I think the professional game is strong with so many very good young players and the PGA Tour is rolling in the money. I have lost almost total respect for the USGA because of groove rule change, the anchored putter change and now the score posting change. Wait until they change the golf ball specs. The rules of golf need to be simplified. The decisions book now weighs 10 pounds and there was a time it was part of the rules book and you could carry it in your pocket.

The OEM's are releasing clubs at record rates and the depreciation in value of clubs is alarming. You can buy a $400 driver at Golfsmith and it is worth $100 as soon as you swipe your card. I hope I'm wrong, but I see the golf club industry following the auto industry (only there will be no bail out). I know I'm done buying new clubs. Just wait a year and then buy them.

HoosierGolfer said:

We had a 30 year old course close about ...................

Click to expand...

Without copying your whole post. So you feel its still declining among the general pubic.
Interesting though how you say farmland taking over. That's an industry that has lost and sold more land through the years than just about anything so in one sense more farm land is good for the economy. But we are not talking farming so yet we have another couple course closures.

The score posting change is ridiculous and shows just how out of touch with reality the general masses the usga is. They are clearly only concerned with the elite and are failing in responsibility towards the greater good. But I don't think things lie this are biggest reasons for making or breaking golf among participation of the masses. Though its certainly not helping the cause.

I'm on the board of my home course and I know membership and daily play is down. The game lives and dies with our youth and if we don't bring more kids to the game, who is going to be on the course in 10, 20 or 30 years? There are just too many other things in life today for the kids to do, than when I was a kid (1960's).

Golf is hard. Period. The USGA just makes it harder for us (99.9% of the 65 million golfers worldwide) while changing the rules based totally on the professional game which is played by only 0.01% of the worlds golfers.

I'm sorry, but it I think it is long past due for tour only rules and rules for the rest of us. Time to lift the USGA limits on clubs for the masses. Make the game easier, faster and more fun. Maybe that will draw new players.

Our PGA Teaching Pro has been teaching since the mid 1960's. There was a time he says when he would give first time lessons to kids (I was one of them) and they would return and play and continue to take lessons. Today, he says he is seeing only about 1 out of 10 coming back for more lessons and staying with the game. That is sad. Golf is a great game. My best friends have come from golf. My best memories of family time is partly from golf with my parents. Time have and are changing.

HoosierGolfer said:

I'm on the board of my home course and I know membership and daily play is down. The game lives and dies with our youth and if we don't bring more kids to the game, who is going to be on the course in 10, 20 or 30 years? There are just too many other things in life today for the kids to do, than when I was a kid (1960's).

Click to expand...

Everything I've seen says junior golf is seeing unprecedented levels of participation.

Golf is hard. Period. The USGA just makes it harder for us (99.9% of the 65 million golfers worldwide) while changing the rules based totally on the professional game which is played by only 0.01% of the worlds golfers.

I'm sorry, but it I think it is long past due for tour only rules and rules for the rest of us. Time to lift the USGA limits on clubs for the masses. Make the game easier, faster and more fun. Maybe that will draw new players.

Click to expand...

I'm confused. If you want to roll the ball over, drop where it was lost, carry 27 clubs, or pick up 5-footers, what's stopping you from doing so? If you find making up your own rules makes it more fun, do it. There's no USGA rules police that are going to arrest you. If a new golfer wants to tee off from the 150-yard marker (as I did when I was little), they should. If you want to anchor a putter or use a square-grooved wedge, stick it in your bag.

If you want to have a "use any number of clubs you want" and "automatic two-putt" tournament at your club, do it. There's absolutely no requirement you play by the rules unless you're in a serious tournament or posting a handicap.

I don't know how anyone thinks building a new course is a smart play right now when there are a ton for sale that you can get for like 20% of what it cost to build. Buy, improve, rebrand and cross our fingers

ntanygd760 said:

I don't know how anyone thinks building a new course is a smart play right now when there are a ton for sale that you can get for like 20% of what it cost to build. Buy, improve, rebrand and cross our fingers

Click to expand...

But they still do it. Demographics is partly one reason. Places where populations are building and course were few. Or places where the average financial state of the population is of higher status than others (basically more people can afford to golf and do so a lot). Or places where golf is on a popularity increase and more in demand even though overall across the board it has been or was dropping. There are always exceptions to the norm with just about anything. And then of course there are just plain old questionable, bad, or even dishonorable decisions. Investors, banks, corporate, deals and decisions that make absolutely no sense towards the greater good of anything except to fill the pockets of those involved even if the end result is a failure. How often have we seen that in just about any big business? put perhaps off topic and for another thread with that very last part , but none the less with all the above there can be enough reasons why a new course would open while others close or remain dormant. And also why it wouldn't make sense to rebuild an existing one for those very same reasons. Especially demographics.

wadesworld said:

Everything I've seen says junior golf is seeing unprecedented levels of participation.


I'm confused. If you want to roll the ball over, drop where it was lost, carry 27 clubs, or pick up 5-footers, what's stopping you from doing so? If you find making up your own rules makes it more fun, do it. There's no USGA rules police that are going to arrest you. If a new golfer wants to tee off from the 150-yard marker (as I did when I was little), they should. If you want to anchor a putter or use a square-grooved wedge, stick it in your bag.

If you want to have a "use any number of clubs you want" and "automatic two-putt" tournament at your club, do it. There's absolutely no requirement you play by the rules unless you're in a serious tournament or posting a handicap.

Click to expand...

As for junior golf? that's good to hear.

As for rules and such, I agree with you. I have said this same thing many times whenever we discuss why people don't play and use rules and conformity as an excuse. The truth is that most people do not play official events nor do most people even run a handicap. I been playing for many years and mostly as a single for the past 15 and yet most people I am placed with do not participate in any official type of golf nor run a handicap. Granted its mostly on the weekends but thats when most rounds are played by most people. But even during the week I have done quite enough golf and (while a little more percentage are more greatly involved) but still far the majority not. Its just a fun recreation of choice for most people who play the game and that majority is huge. And one of the beautiful things about golf is that none of that majority have to follow any rules they don't want to. Can play however they want and play with whatever they want. Sure, there are turnoffs for those more officially involved and some of that stuff takes some of the enjoyment out of it for us. But that amount is very far from most people and is not why the general masses as a whole ever quit playing or chose not to play. Heck, even many people who do run a handicap often circumnavigate rules on a daily basis or don't even know them all correctly and therefore are not as bothered by them.