Off Course is back this week with a fantastic show and this is episode 180. Hosted by Dan Edwards, each Friday he gives you a deep look into the world of golf and equipment in a way unlike any other podcast has done before. Today, Michael Vrska, Director of Custom Fitting and Player Performance at Callaway Golf, joins the show.
It wouldn’t be Off Course without some tangents, but Dan and Michael take a deep dive on all things fitting including when is the best time to get fit. This show has a lot going on and is one you will not want to miss as Michael Vrska goes Off Course.

Episode 180 is here and Dan and Michael discuss the following topics.
Fitting on Good Strikes vs Okay Strikes
Iron Design Closing the Fitting Gap
Best Time to Get Fit
Wedge Selection and Max Loft
And so much more
You can listen to the show right here, Apple Podcasts or anywhere you do your listening and downloading from. Search for the Hackers Paradise and make sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. After listening, come back over and drop us a note below on what you agree and/or disagree with from the episode. If you get a chance, drop us a review wherever you listen from and let others know what you think of the show and/or channel.
THPGolf · Michael Vrska Goes Off Course
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Can’t wait to fire up this episode later this evening, when [USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] talks, I listen! We’re blessed to have all his knowledge and experience here on THP, I’ve learned so much from what he’s posted here. Really looking forward to the Grandaddy in December!
Still not up on Apple pods so I will be listening on Soundcloud in about a half hour!
Had to wait to listen until later in the afternoon. Really enjoyed this podcast, especially the discussion about fittings. I always enjoy learning more about the fitting process.
Listening now, already fun right from the intro. :LOL:
What a great listen today!!! Cannot wait to meet Vrska come December!
I thought the toe hang experimentation talk was really interesting. That must be why I don’t get along with the Odyssey #9 putters!!
This is a great discussion. Very interesting talk about the “short sets”, and then working around them with more tailored solutions to fill out the bag.
[USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] needs his own podcast. I could listen to him talk gear and golf all day.
Laughing at [USER=2320]@Canadan[/USER]’s annual mallet struggle session coming into the discussion. :LOL:
[QUOTE=”BigMac, post: 11867587, member: 3386″]
Laughing at [USER=2320]@Canadan[/USER]’s annual mallet struggle session coming into the discussion. :LOL:
[/QUOTE]
it’s a celebration, every time.
[QUOTE=”mikeg_74, post: 11867585, member: 15992″]
[USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] needs his own podcast. I could listen to him talk gear and golf all day.
[/QUOTE]
So good.
That was fun. “Go get fit. Unless you’re playing bad. Then go get a lesson.” Ouch, that hurt a little. My last four rounds have been pretty bad and I just got fit last weekend. It’s like you guys were talking directly to me. ?? To be fair it’s just a new course but it had me laughing.
“Year of the flatstick”is a pretty intriguing proclamation, can’t wait to find out more about “alleged” new putters. Allegedly.
Good listen, he seems like a great guy. Love his find what works and stick with it mentality.
Firing this one up now. Should be a great listen.
Thanks to you two for keeping me company from Vic to just outside Louisville yesterday. Was a great listen and I’m envious of 70° year round.
This Off Course got me thinking about wedge set up and I’ve decided to change it up. Going to to 50, 54, & 58 in the bag. So that means out I go to dial in some distances!!! #GarageSIMCrew
[QUOTE=”BigMac, post: 11867616, member: 3386″]
“Year of the flatstick”is a pretty intriguing proclamation, can’t wait to find out more about “alleged” new putters. Allegedly.
[/QUOTE]
Yeah that definitely caught my attention. I am loving my verso, but really interested as to what’s coming next.
[QUOTE=”Jeff Spicoli, post: 11868565, member: 10545″]
Yeah that definitely caught my attention. I am loving my verso, but really interested as to what’s coming next.
[/QUOTE]
I may have scoured the Ryder Cup coverage this morning. ?
[QUOTE=”Mmaynard11, post: 11868581, member: 19877″]
I may have scoured the Ryder Cup coverage this morning. ?
[/QUOTE]
#research
Listened to this today. Great listen.
[QUOTE=”Jeff Spicoli, post: 11867949, member: 10545″]
Firing this one up now. Should be a great listen.
[/QUOTE]
Should. Good luck! 😉 ?????
[QUOTE=”Templet0n, post: 11868601, member: 53139″]
Listened to this today. Great listen.
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[IMG alt=”Game Show Thank You GIF by Kinda Funny”]https://media2.giphy.com/media/RipfZWzjUDH25euMpM/200.gif[/IMG]
[QUOTE=”Mmaynard11, post: 11868581, member: 19877″]
I may have scoured the Ryder Cup coverage this morning. ?
[/QUOTE]
That was my plan after I got back from playing 9. I just plopped down on the couch so I can check out what’s gonna make 2024 the year of the flatstick.
Can’t wait to hear more about the putters in January. It looks like the tech story is gonna be a fun one for the staff writers to get excited about.
going to listen to this soon
[QUOTE=”hackitup, post: 11869277, member: 42140″]
Can’t wait to hear more about the putters in January. It looks like the tech story is gonna be a fun one for the staff writers to get excited about.
[/QUOTE]
January? Maybe sooner? :unsure::unsure::unsure:
[QUOTE=”Mmaynard11, post: 11867211, member: 19877″]
I have a few…should I keep them or fire away!!!
[/QUOTE]
[IMG alt=”Running Late Jodie Sweetin GIF by Fuller House”]https://media3.giphy.com/media/l2QZPujIz4rnop3Xi/200.gif[/IMG]
Sunday afternoons. Perfect chill time to chat after church.
Ok [USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] so what are your thoughts about a 11.5 handicap going Triple Play with the Apex Pro line?
[QUOTE=”Mmaynard11, post: 11870275, member: 19877″]
Ok [USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] so what are your thoughts about a 11.5 handicap going Triple Play with the Apex Pro line?
[/QUOTE]
I really, Really, REALLY don’t like to fit based on handicap as there are lots of ways to be an 11.5 handicap. Based on the data I’ve seen, there can be up to a 10 “shot” swing between the best and worst in a handicap group…. i.e. the best 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 2 handicapper, while the worst 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 21 handicapper, with plenty of variance in between.
So, if iron/approach play and/or ball striking is your weakness, I would generally suggest something with more forgiveness than the Apex Pro series. Something like Apex or Paradym may be a better fit. However, if your driving, short game and/or putting are weaknesses and ball striking is a strength, then the Apex Pro series may be great for you, assuming your speed/launch/spin profile provides adequate distance and gapping. Very possible.
Finally got to listen to this one today, and would have listened to the 2 or 6 hour version as wll ?
I love the idea of fitting for a distance and need. It simply makes sense. And since there are so many ways to get a particular distance nowadays, I think fitting helps find the right option.
And the wedge talk was really informative. Off Course has been on fire lately, way to go [USER=2320]@Canadan[/USER] !
I always catch up on the rides to and from work. May have to listen early for the wedge talk. I’m thinking about consolidating my 54 and 58 into a 56. I do most everything with the 54 anyways and the 58 costs me more than it helps.
[QUOTE=”vgolfman, post: 11870447, member: 24739″]
I really, Really, REALLY don’t like to fit based on handicap as there are lots of ways to be an 11.5 handicap. Based on the data I’ve seen, there can be up to a 10 “shot” swing between the best and worst in a handicap group…. i.e. the best 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 2 handicapper, while the worst 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 21 handicapper, with plenty of variance in between.
So, if iron/approach play and/or ball striking is your weakness, I would generally suggest something with more forgiveness than the Apex Pro series. Something like Apex or Paradym may be a better fit. However, if your driving, short game and/or putting are weaknesses and ball striking is a strength, then the Apex Pro series may be great for you, assuming your speed/launch/spin profile provides adequate distance and gapping. Very possible.
[/QUOTE]
Such a great explanation on how to be open minded in a fitting. Most people have the mindset to play a certain profile based on their handicap. Great stuff!!!
Looking forward to listening tomorrow morning during my drive.
[QUOTE=”vgolfman, post: 11870447, member: 24739″]
I really, Really, REALLY don’t like to fit based on handicap as there are lots of ways to be an 11.5 handicap. Based on the data I’ve seen, there can be up to a 10 “shot” swing between the best and worst in a handicap group…. i.e. the best 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 2 handicapper, while the worst 11.5 handicapper iron players may have an approach game similar to an average 21 handicapper, with plenty of variance in between.
So, if iron/approach play and/or ball striking is your weakness, I would generally suggest something with more forgiveness than the Apex Pro series. Something like Apex or Paradym may be a better fit. However, if your driving, short game and/or putting are weaknesses and ball striking is a strength, then the Apex Pro series may be great for you, assuming your speed/launch/spin profile provides adequate distance and gapping. Very possible.
[/QUOTE]
As someone who aspires to play the pro line and knowing approach is my biggest weakness this post was eye opening.
[QUOTE=”hedley_lamarr08, post: 11870542, member: 37622″]
I always catch up on the rides to and from work. May have to listen early for the wedge talk. I’m thinking about consolidating my 54 and 58 into a 56. I do most everything with the 54 anyways and the 58 costs me more than it helps.
[/QUOTE]
Did I already answer your question on the tweeter machine?
[MEDIA=twitter]1718821646583382121[/MEDIA]
[MEDIA=twitter]1718835531533156477[/MEDIA]
[USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] I currently play a 44 degree PW and have a 6 degree gap to my 50 degree wedge. Would you recommend bending it one degree stronger or going 48, 52, 56, 60 and dropping an iron/hybrid on the top end?
2023 performance average is below.
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”IMG_20231029_230218.jpg”]9217678[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”IMG_20231029_230242.jpg”]9217679[/ATTACH]
Great episode. [USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] constantly drops knowledge in every conversation
[QUOTE=”vgolfman, post: 11870618, member: 24739″]
Did I already answer your question on the tweeter machine?
[MEDIA=twitter]1718821646583382121[/MEDIA]
[MEDIA=twitter]1718835531533156477[/MEDIA]
[/QUOTE]
You did. ? thanks. I’m presently looking at lower bounce wedges for the 58
Very enjoyable listen. I’m down for part 2 of this conversation.
[QUOTE=”Ludin, post: 11870627, member: 50957″]
[USER=24739]@vgolfman[/USER] I currently play a 44 degree PW and have a 6 degree gap to my 50 degree wedge. Would you recommend bending it one degree stronger or going 48, 52, 56, 60 and dropping an iron/hybrid on the top end?
2023 performance average is below.
[/QUOTE]
First, LOVE the on course data.
Second, great job with the driver. ???
Third, this is a complicated question and while the on course data is very helpful, what I’m about to propose could change, even dramatically, based on additional information that would come from a pre-fit interview, like… Is that all shots? Just quality shots? If so, how were those defined? Are partial wedges filtered out? What are your real, measured lengths and lofts now? Do you love all of your clubs? It would be great to see how often the clubs are used. Is that all rounds played? If so, how does that compare to the last 8 or 10 rounds?
Fourth, buckle up and here goes… I think the biggest issues in your gapping is combination of the 3-wood going too short and the 8-iron, 9-iron and PW going too long, though there are some other anomalies as well. You clearly have some speed if you are hitting driver 277 yards and a PW 141. However, your 3-wood “only” goes 235, which creates a very small 9 yard gap between it and your hybrid.
> In the chart below I assumed your 106 yard 54w is ideal. Don’t know if that’s true, but I have to start with something. The first way I broke it down is just with the irons, so basically made 4-iron through 54w gap evenly. As you will see below, to get that to work, your 5-iron through PW need to go SHORTER (anything inside of 3 yards is typically “close enough”, which is why 4 yard or more differences are highlighted in yellow).
> Looking at your 3-wood as OK now (again, seems like you are leaving something on the table there though), your current gaps are a little better, but not much and again, in most cases you should want many clubs to go shorter, not longer.
> The numbers on the far right are my best guess of what I would do if you came in for a full bag fitting. We would look to get that 3-wood spaced out. The rest of the top of your bag looks pretty darn good and not many changes would be needed, but when we get to the irons, I would look at less tech (no idea what you are playing now), lofts and/or lengths to those gapping move evenly, with any bigger gaps at the top of the bag, not with short clubs/wedges which are more pertinent to scoring.
> Even with all that, it is possible that your driver and 7-iron through wedges great and its a contact issue with the longer clubs and THAT should be the fix. If so, ignore most of what I wrote above. Again, I LOVE on course data, but more context would be needed before I would ask you or anyone to pull out their credit card.
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”1698687822128.png”]9217757[/ATTACH]
Still, I hope this helps!
[QUOTE=”vgolfman, post: 11871493, member: 24739″]
First, LOVE the on course data.
Second, great job with the driver. ???
Third, this is a complicated question and while the on course data is very helpful, what I’m about to propose could change, even dramatically, based on additional information that would come from a pre-fit interview, like… Is that all shots? Just quality shots? If so, how were those defined? Are partial wedges filtered out? What are you real, measured lengths and lofts now? Do you love all of your clubs? It would be great to see how often the clubs are used. Is that all rounds played? If so, how does that compare to the last 8 or 10 rounds?
Fourth, buckle up and here goes… I think the biggest issues in your gapping is combination of the 3-wood going too short and the 8-iron, 9-iorn and PW going too long, though there are some other anomalies as well. You clearly have some speed if you are hitting driver 277 yards and a PW 141. However, your 3-wood “only” goes 235, which creates a very small 9 yard gap between it and your hybrid.
> In the chart below I assumed your 106 yard 54w is ideal. Don’t know if that’s true, but I have to start with something. The first way I broke it down is just with the irons, so basically made 4-iron through 54w gap evenly. As you will see below, to get that to work, your 5-iron through PW need to go SHORTER (anything side of 3 yards is typically “close enough”, which is why 4 yard or more differences are highlighted in yellow).
> Looking at your 3-wood as OK now (again, seems like you are leaving something on the table there though), your current gaps are a little better, but not much and again, in most cases you should want many clubs to go shorter, not longer.
> The numbers on the far right are my best guess of what I would do if you came in for a full bag fitting. We would look to get that 3-wood spaced out. The rest of the top of your bag looks pretty darn good an not many changes would be needed, but when we get to the irons, I would look at less tech (no idea what you are playing now), lofts and/or lengths to those gapping move evenly, with any bigger gaps at the top of the bag, not with short clubs/wedges which are more pertinent to scoring.
> Even with all that, it is possible that your driver and 7-iron through wedges great and its a contact issue with the longer clubs and THAT should be the fix. If so, ignore most of what I wrote above. Again, I LOVE on course data, but more context would be needed before I would ask you or anyone to pull out their credit card.
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”1698684788394.png”]9217751[/ATTACH]
Still, I hope this helps!
[/QUOTE]
Very cool post.
It just doesn’t get any better than that
that’s the power of THP right there
[QUOTE=”vgolfman, post: 11871493, member: 24739″]
First, LOVE the on course data.
Second, great job with the driver. ???
Third, this is a complicated question and while the on course data is very helpful, what I’m about to propose could change, even dramatically, based on additional information that would come from a pre-fit interview, like… Is that all shots? Just quality shots? If so, how were those defined? Are partial wedges filtered out? What are your real, measured lengths and lofts now? Do you love all of your clubs? It would be great to see how often the clubs are used. Is that all rounds played? If so, how does that compare to the last 8 or 10 rounds?
Fourth, buckle up and here goes… I think the biggest issues in your gapping is combination of the 3-wood going too short and the 8-iron, 9-iron and PW going too long, though there are some other anomalies as well. You clearly have some speed if you are hitting driver 277 yards and a PW 141. However, your 3-wood “only” goes 235, which creates a very small 9 yard gap between it and your hybrid.
> In the chart below I assumed your 106 yard 54w is ideal. Don’t know if that’s true, but I have to start with something. The first way I broke it down is just with the irons, so basically made 4-iron through 54w gap evenly. As you will see below, to get that to work, your 5-iron through PW need to go SHORTER (anything inside of 3 yards is typically “close enough”, which is why 4 yard or more differences are highlighted in yellow).
> Looking at your 3-wood as OK now (again, seems like you are leaving something on the table there though), your current gaps are a little better, but not much and again, in most cases you should want many clubs to go shorter, not longer.
> The numbers on the far right are my best guess of what I would do if you came in for a full bag fitting. We would look to get that 3-wood spaced out. The rest of the top of your bag looks pretty darn good and not many changes would be needed, but when we get to the irons, I would look at less tech (no idea what you are playing now), lofts and/or lengths to those gapping move evenly, with any bigger gaps at the top of the bag, not with short clubs/wedges which are more pertinent to scoring.
> Even with all that, it is possible that your driver and 7-iron through wedges great and its a contact issue with the longer clubs and THAT should be the fix. If so, ignore most of what I wrote above. Again, I LOVE on course data, but more context would be needed before I would ask you or anyone to pull out their credit card.
[ATTACH type=”full” alt=”1698687822128.png”]9217757[/ATTACH]
Still, I hope this helps!
[/QUOTE]
So incredibly thankful for your detailed response! Lots of great information to digest and figure out a path forward.